Islam Under Scrutiny by Ex-Muslims

India needs a new anti-Islamofascist, anti-Hindutva political front

by Shabana Muhammad

09 Jan, 2008

It is an open secret that all major political parties in India except one or two have a pro-Islamofascist agenda. The parties, which aren’t pro-Islamofascist, have a pro-Hindutva agenda. Hindu fascism might be bit better than Islamofascism, but what 21st century India needs is a truly secular democracy.
 
People of India are caught between the devil and the sea. The choice is between Islamofascism and Hindu fascism. Indian media actively educate people the dangers of Hindu fascism. The same media, in the name of secularism, propagate Islamofascism.
 
Some 82% of the Indian population consists of Hindus. Media has very deceitfully taken away the pride from the Hindus. A Hindu is made to believe that his/her religion is very inferior to other religions. Hindu fascists exploit this situation quite effectively. They simply reverse the process. With fiery speeches, Hindu fascists try to instill some pride among the Hindus.
 
The whole affair has made Hindus appear like clowns before the world. They have proven before the whole world that they are spineless when they parted 33% of their land to 15% of the population [mainly Muslims] during partition of the country in 1947.
 
The Hindu fascists on the other hand have a spine but have a 12th-century outlook. In India it is difficult to find a Hindu who has a 21st century outlook, and at the same time, opposes Islamofascism.
 
In any democracy, when existing political parties don’t rise up to the expectations of the people, new parties do spring up. India will also witness the birth of new political parties within less than a decade if the present parties don’t change their policies.
 
The congress-led pro-Islamofascist front should leave their minority appeasement and should work towards true secularism. This is very unlikely to happen. Throughout the history, congress has been a spineless Muslim-appeasing party.
 
The second option is that the BJP should shed its Hindutva image and become an anti–Islamofascist party. A party needn’t be Hindu fascist to become anti-Islamofascist. BJP should realize that we are living in 21st century. BJP should be willing to accept modernization with both hands. India is the second fastest growing economy in the world. Middle class as well as the upper middle class has greatly benefited from this.
 
The newfound wealth has drawn the Indian population towards western culture. The influence of western culture is evident in Indian film industry as well as Indian satellite television channels. India has got the fourth largest English speaking population in the world.
 
BJP should give up their hatred towards western culture. It is a policy of the BJP to impose Indian culture on the Indians. If the Indian youth opt for western culture to Indian culture, BJP should accept it as a matter of fact. India has got more than 50 million Christians. BJP should give up the hatred towards Christians. They should engage all other minority religious groups, the Christians, Sikhs, and Buddhists, in the fight against Islamofascism. These should the dreams of all well-meaning Indians, since all these groups will be the loser if Islamofascists become the winner.
 
The Congress party will never change the policy of minority appeasement. It won’t be easy for the BJP to become a truly modernist secular but anti-Islamofascist party either. In a multi-party democracy people can’t be taken for a ride for a long time. A  third front, a truly secular and liberal democratic party, has got some space here which it should capitalize on.
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Comment:

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  • Name: antimod
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 07:08:16 -0700

Comment

The writer lives in a fool's paradise when she writes hindus think their religion inferior to her islam. The hindu always respected other religions as well. But the advent of idolators destroyed this myth. Yet they have got along with them the muslims for too long. True secularism and islam cannot go together. The writer has not made a comprehensive study of her own book and is obviously fed by mullas or such bigots like Dr Zakir Naik. If she does so she will leave it without a wink. India cannot remain untouched by the world wide uprising of Islamists and tacit acceptance of the so called moderate muslims of islamic terrorism.They perhaps think that in the end the terrorism will succeed and they will be the beneficiaries. If I am right then they still live a fool's paradise. If the muslims want to live in a truly secular way then they will have to abrogate all those verses in Quran and the Hadith which advocates killing of people in the name of Allah. Stop calling nonmuslims kafirs, Respect human rights of other coreligionists. But that is not to happen. Forget hindus, tell me one religion with which the muslims live in peace ? Islam forbids it. Ample evidences have been put forward bY Mr Ali Sina. Read all of them carefully. You muslims cannot get along with such peaceful people like Bhuddhists. Look at Thailand. What has become of that country. When a lamp runs out of oil it burns vigorously before it extinguishes.Islam is burning vigorously, wait for your time Islam will sing the proverbial swan song.

  • Name: antimod
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 07:27:06 -0700

Comment

Read "abu kasim - an apostate speaks " in this very column.Then decide whether sucularism with Islam will survive. Muslims of India are uneducated and duds. Thats why they are easily befooled by the Congress. The congress & other socalled secularists think that people can be befooled by their slogans. Elections in two states has given them a good taste what falsehood means. They resort to dubious means like pulling down a democratically elected govt, the moment a state goes against them they resort to machinate communal riots. They are very clever, they leave no evidence behind so that people think that the ruling non congress govt is not handling the law and order situation and call for president rule. If muslims wish to live happily with hindus then they must give up their belligerent attitude, help the govt in apprehending terrorists and stop giving shelter to them. Without any local help the terrorists cannot strike. And follow my suggestions I wrote in my previous comment.

  • Name: kafir/infidel ( & Ex-communist ).
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 11:15:21 -0700

Comment

SHABANA MUHAMMAD seems ( as she is apparantly from a Moslem background - to have lot of ISLAMISM absorbed, lot of prejudice,lot of bias, lot of untruth absolutely,lot of evil propaganda and she may be compared roughly to Benazir BHUTTO - a true MOSLIMAH with a facade to oppose ISLAMISM and ISLAMOFASCISM. Obviously for any truth to come out you need to examine the basic values,basic tenets, past ,present history of a country,people,religion,society ,culture,education etc. Ms. SHABANA is shamelessly assuming everything without any truth with her preverse thinking which is by the way a characteristic of ISLAMISTS. At the moment or any time time in history INDIA - because of HINDUS and Hindu values,principles,philosophy,ethos, morals, remained the most liberal,democratic,secular,freedom,peace loving country . It is amazing to see that how these ISLAMISTS - including SHABANA resort to deceit and dishonesty,without conscience. INDIA is like no other country in the world . Later we will post point by point rejoinder bringing out truth. In 1000 years , during approximately between 10 th century until 19 th century INDIA /Hindus were the biggest losers in land and population ,conversions . Biggest gainers,profiteers ,plunderers,colonialists,imperialists,slave drivers, looters,rapists,killers,murderers were ISLAMISTS and Christianity . For 1000 yrs INDIA was a slave country under foreign rule with all her honor,values,ethos,principles were torned,tormented,tortured, murdered,pillaged,raped,massacred . And the people of INDIA were subjected to unspeakable atrocities ,brutalities,deprivation,insults,abuse . Mr. William warner ,director of the center for the study of political ISLAM - estimated that about 80 million HINDUS were butchered in INDIA, by ISLAMIC rulers during their rule . INDIA was reduced to shambles and people were so much devastated and became like orphans in their own houses ,in their own country. Will DURANT the American historian wrote that the most bloodiest saga of ISLAMIC rule in INDIA is unprecedented in annals of human history.

  • Name: U.K. TODAY.
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 15:13:48 -0700

Comment

Re: To all Muslims out there. --- Whether they be past or present. --- Could I, as a non Muslim please ask one or two questions about the Quran, as I am becoming some what confused by Islamic scholars interpretations of what is and isn't written. --- Firstly, Why do Islamic scholars imitate the words of the Quran instead of, (as is the case in other religions) Interpret its teachings into modern day rationale?. --- (2) Islamic monotheism; If the Quran (through the words of Mohammad) affirms the fact that Jews, Christians and Muslims all worship THE SAME GOD, then why do Muslims consider themselves better than "PIGS AND APES?". (3) ---- Continuing on from my last question, How did gods name become Allah among the Muslim multitudes?. And does his name matter anyway?. (4) If the Torah, (Judaism) came first - followed by the bible, (Christianity) -- and as Islam likes to put it, the Quran was the final installment of this almighty trilogy, why (if we are spiritual) must we "read" the Torah and bible, yet "recite" the quran?. Is it possible the word "recite" was introduced by Mohammad himself on account that he was illiterate?. Please understand, I am not trying to score points here - I'm just reading - thinking - and trying to make sense of what puzzles me at heart!!!. My final question is as such; If God/Allah is the unquestionable Omnipotence for all three faiths, and the first prophet to receive his wisdom was Abraham, followed by Jesus, (both Jews,) both revered men in the Quran. Then why do Muslims seek to purge the religion of David from the face of the planet?. The more I read, the more I struggle to pinpoint logic to my questions. Can anyone out there theorize and answer my points?. Yours Hopefully.

  • Name: kafir/infidel ( & Ex-communist ).
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 16:34:12 -0700

Comment

To SHABANA MUHAMMAD : what prompted you to write this propaganda based on deception,dishonesty and outright demonism ? I am glad that you wrote this and gave ample opportunity for the real true human beings ,thinkers,philosophers,truth seekers,spiritualists,intellectuals to see your real ulterior motives and vile and viciousness ( ISLAMIC parlance i am using here ) in your thinking,attitude. I will prove that everything you wrote is not only untrue and evil but you are doing with evil intentions. Answer all points raised here. I will not write one word untruth. People who visit this site have the clear opportunity to see truth. In addition - the Bengali EX-Moslems will also discover their past ancestry , there by will be happy that tehy belonged to the glorious and noble past of sanatana Dharma. They will research,study,think ,analyze for themselves in order to arrive at that point. The world's intelligent ,educated,thinking population knows that there are 3 fascist forces ( ofcourse the fourth one christianity - we will explain that later)in human history as far as we know . These are namely - 1. ISLAM . 2 NAZISM . 3. COMMUNISM . if you disagree tell us why you disagree and prove your point. When you write your imaginary ,hallucinating ,perverse thouhts purely concocted stating about Hindu fascism - you are lying,deceiving ,without any conscience,truth , with out any basis. I hope you read this and come out here to tell truth based on facts ,history. HIndu DHARMA can never be fascist. Infact Hindu dharma is diametrically opposite of the 2 evil religions ISLAM and christianity , and political dogmas like communism,NAZISM.

  • Name: Jagmohan Singh Khurmi
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 18:59:51 -0700

Comment

You are doing the usual, typical, worn-out mistake. There is nothing like hindu-fascism. The imaginary non-existent "hindutava" you are showing is result of Islamic and pseudo secularism propogonda muslims are spinning. Don't put Hinduism and Islamism in same pocket.

  • Name: Jagmohan Singh Khurmi
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 19:35:30 -0700

Comment

The person who wrote this article is Hindutva-ist herself ! ( though she is not aware of this fact ) This website is Hindutva website, so is faithfreedom.org ! Ali Sina, Salman Rushdie and Taslima Nasreen are hindutavaists. Hindutva is nothing but an intelletual movement to expose Islam and Christianity, the politicol ideologies pretending to be religions...

  • Name: kafir/infidel ( & Ex-communist ).
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 20:02:59 -0700

Comment

TO SHABANA AZMI : First tell us what you are and what you would like to be as a human being. Give us a clear picture. Define secularism and then get it endorsed by all religions,political parties and at the international level . Becoz secularism is a European origin and concept as pope was the whole and sole before 700 to 800 yrs back . To defang pope and his religious fascism , Europeans has introduced this idea of secularism which is separation of church and state thereby cutting the powers of pope and religion (christianity) do not have any say in states affairs and in running the state . But INDIA was,is and will always be secular,becoz of sanatana DHARMA. You know the history of INDIA. SHABANA MUHAMMAD ( or is it SHABANA AZMI ?) what is your political party? or philosophy ? Be honest and truthful. Are you a communist fellow traveller? Now coming to the idea of fascism - what made you to think this evil plot? What are the basic tenets of ISLAM . christianity , communism and SANATANA DHARMA ? By the time you and me finish this argument I will demonstrate conclusively that you are not only wrong but belong in your ISLAMIC BURQA and right hand of BIN LADEN. Why ISLAM ,christianity and communism are fascist ? Their basic tenets declares that clearly . as given below. What is KALEEMA for a Moslem - A moslem is swearing by the belief that his is only true God,true religion,true belief and all other people ,beliefs,God are false. Then they state that NONbelievers ( called or named as kafirs,infidels,DHIMMIS with disdain ) has no right to live on this earth and ALLA has asked them to declare JIHAD ( religious war ) on kafirs,infidels and kill them ,unless or until they are converted to ISLAM . So this is true fascism. Built on this is enormous, elaborate evil theology of ISLAM which is most intolerant,fascist,most dogmatic,most exclusivist,most bloodthirsty,most hateful, terror,fear monger and outright demonism ,cruelty,wickedness,uncivilized, barbarism . SHABANA - i urge you to compile all the number of terrorist acts ,bombings,killings , destructions carried out by ISLAMISTS in INDIA during the past 10 years !!!!! So you see ISLAMISTS/ISLAM and their ALLA/MO_HAM_MAD do not accept any other people,religion,faith,culture ,values ,philosophy. On the other hand ISLAM/ISLAMIST theology is so primitive,dark and blood thirsty ,hatefilled that there is no way that any civilized ,good ,decent,kindhearted ,compassionate human being can even think of this death cult,vengeful cult and plague with his/her good conscience. ISLAM is based on inequality - they do not consider woman as equal or as human being worthy of consideration except for sex and breeding. ISLAM is inequality of Moslems and nonmoslems (everything different even laws) ,between ISLAMIC men and women, between different sects of ISLAM . There is no (not one ) universal value in ISLAM for the good of entire humanity on equal justice,equality of religions,equality of women,peace,equality of all human beings, equality in Governance . The ISLAMIST world view is centered on the supremacy of ISLAM , subjugating ,oppressing,suppressing and finally killing all nonmoslems. What happened when SALMAN rushdie wrote his book satanic verses ? at least 30 people were killed in NORWAY,italy,japan ,INDIA ( some 7,8 people eventhough the book was banned ) . What happend to taslima Nazreen? what happened to her in INDIA recently ? Where were you hiding ? cant you support her ? ISLAM IS a highly NEGATIVE dark theology. 2 yrs back JERRY FALWELL and William GRAHAM ,after careful study of QQURRAN , said that ISLAM is evil religion and MO was a wicked man - for this , the bloodthirsty ISLAMISTS in INDIA killed 6 HINDUS in INDIA and the whole world - all good people like you even did not open their mouths. This is your greatness. AS long as commies ( the other evil,fascist force in INDIA ) are part of ruling class in INDIA ( A bizarre situation ) , Taslima will not get INDIAN citizenship - her spirit is squelched by these communist vultures in collusion with congress traitors. If you do not have the list of ISLAMISTS terrorist attacks on INDIA ( i am not talking about or including kashmir), I will post them eventhough they might be incomplete . RIGHT now INDIA/HINDUS are under sieze in their own homes and in their own country. There is no other country on this earth - which is as noble, as generous, as magnanimous,as freedom loving ,as democratic ,as secular as INDIA is - it is all becoz of HINDUS SANATANA DHARMA philosophy,ethos,principles,values . This will become more clear as we place more truths ,facts infront of the people here on this forum.

  • Name: vbv
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 21:59:00 -0700

Comment

Hindutva is not a fascist terminology like islam. Hinduism does not propogate hate for other religions. It is an all-inclusive philosophy recognizing spirituality piety and righteousness in any form of worship/belief. It is not an exclusivist dogma - "you are sinners/infidels and shall be consigned to eternal fire/hell if you are not a muslims/christian and not believe in Jesus?Mohamad?Allah?Yahweh?" It is not a prosyletising type of religion. It allows every person to explore his/her inner conscience / mind to achieve spirituality. You can employ yoga,meditation,devotional chanting,or simply by being a good person with righteousness,compassion to all living-beings,kindness,humane-ness and good conduct ( not the barbaric and uncivilized ways and sheer savagery and cruelty of the islamists),etc. Above all there is freedom of choice to worship in any manner/or form . There is absolute freedom to disbelieve GOD - you can be an atheist and still be a hindu , because the emphasis is on being a morally good and righteous person and not merely belief in a dogma- that is the wonderful principle of the doctrine called "Karma"! BJP is not against the West but is certainly against the subtle and covert ways of imposing christianity and debunking Indian culture through seemingly innocuous things like 'valentines day',friendship day ,mother's day etc. while respecting father,mother,brother,sister teacher is innate in our culture that we don't need lessons on these matters from the West! Even today a child in India touches the feet of their parents and elders to seek their blessings that we don't need to have a father's day , mother's day etc. to remind us of the affection and respect due to them.That's hindutva ,not hate, convert or murder to conform to some useless dogma of heaven as a reward for belief and hell as a punishment for disbelief! Shabana Muhamad ,living in the West , ofcourse, may not be aware of the true meaning of Hindutva/Hinduism?Sanathana Dharma and she writes just as per the newspaper propoganda dished out by our PC 'secular' english newspapers/magazines. You have to be in India and see the Indian family and its culture ,especially in the small towns and villages, not in lagre metroplois like Mumbai/Delhi,etc which are corrupted with West's influence, to have the correct perspective.

  • Name: kafir/infidel ( & Ex-communist ).
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 22:14:09 -0700

Comment

To SHABANA MUHAMMAD : Tell us what you know about ISLAM, tell us what you know about communism, tell us what you know about Christianity, their basic values,basic tenets , what their books tell them and preach . It is a great thing that humanist,liberal,kindhearted , truthful and honest EX. Moslems are running this site and we admire their service,sacrifice,sincierity. But it looks like that they are not well informed about their own ancestry - SANATANA DHARMA. It is hoped that this discussion will spur them to know truth about INDIA/SANATANA DHARMA and the greatest civilization that existed in INDIA before the advent of the inhuman ,evil,cruel ,barbaric ISLAM and then christianity. Take a look at the world map - study it. know world history. 1/2 the world was invaded,conquered,colonized,destroyed,enslaved,native inhabitants killed or given option to convert,millions were massacred by marauding murderous ISLAMISTS ,ruled on them ruthlessly.Imperialist ,fascist,dogmatic,intolerant ISLAM was built with the blood of millions of innocents. The other 1/2 was invaded ,conquered ,enslaved,colonized,ruled by the imperialist,intolerant christianity. Who gave them the authority to convert other humans ? their GOD !!!! Ofcourse , of late christianity became some what civilized,tolerant as they could afford it - becoz - western christian nations are powerful economically,militarily,religiously,culturally,technologically. But Moslems are still brutal,wicked, cruel,evil,bloodthirsty. SHABANA - you recall few years back ( WHEN BJP was in power ) , pope went to INDIA and on the most spiritual,sacred day of HINDUS - the DEEVALI DAY ( festival day ) declared in the capital city of INDIA ,new DELHI that this century belongs to christianity as christians have to do ie , to convert and harvest the souls of entire INDIA /ASIA for christianity . Can there be more demonism than this ? Entire INDIAN media (ENGLISH) applauded the declaration !!!! Not even a single HINDU opened their mouth to denounce this demonism of pope in their own house. This is the situation in INDIA . What does christianity as theology say? That their GOD is only supreme ,true,real and inorder to go to heaven, one must believe in HIM/ his son christ, his revelations in bible . All the others are sinners ( nonbelievers ) and are condemned to go to hell . All Hindus are sinners and will go to hell. If they want salvation , Hindus must convert to christianity and believe in christ and without belief in christ there is no salvation. Christian God is superior , Hindu God is inferior, Hindus worship devils, stones ,monkeys ,trees,water what kind of pagans are they . SHABANA - you know in INDIA what kind of tricks these missionaries play , the lures,enticements,favours, deception,dishonesty ,is endless. ADDING to this is th eenormous resources, men,material,rewards ,glitz provided by western nations and offered by the missionaries . ISLAMISTS have ill gotten PETRO DOLLARS . With $$ 100/Barrel crude the ISLAMISTS do not know how to spend the money- as they are literally floating in PETRO DOLLARS. SHABANA - it is your evil ,perverse,undemocratic thinking that is bankrupt. Under these conditions - INDIANS/Hindus are no match . ISLAM and christianity already built their evil empires ,long time back. HiNDUS were irrelevant. Becoz for 1000 yrs HINDUS were made slaves in their own houses and a greatest catastrophy befell on them. Now you want to legitimize all that !!! very cruelly. Hindus were not controlling their own destination for 1000 yrs. They were not rulers. They were the victims. DUring that period ISLAM/christianity became empires . Now it is time to dissolve these evil, fascist forces . Christianity want to convert all humanity into it's hegemony,slavery,belief - just like ISLAM does. ISLAM has JIHADS, christianity has crusades . It is one against the other for supremacy. They faught for 800 yrs and still are fighting. It is time for the civilized world to put a stop for these twin evils of ISLAM /CHRISTIANITY. DURING the 1000 yrs occupation/rule/slavery of INDIA/INDIANS/HINDUS under ISLAM/ christianity - enormous lands ,real estate was given to ISLAMISTS for Mosques/dargahs by Moslem rulers for free , and for churches by British rulers (christianity) . We are not talking about the thousands of temples razed by ISLAMIC rulers and Mosques built on them . Harems for thousands of women concubines for Moslem rulers.

  • Name: HINDU FASCISM IS REACTION TO ISLAMIC FASCISM
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 22:29:03 -0700

Comment

SHABANA IS A STUPID FOOL...SHE SHUD KNOW THE FACT THAT HINDU FASCISM IS A REACTION TO ISLAMOFASCISM AND CHRISTIAN- FASCISM.INDIANS AND HINDUS WERE NEVER FASCIST TILL THE ADVENT OF CHRISTIANITY/ISLAM,AND HINDUFASCISM IS A REACTION TO THE DISEASE OF SEMITIC MONOATHEIST FASCISMIF TOMORROW THERE IS NO ISLAM AND CHRISTIANITY THERE WILL BE NO HINDU FASCISM.I THINK SHABAN SHUD LEARN HINDUISM WHICH SAYS THERE R MANY WAYS TO GOD,AND NO ONE SHUD BE FORCED INTO IT AND NONE IS SUPERIOR OR INFERIOR BUT ALL EXIST IN THEIR OWN PLACE.UNLIKE FILTHY FAKE JEW CHRISTIAN ISLAMIC ATE BASED IDEOLOGY WHICH CLAIMS OTHERWISE.

  • Name: Cynic
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 22:53:45 -0700

Comment

As a resident Indian I totally agree with the views expressed by Shabana. While I am proud of the great heritage of this country I also notice that Indians tend to look down upon their own culture and traditions. Hence the slow demise of Indian languages going on for some time. The Hindutua zeal is no remedy for this as they are unacceptably obsurantist and caught in a time warp. God help this country from the Dhimmi Congress and the obsurantist Hindutua forces!

  • Name: Bhumi Rajeshwar
  • Date: Tuesday January 08, 2008
  • Time: 22:58:50 -0700

Comment

a thoughtful article. But the author has neglected the legitimate grievances of Hindus. Why is it that Christians claim thay ear persecuted all over the world? It is because they are using their considerable financial power to convert poor people and weaker segments of Hindu society. This is not true conversion and Hindus seem to have no defense agaisnt this in view of the fact that Hindus are so disorganized and are totalyy ignoring this conversion. The converted Christians are taking up arms are are terrorizing Hindus in Northeast and are trying to separate themselves from India like Muslims did through Pakistan. When Hindus legitimate grievences are ignored, what other means do they have against Christian conversion.

  • Name: Cynic
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 01:46:26 -0700

Comment

To Bhumi Rajeswar How many Christians are there in India? Even after centuries of predominantly Christian British rule the percentage of Cristians is about 2%. If this is what happened after such long periods of supposed Cristian patronage no large scale conversion can ever take place in India. The bogey of conversion is nothing but a tactic adopted by the Hindu fanatics to sway the opinions of gullible Hindus.

  • Name: Ashok Chowgule
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 03:15:26 -0700

Comment

The programme to make Hindus feel bad about themselves was actually that of the Marxists, and not so much of the politicians. Since the independence, the Hindus allowed them to put their thoughts in practice. However, what the Hindus found is that the Marxists and the politicians did nothing for the people at large, particularly the minorities. They implemented policies which kept India economically and socially backward. When the Hindus decided that enough is enough, they decided to put their faith in parties like the BJP. They did so not because they are against anyone, but for themselves. They also realised that within the parameters of the Hindu civilisation, solutions to the problems that the nation is facing can be found. Shabanaji should understand that she has to give solutions to the problems rather than mouthingthings like third-front, secular, etc. In fact, the practice of secularism in India is the root of the problem. Namaste Ashok Chowgule

  • Name: kafir/infidel ( & Ex-communist ).
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 13:07:31 -0700

Comment

To cynic : you are not only cynic but also perverse,convolutedly wicked in thinking. Obviously you are a christian. To respond to you and your cynicism - you need a JIHADISTS Moslems ( TALIBAN/AL QAEDA becoz they will tell you that you are a game to be killed as their ALLA told them. Your ideas are laughble and purely evil. Who gave you to destroy other cultures,people,civilizations ,religions ? Jesus told you !!!! The childish ,evil ,fascist,imperialist ideas like your preferred God, choosing you alone, his revelations, his prophet, his bible ( or QQURRAN ) are utterly stupid,evil,antisecular,antidemocratic, irrational,antifreedom,insult to human intelligence and existence. Note that ISLAM and - whereever they went - destroyed the cultures,civilizations,countries. All the intellectuals,philosophers,thinkers now realized this and agreed on this............ ISLAM,christianity and communism are antisecular ,antidemocratic,fascist forces .............. You are out of your mind when you say that BJP or any INDIAN party is obscurantist. You are avoiding the world history. .......... Make no mistake. If the world population is exposed on equal basis and gain knowledge about all philosophies,cultures,religions - you can bet that SANATANA DHARMA will be victorious - not becoz it is HINDU ( SANATANA DHARMA ) but becoz of their strength in moral character, truth,values, noblest ethos, traditions,practices, ideas. This is already happening in the world. Who ever is highly educated, knowledgeable, has thirst to know and study other values,religions,philosophy will be attracted to SANATANA DHARMA. You do not say a word . Just let them study,think,analyze. Examples are DR. FRAN MORALES (Of DHARMA central.com web site ), Koenrad Elst ( The koenrad elst site ) , a christian theologian and came from a lineage of christian missionary family , Jeffry armstrong ( jeffry armstrog.com ) , DAVIDFrawly ( American vedic institute of New Mexico university ) FRANCOIS DE Gautier the french renowned journalist. SANATANA DHARMA has the magnetic power - by the sheer force of it's noble values,philosophy,culture........................Besides , it is time for these 3 evil,fascist forces - ISLAM, CHRISTIANITY and COMMUNISM to dissolve and consign them for the ash heap of history . ISLAM ,christianity and communsim are antisecular,antidemocratic, fascist in nature and history has the proof.

  • Name: To Kafir/Infidel
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 15:10:25 -0700

Comment

Hi Kafir/Infidel, I like your comments. Its true and its very very worth. You are doing a great job. Kind regards, Truthseekers

  • Name: Arun Shourie's Article from Indian Express
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 15:19:43 -0700

Comment

Hindutva and radical Islam: Where the twain do meet Arun Shourie Indian Express Posted online: Friday, December 28, 2007 at 0000 hrs IST Your Hindutva is no different from Islamic fundamentalism’ — a fashionable statement these days, one that immediately establishes the person’s secular credentials. It is, of course, false, as we shall see in a moment. But there is a grain of potential truth in it — something that does not put Hinduism at par with Islam, but one that should, instead, serve as a warning to all who keep pushing Hindus around. That grain is the fact that every tradition has in it, every set of scriptures has in it enough to justify extreme, even violent reaction. From the very same Gita from which Gandhiji derived non-violence and satyagraha, Lokmanya Tilak constructed the case for ferocious response, not excluding violence. From the very same Gita from which Gandhiji derived his ‘true law’, shatham pratyapi satyam, ‘Truth even to the wicked’, the Lokmanya derived his famous maxim, shatham prati shaathyam, ‘Wickedness to the wicked.’ In the great work, Gita Rahasya, that he wrote in the Mandalay prison, the Lokmanya invokes Sri Samartha, ‘Meet boldness with boldness; impertinence by impertinence must be met; villainy by villainy must be met.’ Large-heartedness towards those who are grasping? Forgiveness towards those who are cruel? ‘Even Prahlada, that highest of devotees of the Blessed Lord,’ the Lokmanya recalls, has said, ‘Therefore, my friend, wise men have everywhere mentioned exceptions to the principle of forgiveness.’ True, the ordinary rule is that one must not cause harm to others by doing such actions as, if done to oneself, would be harmful. But, the Mahabharata, Tilak says, ‘has made it clear that this rule should not be followed in a society, where there do not exist persons who follow the other religious principle, namely, others should not cause harm to us, which is the corollary from this first principle.’ The counsel of ‘equability’ of the Gita, he says, is bound up with two individuals; that is, it implies reciprocity. ‘Therefore, just as the principle of non-violence is not violated by killing an evil-doer, so also the principle of self-identification [of seeing the same, Eternal Self in all] or of non-enmity, which is observed by saints, is in no way affected by giving condign punishment to evil-doers.’ Does the Supreme Being not Himself declare that He takes incarnations from time to time to protect dharma and destroy evil-doers? Indeed, the one who hesitates to take the retaliatory action that is necessary assists the evil to do their work. ‘And the summary of the entire teaching of the Gita is that: even the most horrible warfare which may be carried on in these circumstances, with an equable frame of mind, is righteous and meritorious.’ Tilak invokes the advice of Bhisma, and then of Yudhisthira, ‘Religion and morality consist in behaving towards others in the same way as they behave towards us; one must behave deceitfully towards deceitful persons, and in a saintly way towards saintly persons.’ Of course, act in a saintly way in the first instance, the Lokmanya counsels. Try to dissuade the evil-doer through persuasion. ‘But if the evilness of the evil-doers is not circumvented by such saintly actions, or, if the counsel of peacefulness and propriety is not acceptable to such evil-doers, then according to the principle kantakenaiva kantakam (that is, “take out a thorn by a thorn”), it becomes necessary to take out by a needle, that is by an iron thorn, if not by an ordinary thorn, that thorn which will not come out with poultices, because under any circumstances, punishing evil-doers in the interests of general welfare, as was done by the Blessed Lord, is the first duty of saints from the point of view of Ethics.’ And the responsibility for the suffering that is caused thereby does not lie with the person who puts the evil out; it lies with the evil-doers. The Lord Himself says, Tilak recalls, ‘I give to them reward in the same manner and to the same extent that they worship Me.’ ‘In the same way,’ he says, ‘no one calls the Judge, who directs the execution of a criminal, the enemy of the criminal...’ Could the variance between two interpretations be greater than is the case between the Lokmanya’s Gita Rahasya and Gandhiji’s Anashakti Yoga? Yet both constructions are by great and devout Hindus. Are ordinary Hindus nailed to Gandhiji’s rendering? After all, at the end of the Gita, Arjuna does not go off to sit at one of our non-violent dharnas. He goes into blood-soaked battle. The comforting mistake The mistake is to assume that the sterner stance is something that has been fomented by this individual or that —in the case of Hindutva, by, say, Veer Savarkar — or by one organisation, say the RSS or the VHP. That is just a comforting mistake — the inference is that once that individual is calumnised, once that organisation is neutralised, ‘the problem’ will be over. Large numbers do not gravitate to this interpretation rather than that merely because an individual or an organisation has advanced it — after all, the interpretations that are available on the shelf far outnumber even the scriptures. They gravitate to the harsher rendering because events convince them that it alone will save them. It is this tectonic shift in the Hindu mind, a shift that has been going on for 200 years, which is being underestimated. The thousand years of domination and savage oppression by rulers of other religions; domination and oppression which were exercised in the name of and for the glory of and for establishing the sway of those religions, evinced a variety of responses from the Hindus. Armed resistance for centuries... When at last such resistance became totally impossible, the revival of bhakti by the great poets... When public performance even of bhakti became perilous, sullen withdrawal, preserving the tradition by oneself, almost in secrecy: I remember being told in South Goa how families sustained their devotion by painting images of our gods and goddesses inside the tin trunks in which sheets and clothing were kept. The example of individuals: recall how the utter simplicity and manifest aura of Ramakrishna Paramhamsa negated the efforts of the missionaries, how his devotion to the image of the Goddess at Dakshineshwar restored respectability to the idolatry that the missionaries and others were traducing... The magnetism of Sri Aurobindo and Ramana Maharshi... Gandhiji’s incontestable greatness and the fact that it was so evidently rooted in his devotion to our religion... Each of these stemmed much. But over the last 200 years the feeling has also swelled that, invaluable as these responses have been, they have not been enough. They did not prevent the country from being taken over. They did not shield the people from the cruelty of alien rulers. They did not prevent the conversion of millions. They did not prevent the tradition from being calumnised and being thrown on the defensive. They did not in the end save the country from being partitioned — from being partitioned in the name of religion... There is a real vice here. The three great religions that originated in Palestine and Saudi Arabia — Judaism, Christianity and Islam — have been exclusivist — each has insisted that it alone is true — and aggressive. The Indic religions — Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism — have been inclusive, they have been indulgent of the claims of others. But how may the latter sort survive when it is confronted by one that aims at power, acquires it, and then uses it to enlarge its dominion? How is the Indic sort to survive when the other uses the sword as well as other resources — organised missionaries, money, the state — to proselytise and to convert? Nor is this question facing just the Hindus in India today. It is facing the adherents of Indic traditions wherever they are: look at the Hindus in Indonesia and Malaysia; look at the Buddhists in Tibet, now in Thailand too. It is because of this vice, and the realisation born from what had already come to pass that Swami Vivekananda, for instance, while asking the Hindus to retain their Hindu soul, exhorted them to acquire an ‘Islamic body’. Instigating factors We can be certain that his counsel will prevail, our secularists notwithstanding, • The more aggressively the other religions proselytise — look at the fervour with which today the Tablighi Jamaat goes about conversion; look at the organised way in which the missionaries ‘harvest’ our souls; • The more they use money to increase the harvest — whether it is Saudi money or that of Rome and the American churches; • The more any of them uses violence to enlarge its sway; • The more any of them allies itself with and uses the state — whether that of Saudi Arabia or Pakistan — for aggrandisement. Nor is what others do from outside the only determinant. From within India, three factors in particular will make the acquiring of that Islamic body all the more certain: • The more biased ‘secularist’ discourse is; • The more political parties use non-Hindus — Muslims, for instance — as vote banks and the more that non-Hindu group comes to act as one — ‘strategic voting’ and all; • The more the state of India bends to these exclusivist, aggressive traditions. It has almost become routine to slight Hindu sentiments — our smart-set do not even notice the slights they administer. Recall the jibe of decades: ‘the Hindu rate of growth’. When, because of those very socialist policies that their kind had swallowed and imposed on the country, our growth was held down to 3-4 per cent, it was dubbed — with much glee — as ‘the Hindu rate of growth’. Today, we are growing at 9 per cent. And, if you are to believe the nonsense in Sachar’s report, the minorities are not growing at all. So, who is responsible for this higher rate of growth? The Hindus! How come no one calls this higher rate of growth ‘the Hindu rate of growth’? Simple: dubbing the low rate as the Hindu one established you to be secular; not acknowledging the higher one as the Hindu rate establishes you to be secular! Or M.F. Husain. He is a kindly man, and a prodigiously productive artist. There is no warrant at all for disrupting all his exhibitions. I am on the point of sensibilities. His depictions of Hindu goddesses have been in the news: he has painted them in less than skimpy attire. I particularly remember one in which Sita is riding Hanuman’s stiffened tail — of course, she is scarcely clad, but that is the least of it: you need no imagination at all to see what she is rubbing up against that stiffened tail. Well, in the case of an artist, that is just inspiration, say the secularists. OK. The question that arises then is: How come in the seventy-five years Husain has been painting, he has not once felt inspired, not once, to paint the face of the Prophet? It doesn’t have to be in the style in which he has painted the Hindu goddesses. Why not the most beautiful, the most radiant and luminous face that he can imagine? How come he has never felt inspired to paint women revered in Islam, or in his own family, in the same style as the one that propelled his inspiration in regard to Hindu goddesses? ‘In painting the goddesses, he was just honouring them,’ a secular intellectual remarked at a discussion the other day. ‘It was his way of honouring them.’ Fine. It is indeed the case that one of the best ways we can honour someone is to put the one skill we have at the service of the person or deity. But how come that Husain never but never thought of honouring the Prophet by using the same priceless skill, that one ‘talent which is death to hide’? ‘Has Mr Shourie ever visited Khajuraho?,’ a member of the audience asked, the implication being that, as Hindu sculptors had depicted personages naked, what was wrong with Husain depicting the goddesses in the same style. Fine again. But surely, it is no one’s case that the ‘Khajuraho style’ must be confined to Hindu icons. Why has the artist, so skilled in deploying the Khajuraho motifs, never used them for icons of Islam? The reason why an artist desists from depicting the Prophet’s face is none of these convoluted disquisitions on style. The reason is simplicity itself: he knows he will be thrashed, and his hands smashed. Exactly the same holds for politics. How come no one objects when for years a Muslim politician keeps publishing maps of constituencies in which Muslims as Muslims can determine the outcome, and exhorting them to do so? When, not just an individual politician but entire political parties — from the Congress to the Left parties — stir Muslims up as a vote bank. When Muslims start behaving like a vote bank, you can be certain that someone will get the idea that Hindus too should be welded into a vote bank, and eventually they will get welded into one. Why is stoking Muslims ‘secular’ and stoking Hindus ‘communal’? And yet perverted discourse, even the stratagems of political parties, are but preparation: they prepare the ground for capitulation by the state to groups that are aggressive. And in this the real lunacy is about to be launched, and, with that, the real reaction.

  • Name: To Shabana Muhammad
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 15:28:43 -0700

Comment

Dear Shabana, You must read the following article. Thank you. Best regards, Truthseeker Article published in Indian Express Newspaper. Hindutva and radical Islam: Where the twain do meet Arun Shourie Indian Express Posted online: Friday, December 28, 2007 at 0000 hrs IST Your Hindutva is no different from Islamic fundamentalism’ — a fashionable statement these days, one that immediately establishes the person’s secular credentials. It is, of course, false, as we shall see in a moment. But there is a grain of potential truth in it — something that does not put Hinduism at par with Islam, but one that should, instead, serve as a warning to all who keep pushing Hindus around. That grain is the fact that every tradition has in it, every set of scriptures has in it enough to justify extreme, even violent reaction. From the very same Gita from which Gandhiji derived non-violence and satyagraha, Lokmanya Tilak constructed the case for ferocious response, not excluding violence. From the very same Gita from which Gandhiji derived his ‘true law’, shatham pratyapi satyam, ‘Truth even to the wicked’, the Lokmanya derived his famous maxim, shatham prati shaathyam, ‘Wickedness to the wicked.’ In the great work, Gita Rahasya, that he wrote in the Mandalay prison, the Lokmanya invokes Sri Samartha, ‘Meet boldness with boldness; impertinence by impertinence must be met; villainy by villainy must be met.’ Large-heartedness towards those who are grasping? Forgiveness towards those who are cruel? ‘Even Prahlada, that highest of devotees of the Blessed Lord,’ the Lokmanya recalls, has said, ‘Therefore, my friend, wise men have everywhere mentioned exceptions to the principle of forgiveness.’ True, the ordinary rule is that one must not cause harm to others by doing such actions as, if done to oneself, would be harmful. But, the Mahabharata, Tilak says, ‘has made it clear that this rule should not be followed in a society, where there do not exist persons who follow the other religious principle, namely, others should not cause harm to us, which is the corollary from this first principle.’ The counsel of ‘equability’ of the Gita, he says, is bound up with two individuals; that is, it implies reciprocity. ‘Therefore, just as the principle of non-violence is not violated by killing an evil-doer, so also the principle of self-identification [of seeing the same, Eternal Self in all] or of non-enmity, which is observed by saints, is in no way affected by giving condign punishment to evil-doers.’ Does the Supreme Being not Himself declare that He takes incarnations from time to time to protect dharma and destroy evil-doers? Indeed, the one who hesitates to take the retaliatory action that is necessary assists the evil to do their work. ‘And the summary of the entire teaching of the Gita is that: even the most horrible warfare which may be carried on in these circumstances, with an equable frame of mind, is righteous and meritorious.’ Tilak invokes the advice of Bhisma, and then of Yudhisthira, ‘Religion and morality consist in behaving towards others in the same way as they behave towards us; one must behave deceitfully towards deceitful persons, and in a saintly way towards saintly persons.’ Of course, act in a saintly way in the first instance, the Lokmanya counsels. Try to dissuade the evil-doer through persuasion. ‘But if the evilness of the evil-doers is not circumvented by such saintly actions, or, if the counsel of peacefulness and propriety is not acceptable to such evil-doers, then according to the principle kantakenaiva kantakam (that is, “take out a thorn by a thorn”), it becomes necessary to take out by a needle, that is by an iron thorn, if not by an ordinary thorn, that thorn which will not come out with poultices, because under any circumstances, punishing evil-doers in the interests of general welfare, as was done by the Blessed Lord, is the first duty of saints from the point of view of Ethics.’ And the responsibility for the suffering that is caused thereby does not lie with the person who puts the evil out; it lies with the evil-doers. The Lord Himself says, Tilak recalls, ‘I give to them reward in the same manner and to the same extent that they worship Me.’ ‘In the same way,’ he says, ‘no one calls the Judge, who directs the execution of a criminal, the enemy of the criminal...’ Could the variance between two interpretations be greater than is the case between the Lokmanya’s Gita Rahasya and Gandhiji’s Anashakti Yoga? Yet both constructions are by great and devout Hindus. Are ordinary Hindus nailed to Gandhiji’s rendering? After all, at the end of the Gita, Arjuna does not go off to sit at one of our non-violent dharnas. He goes into blood-soaked battle. The comforting mistake The mistake is to assume that the sterner stance is something that has been fomented by this individual or that —in the case of Hindutva, by, say, Veer Savarkar — or by one organisation, say the RSS or the VHP. That is just a comforting mistake — the inference is that once that individual is calumnised, once that organisation is neutralised, ‘the problem’ will be over. Large numbers do not gravitate to this interpretation rather than that merely because an individual or an organisation has advanced it — after all, the interpretations that are available on the shelf far outnumber even the scriptures. They gravitate to the harsher rendering because events convince them that it alone will save them. It is this tectonic shift in the Hindu mind, a shift that has been going on for 200 years, which is being underestimated. The thousand years of domination and savage oppression by rulers of other religions; domination and oppression which were exercised in the name of and for the glory of and for establishing the sway of those religions, evinced a variety of responses from the Hindus. Armed resistance for centuries... When at last such resistance became totally impossible, the revival of bhakti by the great poets... When public performance even of bhakti became perilous, sullen withdrawal, preserving the tradition by oneself, almost in secrecy: I remember being told in South Goa how families sustained their devotion by painting images of our gods and goddesses inside the tin trunks in which sheets and clothing were kept. The example of individuals: recall how the utter simplicity and manifest aura of Ramakrishna Paramhamsa negated the efforts of the missionaries, how his devotion to the image of the Goddess at Dakshineshwar restored respectability to the idolatry that the missionaries and others were traducing... The magnetism of Sri Aurobindo and Ramana Maharshi... Gandhiji’s incontestable greatness and the fact that it was so evidently rooted in his devotion to our religion... Each of these stemmed much. But over the last 200 years the feeling has also swelled that, invaluable as these responses have been, they have not been enough. They did not prevent the country from being taken over. They did not shield the people from the cruelty of alien rulers. They did not prevent the conversion of millions. They did not prevent the tradition from being calumnised and being thrown on the defensive. They did not in the end save the country from being partitioned — from being partitioned in the name of religion... There is a real vice here. The three great religions that originated in Palestine and Saudi Arabia — Judaism, Christianity and Islam — have been exclusivist — each has insisted that it alone is true — and aggressive. The Indic religions — Hinduism, Buddhism, Jainism, Sikhism — have been inclusive, they have been indulgent of the claims of others. But how may the latter sort survive when it is confronted by one that aims at power, acquires it, and then uses it to enlarge its dominion? How is the Indic sort to survive when the other uses the sword as well as other resources — organised missionaries, money, the state — to proselytise and to convert? Nor is this question facing just the Hindus in India today. It is facing the adherents of Indic traditions wherever they are: look at the Hindus in Indonesia and Malaysia; look at the Buddhists in Tibet, now in Thailand too. It is because of this vice, and the realisation born from what had already come to pass that Swami Vivekananda, for instance, while asking the Hindus to retain their Hindu soul, exhorted them to acquire an ‘Islamic body’. Instigating factors We can be certain that his counsel will prevail, our secularists notwithstanding, • The more aggressively the other religions proselytise — look at the fervour with which today the Tablighi Jamaat goes about conversion; look at the organised way in which the missionaries ‘harvest’ our souls; • The more they use money to increase the harvest — whether it is Saudi money or that of Rome and the American churches; • The more any of them uses violence to enlarge its sway; • The more any of them allies itself with and uses the state — whether that of Saudi Arabia or Pakistan — for aggrandisement. Nor is what others do from outside the only determinant. From within India, three factors in particular will make the acquiring of that Islamic body all the more certain: • The more biased ‘secularist’ discourse is; • The more political parties use non-Hindus — Muslims, for instance — as vote banks and the more that non-Hindu group comes to act as one — ‘strategic voting’ and all; • The more the state of India bends to these exclusivist, aggressive traditions. It has almost become routine to slight Hindu sentiments — our smart-set do not even notice the slights they administer. Recall the jibe of decades: ‘the Hindu rate of growth’. When, because of those very socialist policies that their kind had swallowed and imposed on the country, our growth was held down to 3-4 per cent, it was dubbed — with much glee — as ‘the Hindu rate of growth’. Today, we are growing at 9 per cent. And, if you are to believe the nonsense in Sachar’s report, the minorities are not growing at all. So, who is responsible for this higher rate of growth? The Hindus! How come no one calls this higher rate of growth ‘the Hindu rate of growth’? Simple: dubbing the low rate as the Hindu one established you to be secular; not acknowledging the higher one as the Hindu rate establishes you to be secular! Or M.F. Husain. He is a kindly man, and a prodigiously productive artist. There is no warrant at all for disrupting all his exhibitions. I am on the point of sensibilities. His depictions of Hindu goddesses have been in the news: he has painted them in less than skimpy attire. I particularly remember one in which Sita is riding Hanuman’s stiffened tail — of course, she is scarcely clad, but that is the least of it: you need no imagination at all to see what she is rubbing up against that stiffened tail. Well, in the case of an artist, that is just inspiration, say the secularists. OK. The question that arises then is: How come in the seventy-five years Husain has been painting, he has not once felt inspired, not once, to paint the face of the Prophet? It doesn’t have to be in the style in which he has painted the Hindu goddesses. Why not the most beautiful, the most radiant and luminous face that he can imagine? How come he has never felt inspired to paint women revered in Islam, or in his own family, in the same style as the one that propelled his inspiration in regard to Hindu goddesses? ‘In painting the goddesses, he was just honouring them,’ a secular intellectual remarked at a discussion the other day. ‘It was his way of honouring them.’ Fine. It is indeed the case that one of the best ways we can honour someone is to put the one skill we have at the service of the person or deity. But how come that Husain never but never thought of honouring the Prophet by using the same priceless skill, that one ‘talent which is death to hide’? ‘Has Mr Shourie ever visited Khajuraho?,’ a member of the audience asked, the implication being that, as Hindu sculptors had depicted personages naked, what was wrong with Husain depicting the goddesses in the same style. Fine again. But surely, it is no one’s case that the ‘Khajuraho style’ must be confined to Hindu icons. Why has the artist, so skilled in deploying the Khajuraho motifs, never used them for icons of Islam? The reason why an artist desists from depicting the Prophet’s face is none of these convoluted disquisitions on style. The reason is simplicity itself: he knows he will be thrashed, and his hands smashed. Exactly the same holds for politics. How come no one objects when for years a Muslim politician keeps publishing maps of constituencies in which Muslims as Muslims can determine the outcome, and exhorting them to do so? When, not just an individual politician but entire political parties — from the Congress to the Left parties — stir Muslims up as a vote bank. When Muslims start behaving like a vote bank, you can be certain that someone will get the idea that Hindus too should be welded into a vote bank, and eventually they will get welded into one. Why is stoking Muslims ‘secular’ and stoking Hindus ‘communal’? And yet perverted discourse, even the stratagems of political parties, are but preparation: they prepare the ground for capitulation by the state to groups that are aggressive. And in this the real lunacy is about to be launched, and, with that, the real reaction.

  • Name: kafir/infidel ( & Ex-communist ).
  • Date: Wednesday January 09, 2008
  • Time: 17:05:00 -0700

Comment

To SHABANA MUHAMMAD : Your write up is without substance, without truth, narrow ,evil mindedness, venting full of bile ,malicious intention . You are prompted by the recent enunciation by Prakash karat - the CPI (M ) fellow. You are relying on falsehoods, thinking by writing false hoods and by repeating 100 times that it will become truth.This is also standard tactic adopted the most fascist forces like ISLAMISTS and communists. How much do you know about communism. Your antipathy and ill will towards BJP and Hindus instigated you to write this stupid ,evil ,concocted, imaginary falsehoods. As I said you do not the definition of secularism and democracy. You do not the basic tenets of ISLAM,Christianity and communism and who are real fascists which can be verified by their deeds and actions,history which can be seen by any intelligent,unbiased,person. Now I will write about communism. Basic tenets of communism are - DIALECTICAL materialism ( ANTIGOD and NO GOD , also known as atheism ), Proletariat dictatorship ( antidemocracy ,antifreedom ) and overthrow of buergeoise Govt by any means - violent overthrow by revolution and killing. (Power comes from the barrel of gun ). Without these tenets - communism is not communism . without believeing in these tenets and principles nobody can claim as a true communist. Eventhough there are other tenets - for our purpose this is good enough to consider. There are lot of similarities between ISLAM and Communism - for example both believe in killing, antisecular,antidemocratic, antifreedom and to prevail in their theology/ideology at the end and all others must be eliminated. After 70 yrs experiment, the world finally discorded communism. For the communism to take root - you need poverty,ignorance,illiteracy,people who will burn with jealousy and hatred and willing to destroy and kill . These are exactly the same qualities ISLAMISM needs too to propagate. No well off,educated, thinking,intelligent person will accept these ideas . Everybody on this earth is working and wants to be well off in life . Nobody works to become a poor person. But communism ( ISLAM ) instigates ,injects, hatred ,jealousy - the moment they see a well off person or anybody living comfortably. A well off person immediately becomes the target of communism and ISLAM - as they do not want good living as other people - deprived people do not have that kind of life . So the violence starts. here is the contradiction in communism. Communism will not work. A person who works for 12 hours a day is not the same as a person who works 3 or 4 hours a day, but communism forces them to be equal. here is another contradiction. Communism do not allow for other views - exactly like ISLAM . Both are dogmatic, exclusivist. Because ISLAM has the tag - RELIGION - ISLAMISTS are getting away with murder,mayhem ,plunder,killing,bloodthirstyness, intolerant. Both ISLAM and communism are intolerant which makes them fascist too. In INDIA, there are close to 10 -12 different communist parties . Obviously SHABANA - you do not know what you are writing- a very shallow , with evil intentions. I dont know why the ISLAM-watch.org allowed you to put this write up on their web page . It has no content, no ideas, no truth, no analytical strength . In INDIA there are umpteen number of parties - than any other country in the world. Communism is a western idea that was imported to INDIA . Communism was not of INDIAN soil. IRONICALLY - communists who are hell bent oppose anything western do not know the very birth of communism is of western . INDIAN communists follow rather slavishly , the line of USSR communism or chinese communism. which means - INDIAN communists are never patriotic or nationalistic. This is known for everybody. Besides , INDIAN communists have track record of taking a stand against INDIA/INDIANS at every crucial step of nations interest. INDIAN communists supported partition. INDIAN commies sided with chinese aggression of 1962 , on INDIA. Even now - as you write so ignorantly - INDIAN communists oppose tooth and nail the liberal industrial policies,economic policies of INDIA . INDIAN communists oppose widening of roads, moving poor people to newly built houses in colonies. Do you know all of this? Of the 10 communist parties which one is true communist party. Communists themselves have no answer for this. Funny. ..............SHABANA you look so stupid ,clownish and bankrupt . your write up is purely prejudiced, evil with narrow bent of mind and filled with ignorance. Communists do not have any love for their mother land . Communists love to toe the line of foreign masters. Everybody in INDIA ,in political circles know this..................same is true with ISLAM - ISLAM wants to be slave of SAUDI arabia . But at the fundamental level ISLAM and communism ( MARXISM ) are sworn enemies - Communists say that there is no GOD but ISLAMISTS say that their GOD IS only GOD. At the international level , ISLAM and CHRISTIANITY were responsible for the collapse of communism - how ironical - the most fascist forces collided for supremacy - the result is there for all to see. USSR collapsed becoz they ( Communism ) invaded AFGHANISATAN. COMMUNISTS miscalculated that ISLAM/ISLAMISTS are 1000 times more fascists, ruthless, evil,cruel ,wicked than communists . on the EUROPEAN front CHRISTIANITY using the power of POPE , lech valensa of poland ( a christian himself) and his solidarich defeated communism. In ADDITION ,communism was opposed and defeated by dissident jews. IN addition , communism ( COMMUNISTS ) was hunted down and killed in thousands , and buried from all ISLAMIC countries - like IRAN , EGYPT, INDONESIA, IRAQ, ALGERIA,and all other ISLAMIC Countries. It is a great puzzle to see - that today why communists support the most evil,obscurantist forces of ISLAM and christianity !!!! the very forces who caused the death of communism. Perhaps - they are scared about the ruthlessness,cruelty of ISLAMISTS becoz - ISLAMISTS slit their throats. SHABANA - you have to ask communists - that why they INVADED AFGHANISTAN in 1979 ? I can write lot more about the evil ways of INDIAN communists- but getting lengthy.If necessary , i will respond again....... SHABANA your attack on BJP on cultural grounds is laughble . Even in USA - there is a cultural war going on between people. Besides , the HINDUTVA ( as you term it ) has the right absolutely to tell,educate, inform the baout their heritage,legacy,traditions,values. Who are you to question that ? IS it not democratic way od giving information ,history? BJP in INDIA is also the party that support economic liberalization which you do not know. LOOK at GUJARAT state . LOOK at W.Bengal . You are full of lacking any knowledge. Who are you to tell BJP or for that matter to any INDIAN/HINDU in INDIA about their culture. You are totally wrong when you say that Hindus do not follow 21 century. HINDUS already follow ENGLISH, dress , freely watch Holly wood movies. There is free flow of ideas between USA. UK ,Germany, AUSTRALIA and INDIA . Note that major share of student population iN USA universities is currently from INDIA . So you are wrong on all counts and ignorant,prjudiced EVEN Communists opposed tooth and nail western culture ( in USSR and CHINA ) . you do not know this. Who are you to impose your prejudicial ideas on HINDUS/INDIANS ? INDIA is fully democratic, with full freedom . If any INDIAN is following some western culture - it is because of their lack of understanding of true INDIAN values,traditions,philosophy,principles,values. But when they are informed - you can be sure that they will be proud to belong to the noblest sanatana DHARMA. It is the job and duty of BJP or any truly INDIAN political party to educate, to inform, to give choice, to protect their values, their culture . It is their birth right. How can you find fault with it or object it ? Your meaning less rant is useless,true fascism.

  • Name: shazid
  • Date: Thursday January 10, 2008
  • Time: 17:11:11 -0700

Comment

kafir u loser shut up no ones interested in ur stupid tirade wats ur point u idiot ? pope rulz jesus rulz islam rulz india murdabad!

  • Name: To Shazid and Kafir/Infidel
  • Date: Friday January 11, 2008
  • Time: 12:49:43 -0700

Comment

You should decently put your views in a logical way and in a respectful manner. Kind regards, Truthseeker

  • Name: Seeker
  • Date: Thursday January 17, 2008
  • Time: 14:28:11 -0700

Comment

You will find dozens of online books on Islamic history vis-à-vis the Indian subcontinent …. at the “Voice of Dharma” website below: Just click on the link below, scroll down and click on any book you see: http://voiceofdharma.org/books.html

  • Name: Rajendra
  • Date: Friday February 22, 2008
  • Time: 12:45:13 -0700

Comment

I find the term 'fascism' applied to Hindu faith offensive. Obviously the writer is not aware of barbaric Islamic rule, followed by British rule (al-together for more than 1000 years)- no other country/ religion was subjected to such horrible bullshit. Muslims especially must be ashamed of their faith, following bullshit written by a pedophile. Muslims- your days are numbered on this planet- literally and in every sense. The pope does not rule, christians do not rule, and certainly the camel jockey Muslims do not rule anything.

  • Name: venketachalapathy reddy
  • Date: Wednesday April 23, 2008
  • Time: 11:45:52 -0700

Comment

I strongly oppose the idea that hindus are spineless and prideless.It's the most ancient civilzation that exists today,a philosophy strong enough to accept other's views unlike islam.with each step science takes forward islam takes a step forward.Intellectually speaking islam will end up in the trash of history while hinduism will excel with science.Hinduism inspired openhilmer,einstein and heisenberg.islam and christianity oppossed darwin and galilieo for speaking the truth.Even after muslim and christian slavery,this mighty,invincible,civilization marches on.you can spit upon the fact but the fact will remain a fact

  • Name:
  • Date: Wednesday April 23, 2008
  • Time: 11:47:59 -0700

Comment

  • Name: The Arrow of Light
  • Date: Saturday April 26, 2008
  • Time: 20:18:28 -0700

Comment

I think this site is doing a good job posting absolute lies about Islam. I said good because this is what brings the Individual to look for more information. The more the individual looks the more information the person gets from right and wrong sources. Thanks to the almighty , he has blessed every person with intelligence to make your own judgement. Thanx for bringing the people towards Islam.

 
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