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Misleading Beliefs in God or Allah?

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“The further the society drifts from TRUTH, the more it will hate those that speak it.” – George Orwell

When I started penning this article, I did not realize how perceptions can turn out by my thoughts on this God worship wantons. I am toying with the idea that true believers will not agree with my wanting to be talking about their wondrous creator up in the sky. I do know that believers will draw their daggers to strike off my head, as my thoughts are not to their likings. But I’m unable to undo it without fracturing the lines of thought itself! As Friedrich Nietzsche rightly said, “All things are subject to interpretations; whichever interpretations prevails at a given time is a function of power and not truth”.

Consequently, I have to put all of my curious judgements into perspectives and I request your immoderation.

god-in-the-sky

For God to be an all-knowing, all-powerful Sky-Dude that almost no one truly believes in, I'm given to understand (from all the polls) that this World is full of religious folks (around 70%) and that Atheists, Buddhists and Communists are a small minority. I would, however, like to posit that most people DO NOT actually ever believe in God, although they sincerely profess to one faith or another? And that’s what I’d like to explore in this article.

So, let’s start! I doubt any sane person actually believes in God? Not you, or your spouse, or not even your parents/grandparents, or your devout cousin, who is also a Mullah. And for that matter, not even the Grand Mufti ever believes in God!

Well what is God?

I think most people know what I mean by God. But, I am forced to clarify it, because some folks have adopted a weasel-ass Deepak Chopra-esque techniques of disguising this very God as some nameless, faceless energy-field that is infused in our wireless mind communiqué biology and saturates our all consciousness with virtue and mystic beauty… blah blah blah.

Just Pure Nonsense! No matter how well the faithful try to deflect scrutiny, the God they are droning on about is the same one that is most widely perceived as an omnipresent, omnipotent, and omniscient entity that made this universe and all that is in it. And that this God has prescribed some virtues and forbidden some vices; and that He has a keen sense of justice, whilst listens to those prayers of the faithful and that He intercedes on behalf of those as worthy. THAT is the GOD I’m talking about irrespective of the name ascribed to Him or the quantified holy Book that is brandished as His ascribed publication!

So what is this “Belief”?

Since there is no handy tool to measure and ascertain religious beliefs, we usually take a lay person’s word as the final arbiter of truth. In fact, societal norms of politeness dictate that such statements are beyond scrutiny, because it would trespass on the individual’s domain of private thoughts and assumptions! As a result, any statement that is prefixed with “I believe” builds a moat around itself, which fends off any inquiry – let alone challenges? Moreover, I submit to you that this is how we get a whopping figure of 70% peoples saying that they believe in a true God!

And how about verifying this “Belief”?

So let’s consider what would happen if the subject of “belief” were different? For instance, what would happen if someone were to say that he/she “believed” that their bank were about to go under? Or that the stock market was about to collapse? For us to be persuaded that they ‘actually believe’ in what they say they believe to be the truth, would we not expect their conduct to reflect that belief? Would we not expect that person to withdraw all deposits or sell existing holdings if he/she truly believed that those investments were about to tank? Or would we just simply accept their claims to belief if their conduct were inconsistent with those stated beliefs?

(NOTE: It is possible to be mistaken in one’s belief. In other words, it is also possible to believe that the stock market will crash even though it really does not. But if one were to truly believe it, one’s actions would definitely bear testimony to such a belief). However, this is NOT the case with religious beliefs. When a person says, he/she believes in God –that is taken purely at face-value even though his/her actions are incongruent with the stated belief. And that we seem to have convinced ourselves that “religious belief” is so sacrosanct that it ought not to be verified and thus the chasm between stated belief and actual actions remains un-bridged.

To summon up on this vice versa ambiguity of True Belief in God, I would like to state a valid example of unbridled lies of holistic scriptural writings from God’s righteous words written in holy books [Bible and Qur’an]

We would like to draw your attention to the following substantiated scriptures:

  • The holy Qur’an assures more than once that the Holy Bible (Old and New Testaments) was descended from God Himself:
  • It describes the holy Bible also as (Al Zekr Al Hakim), i.e. the message, in its statement: "Before thee, also, the messengers we sent were but men, to whom we granted inspiration: if ye realize this not, ask of those who possess the message (Al Zekr)" [Quran 21:7], and "This is the message (Al Zekr) of those with me, and message (Al Zekr) of those before me" [Surah Al Anbiyaa 21:24]. The Qur’an also admits that God preserves the Bible because it is descended by Him, i.e. His (Tanzeel): "We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption)." [Quran 15:9].
  • Surah Al-Imran 3:3-4: "...He revealed the Torah and the Gospel [Injil] aforetime, for a guidance to mankind..."
  • Surah Al-Maidah 5:46: "...We bestowed on him [Isa] the Gospel wherein is guidance and a light, confirming that which was (revealed) before it in the Torah--a guidance and an admonition unto those who ward off (evil)..."
  • Surah Al-Maidah 5:110: "…When Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Remember My favour unto thee and unto thy mother; how I strengthened thee with the holy Spirit, so that thou speakest unto mankind in the cradle as in maturity; and how I taught thee the Scripture and Wisdom and the Torah and the Gospel..."
  • Surah Al-Hadid 57:27: "...and We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow, and gave him the Gospel, and placed compassion and mercy in the hearts of those who followed him..." Also see Surahs 3:48, 65; 5:47; 19:30

The Holy Bible, which the Quran admits that it is authentic, and that it's kept by God, says: "It is easier for heaven and earth to disappear than for the least stroke of a pen to drop out of the law" [Luke 16:17], which means that the word of God in the Old Testament cannot be changed. It is also mentioned that Jesus Christ says about his word: "Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away" [Mathew 24:35]. As you see here that Jesus Christ describes his word as eternal, this is not applicable except for God Himself. It means that the word of Jesus Christ in the New Testament can never ever be changed as well!

This is the belief of Christians in the word of the Holy Bible, with its two Testaments, which no creature on earth could change or falsify. That is because it is supposedly the true words of God, and the holy Qur’an itself confirms this belief.

Hence, if someone comes some 600 years after the descent (incarnation) of Jesus Christ, which is the most glorious incident in the history of humanity, and this person wants to change the events of the history, or some of the teachings of the Holy Bible, or to interpret it in a different way other than what Jesus Christ taught. This person has to get the proof for what he says, especially if it were not coinciding with the recorded history over the years. On the other hand, this leads us to the next point: the amiable holy Qur’an came without any evidence that proves its credibility? In spite of its promise that God will send miracles to prove it, up till now this promise has not ever been fulfilled, not even by one single miracle? Humanity waited a long time for this miracle, but nothing came out. That pushed the famous Islamic university, Al-Azhar Al-Sharif, to declare that Islam is the religion of the reason, and that there are no miracles in Islam but the holy Qur’an itself, which is the wholly Islamic miracle, and the only proof of Islam's authenticity! Since then, we hear a lot of sayings that claim that the holy Qur’an predicted some of the recent scientific discoveries, even when these discoveries are to be proved wrong later. For instance, when it was discovered that the atom was indivisible, and then when it was proved divisible -- in both cases, it was said to be a miracle of the holy Quran.

Nowadays you're coming up with the idea of 'letter measuring'. This is an old Jewish thought.  It is a mistrusted unofficial procedure, and it cannot be scientifically proven. Although you call the Jews infidels, you still follow their barren ways? You're still trying to prove the credibility of the Qur’an from the Qur’an itself? Here, Al Azhar and Muslims missed a very important point, which is: any book needs proofs from the outside for it to prove itself as authentic! That's only logical, since every witness needs a judge to judge his/her blessed testimony, or else the whole case is spoilt to falsity.

However, all Muslims claim to believe in all the revelations that God has sent, not making barren distinctions between any of them. Yet, in practice though, what do we see? We see many believers following only one Book, while the others are ignored, unread, and even rejected on the basis of it being corrupted, illegitimate and man-made traditions, or that God has simply pledged to re-new His blessed wordings with newer and better versions of His statements of Belief and Commandments of Truths!


 

Read Part 2

Comments (241)Add Comment
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written by someone , November 18, 2012
nice article and good study of the revealed scriptures.Quran and Bible can not be revealed from the same God.Teaching of the both books are lot different.Only one of them is true inspiration of God.One have to decide himself to whome he wants to follow.
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someone
written by kope , November 18, 2012
your bible responsible for spreading atheism in your churches

most of bible writen by paul and church
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Allah is Not the Jehovah-god of Jews and Christians
written by ChrisLA , November 18, 2012
For a more insightful discussion of the concept of God, readers should read "Allah: Is He God" at http://www.answering-islam.org...allah.html

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...
written by kope , November 18, 2012


according to my understanding of islam


there is ONLY one true god

there is no such thing as false god

people of all religions worship SAME one true GOD with diffirent understanding of same god

even if a person who worship a RAT as god he and i worship same god but he is wrong about god being a rat

we both go to heaven if we are nice to other human being


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ChrisLA ,
written by kope , November 18, 2012

ChrisLA ,wrote "Allah: Is He God"


============

allah have no gender

god is not father

god is not mother

god is not son

you say your god is made of father and son

so they are male, he gods


two he or one he?

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A Jew explains why Allah is the one and only God
written by kope , November 19, 2012


A Jew explains why Allah is the one and only God

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65zyICBKBPI
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Who is God?
written by Gnostic , November 19, 2012
In my view the question who is god is misleading because it does not help in any way. Jews, Christians and Muslims are killing each other because they cannot agree about god while other civilisations are not raising the question at all.

There is no need and no use for god or for many gods because we humans have our brains and we can explore the world by ourselves and develop ourselves.

ILets take a look at the achievements of muslims who are so proud of themselves for the belief that their religion is the only true one:

Muslim share of world population: ca. 22%
Muslim share of world illiterates: ca. 50%
Muslim share of poor people below 1$/Day : ca. 50%
Muslim share of world economy : 5% (estimate)
Muslim share of economy wo oil: 1% (estimate)
Muslim share of Research & Development |< 1 %
Muslim share of Nobel Prizes: < 0,1%

Muslim share of genetical disorders: 2 times higher than the average because of inbreeding

The average guy of an industrial countries reads a few books a year. The average arab reads a few pages a year according to the UN Human development Report which was compiled by arab intellectuals. And if the arabs read anything, they read the quran or other religious texts about the quran.

Here we can clearly see how helpful islam is!


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written by kope , November 19, 2012


muslims were super power for lasted for thousand years

christians are super power for last four hundreads years and will collapse because sexual immorality

muslims will rise again

thanks to zionist for removing dictator saddam hussain

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typical
written by malem , November 19, 2012
Grab a few verses, selectively edit than , then spend the rest of your time wondering
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A trapped squirrel in a wheeling cage
written by Montegue , November 19, 2012
Keep the title in mind that a trapped squirrel goes nowhere.

1. Atheists believe there is no god, and non-atheists believe there is god. Both equally believe in contrary. Believe requires faith, and thus the both have faith, but they have opposing faith.

2. Muslims say god has no gender. Then god is neither male nor female, so god does not have a breast of male or female. Consequently god has no breast. Since god has no breast, he has no head, but Muslims say god has no shape of image. Nothingness has neither shape nor images. Consequently god is nothingness. Then Muslims believe in nothingness; therefore, Muslims are atheists. This contradict of statement 1, since 1 says the are the opposite of each other.

3. Atheists says they need no god because we have our brain, but statement 1 and 2 are the product of human brain; therefore, human brain is contradictory.

I will waste no more time, for no brightest men every exists, atheists or non-atheist, ever succeed in proving anything one way or the other. This is an uncharted realm no wise man will venture into and prove successful. What makes you think you will?
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Montegue
written by kope , November 19, 2012

2. Muslims say god has no gender. Then god is neither male nor female, so god does not have a breast of male or female. Consequently god has no breast. Since god has no breast, he has no head, but Muslims say god has no shape of image. Nothingness has neither shape nor images. Consequently god is nothingness. Then Muslims believe in nothingness; therefore, Muslims are atheists. This contradict of statement 1, since 1 says the are the opposite of each other.



========================

muslims believe that human cannot describe god nothing more

how does god look like?

god is beyond human imagenition

if we imagin god

that is not god

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Delusional Kope
written by DEWDDS , November 19, 2012
Kope pretends his god is something it is not. Islam has long anthropomorphised Allah. It is hard to explain why Muslims would prostrate themselves before some invisible, amorphous entity. That seems more a pagan practice. But of course Islam is loaded with Arab pagan practices - the average, ignorant Muslim knows no better nor cares. But they keep fantasizing uselessly about some supreme being that was borrowed from Judaism and Christianity, and seasoned heavily with Arabic cultural traits. Nice try, but it still is best viewed as mythology.
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DEWDDS
written by kope , November 19, 2012
do you know islam is fastest growing religion?
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Shape of God
written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012

In Bible, it is clearly stated that God created man in his shape. As he created Adam first, we can infer that God's shape is that of Adam. So God has shape, probably that of human male. Next is his relation to man. He is the creator, man is the created. Jews and Christians take him as father and all human beings his children. Muslims consider God as master and all human beings as his slaves. So Kope, the ignoramus takes God as his master and he takes pride as God's slave. He doesn't know that the civilised man has abolished the system of slavery long back. If God is the master, he is not acceptable in the modern world, he is a relic of the past.

When will these ignorant muslims wake up to reality?
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...
written by kope , November 19, 2012


god does not need slaves

god is beyond of any need

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written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012
written by kope , November 19, 2012


written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012


In Bible, it is clearly stated that God created man in his shape. As he created Adam first, we can infer that God's shape is that of Adam. So God has shape, probably that of human male.

======================
does god also eat sleep, shit , cry like man?
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Kope
written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012

I am not sure about God. But in Allah's paradise, every thing is available. Fruits, milk, honey and even wine. Since big- breasted houries and pearly boys will be carrying these things around, the inmates or the souls can eat and drink to their hearts' content. Since they are eating and drinking lavishly they must be shitting also. So undoubtedly, there are toilets in paradise. May be, every thing is supervised by Allah. Another thing is the people who die in fighting in Allah's way i.e the shahids or martyrs do eat and they are fed by Allah everyday. This is clearly stated in Quran. If you have any doubt, feel free to ask your Imam. As for Allah, I think he also eats, drinks, farts and shits, but I am not sure. Please clear your doubts with the local imam, or I think our Malem or Reed will guide you.
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Duke Indian
written by kope , November 19, 2012


written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012


I am not sure about God.

=============
but you said god is like man

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Kope
written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012

Dude, I said that God's shape is like that of a man. Does it mean that God has to do everything like man? What kind of logic is that? Do all creatures of same shape in the world do everything the same way? You ignoramus, use your head once in a way.
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Duke Indian
written by kope , November 19, 2012


written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012


Dude, I said that God's shape is like that of a man. Does it mean that God has to do everything like man?

==============

if your god has penis like a man

what does god do with his penis?

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Kope
written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012

Dude, you can similarly ask, if God has a rectum, what does he do with it? What does he do with hands? With stomach etc.,etc.. If you say God has no definite form, I can also ask you. How does he see? With what organ he speaks or commands or with what organ he thinks, etc..etc. It will be a useless conversation.
0
...
written by kope , November 19, 2012


that why we muslims say that god is beyond human imagination
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Good article
written by Worldpeace , November 19, 2012
Good article. Pleasing discussion. If there is god, It should be good in the absolute sense and does not hell,
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Worldpeace
written by kope , November 19, 2012

if there is no god who / what cause life on earth?
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Kope
written by Worldpeace , November 19, 2012
Kope, my take is not whether there is god or not. I said if there is one (you can not prove god either way), it should be absolutely good not sadist brandishing hell.
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Worldpeace
written by kope , November 19, 2012

prove of god is life on earth
0
...
written by kope , November 19, 2012

go ahead disprove that
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Kope
written by Worldpeace , November 19, 2012
Which god, Allah? Yaweh? Chineke? God? Or Ubangiji? You still miss the point, Kope. Life on earth doesn't prove the existence of god like, 1+2=3. This is not my point really.
The point is, god is not Allah who promises damnation. God should be love and pure goodness.
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And also
written by Worldpeace , November 19, 2012
Humans do not need god or religion, for that matter, in order to be moral. What, then, is the use of god? To cause confusion? To divide humanity?
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My dear Kope
written by Worldpeace , November 19, 2012
The world (universe) is too big and, instantaneously, getting bigger, that the earth is a small dimension in comparison. Can you imagine a human living in this small earth should be the concern of the real God? And in case of Allah, to get so red at the person that worships another deity, to eternally fray that person in hell? Give us a break, we are not children.
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We need peace
written by Worldpeace , November 19, 2012
The world need peace and as it were, today, Islam is the greatest impediment to world peace.
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kope
written by continuum , November 19, 2012
that why we muslims say that god is beyond human imagination


is that why quran says allah made Adam with his own hands?

If he beyond human imagination, how do you know he even exists? Is allah's existence beyond human imagination?

If, yes nobody can know allah's exists?

If no, how is his existence known then? perhaps through ome attributes...if his attributes are known then allah is NOT beyonf human imagination...hence your statement is illogical anyway

=> either way allah is pure imagination of muhammad...
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@ Brokaan- 1
written by Rationalist , November 19, 2012
Brokaan,

I would like to provide my views on some of the statements of your article.

You state: Just Pure Nonsense! No matter how well the faithful try to deflect scrutiny, the God they are droning on about is the same one that is most widely perceived as an omnipresent, omnipotent, and omniscient entity that made this universe and all that is in it.
My take: See highlighted words. Many religions believe that universe came out of nothing... i.e. creation ex-nihilo. Scientific theories are changing so fast that theories such as multiverse, string, and cyclical universe are emerging thick and fast and are a part of mainstream science.

How about a philosophy which states Universe, matter, time, and consciousness have always existed and eternal; that matter is created and destroyed in cycles within the universe(s). These functionalities are controlled by the laws of nature. The philosophy also states that universe, matter, time, and consciousness (soul) are unborn and are as eternal as the "Universal Consciousness."

My point is we need to come out of the age old creation ex-nihilo theory that binds most monotheistic religions on earth. Yup, we need to think out of the box!!
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Allah as Male
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 19, 2012
Kopey if God Allah is male will he have penis?
Methinks without one he will be a she or it?
0
Kope
written by Duke Indian , November 19, 2012

'that why we muslims say that god is beyond human imagination'

Not only muslims, all believers in God irrespective of their religion say that God is beyond human imagination. But that is not about his shape. It is about God in totality and as an entity, about his powers and reach and not his form. In Torah it is said that God created man in his shape. I don't know what is said about his shape or form in Quran. Anyway in Quran, in so many parts Allah is talking, seeing, listening, hearing, scolding or rebuking and Allah is whistling even. It is said Allah whistled life into Miriam's stomach. In a very sensational and touching scene, Allah even stands up and salutes his last prophet Muhammed. If Allah is shapeless, you should tell me how Allah does all these things. Another thing. If there is no mention of Allah's shape or form in Quran, as a dutiful muslim you must believe in what Bible or Torah says, because without a shred of doubt Allah has made it clear in Quran that it is the continuation of the messages he had given viz. Torah and Bible. If your worry is about the corruption story of the above messages, Allah was simply joking. Because, Allah categorically affirms in Quran that he will preserve his messages. Then how come the earlier messages were corrupted by jews and christians? If it really happened, who is at fault? What was he doing when jews and christians were corrupting his messages? Sleeping? If he says like that indirectly he is admitting that jews and christians are more powerful than him. Another question. If the earlier messages were corrupted in spite of his resolve and vigil to preserve them, what guarantee is there that the message conveyed through Muhammed will be preserved? If somebody doubts the credibility of Allah, can you find fault with them? So I think, his mention that the earlier messages were corrupted is only a joke.
0
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written by vbv , November 19, 2012
God is absolute BULLSHIT! It is man-made tool to exploit the gullible. It is a political tool to control people and bend them to do the biddings of those who hold the reins of power. No wonder politicians, dictators, autocrats, monarchs and all those who wield power have close relationship with the clergy , the pope , the mullah, the ayatollahs etc. These clergy ,etc exercise great influence on therulers and influence the political/economic/societal policies. It is the worst scam in the hiostory of humanity. It is absolute corruption and sham. The more "religious" you are , the more the influence of these clergies , the more regressive, backward, and destructive you become. That is why theocratic nations have very poor record of progress and human rights. Women are treated as shit , worse than animals. God is the most f**ked-up thing that ever has been. It is a cruel and heartless dispensation. This God (through man-made scriptures falsely claiming to be the word of that imaginry spook called God/Allah/Yahweh,whatnot) ordains his zealots /ministries etc to torture , murder , plunder people just because they do not believe in these bullshits. Yet this God is supposed to be merciful . What a cruel ,sadistic joke this is! Throw this God in the garbage and forget that spook ever was, the society will be saner, more peaceful , tolerant and progressive.
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KOPE
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 19, 2012
You said "your bible responsible for spreading atheism in your churches

most of bible writen by paul and church"

I the world would be a better place to live in if the world take to the Teaching of the Bible. Even if the world is atheist it will still be better off than to have Islam tryanacal and evil teachings.
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@ Duke Indian / Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 19, 2012
> Dude, I said that God's shape is like that of a man. Does it mean that God has to do everything like man? What kind of logic is that? Do all creatures of same shape in the world do everything the same way? You ignoramus, use your head once in a way.

Yes it is logical. Why do you think humans are structured (aka shaped) the way they are structured? Because of the functionality of our bodies. If the functionality was different, then the structure would be different.

For example, a human males testicles are not inside his body and instead they hang in a sack. What functional purpose does this have? To keep the testicles cool, because if they were at body temperature, the sperm would die.

Another example, we have eyes in the front of our head. What functional purpose does this have? It allows us to see in 3 dimensions. If our eyes were at opposite ends of our heads, then we could only see in 2 dimensions, which means we couldn't perceive depth.

Another example, we stand upright and walk upright so that our hands are free to grasp things. If we walked on all fours we wouldn't be able to grasp things.

Structure and function go hand and hand.
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@ Kope / Worldpeace
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 19, 2012
> if there is no god who / what cause life on earth?

Physics.
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VBV
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 19, 2012
God did not create religion but man did. God wants relationship with his creation not religion but man created religion and thinks by this he would appease his creator. God wants relationship based on love and righteousness, free from evil and sin.

Not as Islam and any other religion would wants us to believe, Islam for instance believes that through washing of hands, legs and mouth, and daily ass ups one could appease God of our sins.

VBV I don’t want to confront you, but as usual you are wrong.
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Kope- A-Z why All is an Idol and not the same as the God of Jews and Christains
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 19, 2012
A.–Allah was one of gods’ worships in Mecca before Mohammed wrapped it in the image of Yahweh the God of the Jews and Christians. This is from the testimony of the Quran and Hadiths
B.– Black stones was worship and reverence as a god among the pantheons of Mecca before Islam
C.–Converts are made by force of sward not persuasion and reasoning. Corner stone of Ka’aba the cube shrine of Allah was an idol and has nothing to do with Adam, Angel Gabriel, Abraham and Ishmael building it
D.–Divining arrows were used to decide the faith of Mohammed‘s father Abdullah – the slave of Allah in ka’aba and demons are disciples Allah(Muhammed) through the preaching of Quran. Wonderful!
E.–Examine every scripture whether Jewish or Christian in the light of what the Quran says anything outside that is false and anyone who leaves Islam kill him. Is it not satanic?
F.– Faith must be exercised on one Idol- Allah only and not any other. Fight for him and his apostle to be sure of heaven. Can you believe this?
G.–Goddess associated with Allah like al-lat, al-luza and Ma’nat must be destroyed. Does it matter I if you worship one Idol or many idols?
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KOPE- Allah is an Idol H-Z continue
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 19, 2012
H.–Hub bal the senior idol of kaa’ba must submit to Allah the supreme rock god of the kuraish the tribe of Mohammed. Hatred of all mankind is the major creed of the cult.
I.–Islam a religion of submission of all idols, jinns and humans to Allah the supreme rock god of the Kuraish tribe of Mecca of Saudi Arabia, Under the Arab imperialism.
J.–Jinns and demons profess Koran and Islam to be their religion. Can you believe this to be godly religion?
K.– Knowledge of other religions like Judaism and Christianity is enmity to Islam. You must remain ignorant of these true faith to remain loyal to Islam.
L.–Lives are to be sacrificed in fighting for Allah to guarantee paradise with Allah. One of the unwritten but the greatest Pillar of Islam.
M.–Mohammed is the sole massager and partner of Allah, unlike the God of the Jews and Christians who has many prophets and Massagers to direct mankind to him through Jesus as the last and the final Messiah and Saviour.
N.– No freedom or right to question the stupidity of Allah compared to the True God of the Universe.
O.– Obedient to the cult ritual belief system is the supreme command and has nothing to do with morality or being humanistic
P.-Partnership with Allah the supreme Idol or personal relationship is forbidden except Mohammed the chief priest.
Q.-Quran the recitals of this idol call Allah was collated into a book from the oral tradition of many years after the death of its principal recital general, and the chief poet of the cult.
R.–Remember the Ramadan the holy month of the pagan to keep it holy, is one of the five pillars.
S.–Satan circulates in human like blood. Make sure his recitals agree with that of Allah the supreme rock god. Steeling is forbidden but not against unbelievers because their wealth are yours by right. can you believe this?
T.–Turn towards Kaa’ba when you pray because that is the dwelling place of Allah and will not hear you if turn to any other direction because he is not everywhere and cannot hear from any direction.
U.– Unbeliever in this cult belief system must be killed and wipe out to the last because Allah hate them
V.–Virgins are waiting for the martyrs and believer for real treat in bed-mastics and heavenly wine to cool down if they are killed in the art of terrorism or die as the faithful for Allah and Mohammed his Partner.
W.–Wine should not be taken while here on earth or else you will not be allow to drink in Allah’s paradise.
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no difference
written by non believer , November 19, 2012
I find no difference between Kope and Islam-watch Pastor. So with all other believers. Just because there is nature there has to be a god and that god is as invented by our predecessors is their stand. Both are obstinate. If they want to believe their god it is fine but why do they want others to believe their god? Why don't they (muslims and christians) allow others to believe in their own gods or no god? Why jihads and crusades to force others to their religion. Except these religions others don't have this desire to send people to their heaven. I am using the phrase "their heaven" because the description of their heavens differ.
0
...
written by Reed Wilson. , November 19, 2012
Dear Duke. You are claiming "Another thing is the people who die in fighting in Allah's way i.e the shahids or martyrs do eat and they are fed by Allah everyday. This is clearly stated in Quran. If you have any doubt, feel free to ask your Imam."

Where it is so very clearly written in Quran? Please quote Quran. I did not see eating there nor that they were shahids or martyrs.
0
Montegue
written by Kaser , November 19, 2012
Atheists DO NOT "believe" there is no god.  Atheists reason and choose proof over blind faith.
Not believing in a god DOES NOT mean we "believe" there is no god.

BELIEVING requires faith and NO WORK. Faith also requires abandoning beliefs as Science proves them wrong...

KNOWING requires WORK (observation, analysis, hypothesis, criticism, review and establish the relevant science).
And, knowing means admitting errors, and going over the scientific process again.
0
Malem
written by Kaser , November 19, 2012
You said:
"Grab a few verses, selectively edit than , then spend the rest of your time wondering"

This is exactly your tactic old man. You still have no depth to you arguments.
Are you selective in your editing of the Quran verses Malem?

Do you believe apostates should be killed Malem?
Do you believe it's ok to have sexual intercourse with pre-pubescent girls Malem?
Do you believe it's ok to be ruthless to the unbelivers?
Do you believe women are "weak of intelligence and religion"?

Answer "no" to any of these questions and you are a fraud in your belief the Quran is perfect and Islam is "the pure light" of Allah.
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 19, 2012
You asked:
"if there is no god who / what cause life on earth? "

Science doesn't know full well yet. Science has a hard time explaining exactly why amino acids create systems that grew in complexity to form simple bacteria, then all life.
But the key is there. We know amino acids exist in meteorites - so elsewhere in the universe.

Note that we also do not know full well why the hemoglobin molecule "wraps itself" around the iron atom it uses to carry oxygen. A pure marvel...

But NOT KNOWING how these system work DOES NOT allow us to simply dump them in the "god made it so" catch-all.
We must continue to study and learn.

10,000 years ago, we did not know about neurons, synapses and the complex structures of the brain.
We thought diseases were evil spirits...
Now we know better.
0
To all
written by Kaser , November 19, 2012
That god was invented by humans to explain the inexplicable is a given.
That humans then created religion to create moral frameworks based on the fact "god" wants it so is a given.
Islam, Christianity and Judaism are all WRONG believing that earth was created 6000 years ago.

None of them can explain dinosaurs having lived 65,000,000 years ago (Thanks to science's CARBON DATING technique)
None of them can explain the Iridium layer present 65,000,000 years ago (Thank to geology)
None of them can explain the fact that 99.999999999% of all the mass in the universe is NOT in our solar system. Why would god expend so much energy creating EVERYTHING ELSE than what is found on earth...

All Islam-Watch believers will have a difficult time explain these simple observations science made in context of their religion, and the fact they believe a "god" created everything 6000 years ago.
0
A thing or two i do know
written by dead or alive , November 20, 2012
I will never attain perfection.Too many laws to keep .If I know the right people and have the cash and say the right things.I can look like `Gods gift to the world`If I get caught breaking one rule.the world will make a mockery of me.In religion its about who can out holy the other,But in reality the real us is behind close doors.
0
The God of rhe Bible is not the god of Islam
written by Walter Sieruk , November 20, 2012
The God of the Bible is not the same god as the god of Islam. Though the passing of time it has become widely accepted that the word Allah is just the Arabic word for god. This started when truth compromising Bible "translaters'" substitued the word Allah where the word God should have been used in the Arabic translation of the Bible Furthermore in the glossary in the book ASSASSINS ! by DR. Haha Lung defines Allah as the "Pre-Islamic Lunar god: the god of Islam." Likewise, the book INSIDE ISLAM by Reza F. Safa on pages 22,23 reads "In pre-Islamic times both Allah-worship and Baal- worship involved the worship of the sun, the moon and the stars which defines them as astral religions [Such cults were condemned in the Bible, Second Kings 21:3,5. 23:5 Second Chronicles 33:5.] The cresent moon , which was the symbol of moon worship is also the symbol of Islam. In short, the god of Islam is not the the God of the Bible.

The words in brackets are my own. Moreover the above truth is further exopsed in the books...
WHO IS THIS ALLAH by G.J.O. Moshay
UNVEILING ISLAM by Ergun Mehmet Caner and Emir Fethi Caner
THE ISLAM INVASION by Robert Morey
PHILISTINE by Ramon Bennett
WHY I LEFT JIHAD by Walid Shoebat
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Walter
written by abc , November 20, 2012
You need to get out of your basement and stop drinking cool aid.
What did mommy tell you about sugar.
Memet and fathih cancer are charlatans and frauds.
Even the christians don't want to know these idiots.
See pastor James white tell you about them.
Robert Morey us another such fool. James white has a lot to say about him too.
Shabir alley did a paper to destroy Morey and his idiotic moon god theory.
You saved the best until last, shoebat. Ex terrorist according to nobody.
Even his family have disowned that idiot. Israel knows of no plots that shoebat tool part in. What u do know is he charges $120000 a lecture to fleece you gullible Christians. Well done wally!
0
Question for all atheists
written by kope , November 20, 2012


which came first chicken or the egg?

why do chicken have wing?
0
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 19, 2012
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 19, 2012

> if there is no god who / what cause life on earth?

Physics.
======
explain more
0
Islam-watch Pastor
written by kope , November 20, 2012
your cult is dying will never resurrecti
0
Kaser
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by Kaser , November 19, 2012

You asked:
"if there is no god who / what cause life on earth? "

Science doesn't know full well yet. Science has a hard time explaining exactly why amino acids create systems that grew in complexity to form simple bacteria, then all life.
But the key is there. We know amino acids exist in meteorites - so elsewhere in the universe.

==============


your leaders lied to you
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 20, 2012
Why do chickens have wings?
To fly Kope. To flee from predators by taking to the air and perching in a branch.

What came first, the chicken or the egg?
Same answer to the question: who came first, you or your embryo?
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> > > if there is no god who / what cause life on earth?
> > Physics.
> explain more

All properties of the Multiverse are reducible to physics.

Subatomic physics is the lowest level of universality. It has certain properties.

From that level of universality emerges other properties. These new properties exist in a higher level of universality. More importantly, these new properties do not exist in the lower level of universality. An example of a higher level of universality is atomic physics -- and an example of a property in this level of universality that doesn't exist in the lower level of universality is the property of electric charge.

A higher level of universality is that of DNA, which is a specific organization of atoms that replicates itself. This replication property does not exist in lower levels of universality.
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Why birds have wings
written by fineliving56 , November 20, 2012
Oh… leave it to Quran to ask us, to ask him '' look, how birds just float in the air with nothing to hlod them back ''

Thanks, for reminding me of one the dumbest part [ and there a lot ] of Quran 67/19 :

Have they not looked at the birds above them spreading and folding their wings ? non can hold them back but Allah ….. ''

haha … The idiot Allah, did not have faith in his creation [ humen ] that they will figure out the physics behind flying birds …not only that we can fly too ..

If Allah knew we will knew how to fly, why would Allah says '' only Allah is holding the birds in the sky with no mention of how exactly happens … not even a hint .

It is so obvious that Muhammad him self WAS ignorant of the mechanism behind flying birds, so he wonder about it so much … he included in his Quran and brought it, as an example of Allah's ability to HOLD the bird up in the air .

Quran is full of stupid jokes on us, placed side by side to deadly serious ones .

0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> why do chicken have wing?

Because their ancestors flew.
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> your leaders lied to you

The "leaders" are politicians. You seem to be saying that they are scientists and philosophers.

Today's politicians pander to the masses to win votes.
0
written by Kaser , November 20, 2012
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by Kaser , November 20, 2012

Why do chickens have wings?
To fly Kope. To flee from predators by taking to the air and perching in a branch.

=======================
why does austrich have wing?

What came first, the chicken or the egg?
Same answer to the question: who came first, you or your embryo?

=============

so egg?

how does egg come without chicken?
0
Rami Rustom ,
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012

> your leaders lied to you

The "leaders" are politicians. You seem to be saying that they are scientists and philosophers.

Today's politicians pander to the masses to win votes.
================
i was talking about your leader richard dawkin
0
Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012

> why do chicken have wing?

Because their ancestors flew.
=======================


what the reason chicken stop flewing?
0
Rami
written by fineliving56 , November 20, 2012
It looks like, you have to give Muslim Kope, a physics lesson …

The news of Evolution has not reached the Muslim world, Yet !

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Benefits to Jihadists.
written by Duke Indian , November 20, 2012

Reed Wilson is asking where it is mentioned that jihadists who die in Allah's war against unbelievers or shahids as they are called, do eat food and are actually fed by Allah in Quran. I am really surprised that a scholar of Quran like RW asked this question. I am no expert on Quran. Of course I had read it once a few years ago and have referred it many times when occasions arose, but don't remember any part by verse, sura no. etc. But I remember having read about so many benefits granted by Allah to the jihadists when they are slain like their immediate ascension to paradise ( I don't know whether it is true, but ordinary mortals have to wait for that till the day of judgment.) and their stay there with sumptuous food in all luxury etc. I don't know the verse no. and sura where Allah mentions these things. So I request our readers to point out the exact sura and verse no. if anybody remembers it or to state the exact position if I am wrong. Anyway, I am thankful to Reed for not asking me about Allah's boasting that he will preserve his messages!
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Kope- It is Islam that will die a natural death.
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 20, 2012
You said "your cult is dying will never resurrect"

Are you saying that Christianity is a cult like Islam? Why do you think so? Everybody knows that Christianity preaches the message of love to mankind, and Islam a message of hate and death to all infidels. Christianity uses the sword of the spirit which is the word of God to grow , but Islam uses the sword of Men to terrorist the world to submission, but you know the Bible says
Matt 26:52 “52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword .” It is Islam that is bound to perish with its sword because it took to sword to terrorise the world this 1400 years.

This prophesy by Jesus will surely be fulfilled on Islam. Watch and see. Any other thing can fail but love never fails.1Cor13:8-13. God message to the world is love and love will live for eternity not hate


Come to Jesus today and you will not perish. John 3:16


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Islam-watch pastor
written by vbv , November 20, 2012
God is a spook created by man and religion became a a handmaiden of this imaginery spook called God to subjugate people ,to humiliate and exploit people, to threaten and rule by imaginery diktats of the socalled God , to trample on the self-esteem of the people by a handful of sanctimonious crooks and the those who hold the eins of power to lead a life of comfort and tyrannise others to submission . God is a nonexisting spook who could "communicate" only with a a handful of scoundrels in the bronze-age. Where is this God , today? With all the advancement of telecommunication, internet, mobile phones, satellite communications, space-age technology,etc , this spook is shit scared to face humans , heh???? Hahahahahahahahaha!!!! This God communicated through a fire in a bush in some craggy hills in the west Asian desert ,or through some delusionery angel"Gabriel" ,but is shit scared of modern humans, heh??? What we have today are nuts who like to fall back on these stone-age spooky tales of God and would like to live in that imaginery regressive ,backward ,superstitious past ,wanting to take everyone to the barbaric existence of the scriptures. These nuts are scoundrels who play on human insecurity and fear of death ,using the religion card to make a lot of moolah and also exercise a lot of influence. No wonder mullahs, padres, swamies, gurus wallow in money : they are filthy rich , and God and religion are good busliness for them.
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Islam-watch Pastor
written by vbv , November 20, 2012
Why should religious institutions , living on donations and illgotten wealth , get tax benefits? Why does God need money? Money is after all a manmade instrument measuring value, used to buy goods and servive , infact an economic tool. God and its institutions cannot survive without this man-made moolah. And the scumbags and leaches who peddle religion and God cannot live without this MONEY. Infact they thrive with this money and hobnob with politicians, bureaucrats, autocrats, monarchs, sheikhs, caliphs, rajas ,etc , looking down on people , exploiting them with the powers that be and pontificate hypocritically from the pulpit , while living vulgarly behind the screen.And this omnipotent "God" is an impotent spook who watches while good people suffer and languish , while these evil scumbags thrive . So much for your imaginery God!
0
written by fineliving56 , November 20, 2012
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by fineliving56 , November 20, 2012

It looks like, you have to give Muslim Kope, a physics lesson …

The news of Evolution has not reached the Muslim world, Yet !

=================
he does not know diffirence between physics and biology
0
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 20, 2012
written by kope , November 20, 2012
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 20, 2012

You said "your cult is dying will never resurrect"

Are you saying that Christianity is a cult like Islam? Why do you think so? Everybody knows that Christianity preaches the message of love to mankind,

=========

are you saying white man preaches the message of love to mankind?
0
Proof
written by non believer , November 20, 2012
Kaser's convincing arguments can not go through the thick skull of Muslims.

Fineliving your hilarious replies to Kope are thoroughly enjoyable. I can see Kope livid whenever you write. You have disproved Mo that women have half intelligence by trouncing Kope.
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vbv - part (i )
written by Kafirwala , November 20, 2012
Your contention is right: there is apparently no God.

The world has seen so many geniuses. Nobody could prove the existence of god. Yes, no genius could till this day prove scientifically or logically that god exists. So long as there is no proof, the inference should be that there is no god. The onus of proof is on the people who positively assert a thing. So believers should prove the existence of god. If they are not able to do that, the meaning is that there is no god; nothing short of it.

But is it the whole truth? Atheists were there from a very long time in the world. But believers in god far outnumbered them always. We can say, some time back i.e two or three generations back, it was not like today. Science was not very much developed. Education was not wide spread as today. People were sort of superstitious and conservative. Yet people were mostly religious and god- fearing. Today the entire scenario has changed. We are today living in a scientific age, a modern age. Everything is within our reach today. All information or the knowledge mankind has amassed over the past centuries is at our fingertips today. All countries in the world have progressed very much. Most of the people are educated today. They are conscious of the progress science has made in everyday life of man and his sphere of knowledge. Man has learnt so many things. Most importantly, he has shed many of his idiosyncrasies, false beliefs and superstitions. But what about his outlook towards God, the existence of whom has not been proven till date? Where does god stand vis-a-vis man's knowledge, his beliefs etc.? The fact is that the believers in god is increasing only day by day. If it is a false belief as vbv claims, the atheists should far outnumber the believers in any society.
0
vbv - part(ii)
written by Kafirwala , November 20, 2012

Is it the case? Just now in the tv, I heard the news that the mountain shrine in my state which is a major pilgrim centre in South India is expected to receive 25 % more pilgrims this year over last year and the authorities are making all arrangements to receive them in right earnest. This is not in isolation. Every pilgrim center in India, irrespective of which religion it belongs to is attracting more no. of devotees every year. Why these modern, educated and science/ techno- savvy people are thronging at all temples/ places of worship? Another factor is the systematic dwindling in the no. of atheists. Recently I asked an atheist friend of mine why there are so few meetings/ functions by them in my state compared to previously, say a decade ago. His straight forward answer was that they are not getting enough people to conduct anything. My state is supposed to be the citadel of leftists in the country and every other person you meet on the street is a communist ( even though history has thrown away Communism into the dustbin, these people are not prepared to admit it, that is another joke ) who is indoctrinated to reject god and religion. But, come the pilgrim season, all these morons will be climbing the hill to the mountain shrine in the prescribed pilgrims' attire and observing all rituals. Their no. is not decreasing, but on the increase only. What vbv, what you have got to say about it?
0
At fine
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 20, 2012
I think abc , malman, RW and Kopey all have been castrated by her....
Made to look small.
0
vbv - part (iii)
written by Kafirwala , November 20, 2012

Now, coming to our main topic. God doesn't exist in the skies. Not in heaven too. He exists in the hearts of the believers, the faithfuls. It is an article of faith. You just cannot measure or evaluate it with your materialistic yardsticks. There is a song in my native language penned by a christian priest. The translation is something like this: I searched for god everywhere. I searched the vast expanse of the skies, the depths of the oceans, I could not find him there. I searched the mountain tops, the valleys, the deserts and the plains, far and wide, nowhere I could him. Disappointed I stopped my search. Then I looked into myself. I looked into my inner self. Wonder of wonders, I found god there. In fact, he was there from the very beginning, but I never knew. Now, I am not sad that I wasted a lot of time, looking for god everywhere, but I am at the pinnacle of happiness, finding that his abode is my heart. I think this is the true feeling of a god- believer. A man needs some beliefs to carry on his life. Life is a struggle and for an ordinary man, he derives some sort of a relief in believing that god is with him in his journey. May be this is the psychology of belief, I am not sure. But, I think there is no point in scoffing at people believing in god. Man lives his life not materialistically alone. He needs some spiritual thoughts too. Perhaps his faith in god provides it. Philosophically looking, that is the way I would like to conclude about the existence of god, which is, I assert again, cannot be proved using any rationale other than faith.
0
Flying Birds, Toasters and everything
written by Gnostic , November 20, 2012
No, kope is wrong with his nice try to solve the contradiction.

Did the bird get his wings from Allah? The answer is of course no because he gets it from the parents but this is not the question here.

16:79. Have they not seen the birds obedient in mid-air? None holdeth them save Allah. Lo! herein, verily, are portents for a people who believe.

The quran does not refer to wings at all. It is suggesting that Allah keeps him in the air, not knowing that the bird can fly by his own. This is even more obvious her:

67:19. Have they not seen the birds above them spreading out their wings and closing them? Naught upholdeth them save the Beneficent. Lo! He is Seer of all things.

This is clearly wrong because even without Allah, the bird can fly as well as insects or helicopters.
0
Kope
written by Malem , November 20, 2012
Brother what you are experiencing is the gang mentality of non-believers, they feel a sense of false power when they can get several of them to repeat the same thing over and over.

As for Birds of flight there are a few instances of this mentioned in the Quran. It is not the Qurans positions to delve into scientific detail of the aerodynamic prinicples behind flight but to state clearly the gift of that flight, the genetics given to birds to allow them to fly, migrate etc. are those provided by Allah. Allah brought life and now it flourishes and grows, that is his plan. The Quran does not say Allah "holds" the bird up in the air, not at all does it say that. It states "Do they not look at The birds, held poised In the midst of (the air And) the sky? Nothing Holds them up but (the power Of) Allah. Verily in this Are Signs for those who believe." "Do they not observe The birds above them, Spreading their wings And folding them in? None can uphold them Except (Allah) Most Gracious: Truly it is He That watches over all things." So it is THROUGH Allahs power that the birds have the capability to fly as the fish have the ability to swim and man to walk. All is part of Allahs plan and quite easy to understand of you read the entire Surah and understand the words clearly.
0
Kope
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 20, 2012
you wrote "are you saying white man preaches the message of love to mankind? "

No sir it was and it is still Jesus who is preaching the message of love to Mankind. Christianity is not white man message, but God message to mankind.

Or are you saying that Arab man preaches the message of love to mankind?

See what is happening everywhere in the Arab world where Islam holds the ace. Is all about war, terrorism, suicide bombings, child abuse, women oppression, minority oppression. Human right abuses. Hatred of unbeliever in the Islamic cult.

I am sure you know that the Quran is Allah’s hate creed to mankind while the Bible is God’s Love letter to mankind. They not the same. The hate creed will perish but love will abide forever. It is not too late for you yet. You can receive God’s gift of Salvation free of charge. All you need to do is to repent and accept Jesus Message of love that he died for your sins so that his blood can atoned for your sins and make forgiveness possible. It is the only way to salvation.

Cheers

0
Shaheed or martyres in Quran.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 20, 2012
Duke Indian. Thank you dear. Your post (Nov. 20) is pleasant. I dont like to be called or considered as religious scholar. I rather abhor them as Jesus Christ did. I am sure you didnt mean offending.

Scholars are otherwise good; A scientists or economists etc. They are contributing for humanity. Quran, too, does not give any importance to them. We can discuss.

Now "Reed Wilson is asking where it is mentioned that jihadists who die in Allah's war against unbelievers or shahids as they are called, do eat food and are actually fed by Allah in Quran.

Yes, DI I am ignorant of that. I hope others will respond to your call. Why dont you ask Sheikh Google?
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> > > your leaders lied to you
> >
> > The "leaders" are politicians. You seem to be saying that they are scientists
> > and philosophers. Today's politicians pander to the masses to win votes.
>
> i was talking about your leader richard dawkin

Richard Dawkins didn't create the evolution theory. Darwin did. And he's not anyone's leader since he was wrong with part of his explanation. Richard Dawkins corrected a few parts of Darwin's explanation, and then David Deutsch corrected a few more parts.

So why do you call any of them a leader? Scientists and philosophers don't "follow" Dawkins. What they do it look for flaws, and then explain how they are flawed, and they might also create a new explanation that doesn't have that flaw.
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 20, 2012
Read-up Kope, you need some science education.
Start with this wikipedia article.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vestigial

Ostrich don't need to fly anymore.
Why? Watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W07_cAigJFI
Ostrich kick ass Kope, they don't need no sissy wings !!!
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> what the reason chicken stop flewing?

Chickens evolved from the Red Junglefowl. The Red Junglefowl flew. Humans bred the Red Junglefowl. We bred them to be bigger, i.e. with more meat -- thus heavier. With the extra weight, chickens can't fly.

Breeding is artificial selection. We do it by imposing artificial selective pressures -- which selects for fit genes over unfit genes. The unfit genes no longer replicate, so they die off and get erased from the gene pool.

In this case, we made the bigger birds breed, and we didn't let the smaller birds breed. So the genes that made the birds bigger replicated a lot, while the genes that made the birds smaller didn't replicate. So we used an artificial selective pressure to make the bigger-bird-gene to replicate -- the fit gene -- and we prevented the smaller-bird-gene from replicating -- the unit gene.
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> he does not know diffirence between physics and biology

What do you mean?

The relevant parts between them is the same. All biological properties are emergent properties -- i.e. properties that emerged from lower levels of universality. In other words...

All cognitive properties can be reduced to their smallest parts. The result? Neural physiology.

All neural physiological properties can be reduced to their smallest parts. The result? Biology.

All biological properties can be reduced to their smallest parts. The result? Chemistry.

All chemical properties can be reduced to their smallest parts. The result? Physics.
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 20, 2012
> are you saying white man preaches the message of love to mankind?

You seem to be saying that all white men think the same. Its false.

The best ideas we have today are not even from a man. They are from a women, Ayn Rand.

She discovered the importance of freedom in all human interactions. That every person should be free to pursue their own happiness without having their freedom infringed upon by others. That every human interaction can and should have no losers -- only winners. Which means that every human interaction can and should be a win/win situation.

Since Rand's era, David Deutsch has furthered this crucial knowledge. He explained these ideas more clearly and he went further by explaining the process by which a person can make every human interaction a win/win situation. This process is known as Common Preference Finding. Its in his book _The Beginning of Infinity_. Here's a brief explanation of it in the context of parenting: http://fallibleliving.com/big-...-seriously
0
To abc
written by Walter Sieruk , November 20, 2012
As for what you keyboarded to me about the writers od the books that I sited. It goes down the the old game play "That if you can't refute the message then attack the messager." As one aid to Walid Shoebat said his messages are so well researched that CAIR though CNN came after him and not what he has to say.
Futhemore, even if I had not sited a book list there is still so much more other sources of information on thuis subject that can prove that the god of Islam is a false god, a pagan moon god
0
Rami
written by Kaser , November 20, 2012
You said:
"Which means that every human interaction can and should be a win/win situation".

You are so right. If only humans stopped forcing upon others their concept of "win".
If humans stopped forcing on others their beliefs, what they think will make the other happy...
For example, I will not force science on anybody - they will come to it willingly.

But Islam forces itself on others on the pretext the others will "win" by joining Islam, when in facts it's the Islam-promoters that are "winning" (in their minds) and the others losing. Losing freedoms and rights that Islam refuses to give them.

Examples of major "losses":
Why does Islam prevents two non-married humans to have sex if they are of sound mind and body?
-Whose f**k**ing business is it to tell a man and a woman they cannot have sex????? The same religion which authorizes a man to have sex with a girl if they are "married"
Why does Islam prevent women from mingling with men?
-Again, imposing rules and regulations on humans. Leave them be!!!!
Why does Islamic countries prevent non-Mulsim from practicing their faith in peace?
-Yes, why? If Islam is the true "light" of god and "perfect", then why do other believers not "flock" to Islam? Why the need to force it on others?
Why does Islam prevent the consumption of Pork?
-Wake-up Muslims, pork is an excellent animal to eat!!! Hmmmmm bacon...
Why does Islam prohibit drinking alcohol?
-Right.... As if Muslims don't drink alcohol... Like Americans did not drink alcohol during the prohibition era in the states.

Those oppressed by Islam always "Lose" because whenever ideologies are forced upon humans, suffering and misery are always present - Islam or otherwise.
This is the reason why it will fail in the west - we are fed-up to our back teeth about oppressive ideologies.
We saw them in the past and destroyed them. Islam is next - but it will take time, it's a different little animal it is....
0
VBV - Your hate creed is also noted
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 20, 2012
VBV You know, I don't like crossing your part in this site. Because your hate creed for the people of the Bible seems to surpass that of the Quran and second to none. This is where your objectivity and rationality was weighted and found wanting.

No rational person that will equate the God of the Bible with that of the Quran. No body says you must believe in God. But to speak irrationally and irreverently of the God of the Bible only show how uncivilised you are. You appear to be fully ignorant of the Bible principle and teachings even though the fruits are there for everyone to see. The love, the peace, the care that is associated with the Bible believing people is evidence of the good source of inspiration of the Bible.
. In the OT God deliver the children of Israel with mighty hand before he demanded obedience from them. The same in the new Testament. Jesus proved himself with signs and wonders which culminated with death and resurrection as prove of divine visitation before he demanded obedience to his commandment. Even today God is working might signs and wonders at the preaching of the Gospel of Christ. But you are blind to all these signs. Islam has no single proofs that is divine .

I am sorry for you.
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Islam-watch Pastor
written by continuum , November 20, 2012
I do not see any difference between OT god and allah...both are vindictive, genocidal maniacs....both order murder of unbelievers. The OT god outdoes allah in ordering even suckling infants to be murdered (1 Samuel 15:3) and even orders raping of underaged girls (Numbers 31:17-18). What kind of god is this? The atrocities ordered by OT god is in noway less than that of allah, in fact exceeds that of allah. Bible, its prophets and god allows sexual slavery of women (Judges 21:10-24 ) and even little pre-pubescent girls (Numbers 31:17-18), genocide of entire towns and cities (Deuteronomy 7:1-2, 20:10-17) …and therefore bible (just as quran), its prophets and its god are absolutely evil for any sane person…
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Kaser
written by Malem , November 20, 2012
Islam forces itself on no one, there is no compulsion in Islam. If you want to come to Islam, please do. If you do not, then you should mind your own business and stop trying to force your way of living on them. If they do not want to drink alcohol, if they want to eat certain foods, if they want to pray several times per day. Who are you to stop them. You see your argument can be used against yourself.
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Message of love.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 20, 2012
Clement Islam-watch Pastor. I notice you are not using your name Clement for sometime. Why? Dont you like it? Your parents gave you this beautiful name. Isnt it?

"Everybody knows that Christianity preaches the message of love to mankind."

You ignore this message which every love story carries.

".....but Islam uses the sword of Men to terrorist the world to submission."

You will not 'sword' in entire Quran. We learn sword from Bible. Gospel of Thomas says:

(16) Jesus said: Perhaps men think that I am come to cast peace upon the world; and they do not know that I am come to cast dissensions upon the earth, fire, sword, war. For there will be five who are in a house; three shall be against two and two against three, the father against the son and the son against the father, and they shall stand as solitaries.

Matthew10:34-39 says:

34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn

“‘a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—
36 a man’s enemies will be the members of his own
household.’[c]

37 “Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.

Imagine Clement 'to turn a man against his father'!! Is this the message of love you mean? You are also turned against your parents and have discarded the name given by them.

You write "Come to Jesus today and you will not perish." John 3:16

This is what St. John thinks. Do you guarantee that?
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Message of love correction.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 20, 2012
You will not find 'sword' in entire Quran.
0
Apology/
written by Reed Wilson. , November 20, 2012
Sorry Kope I played the loose ball from Clement which was for you to answer.

Clement is our fairly senior friend and it was long that I communicated with him.
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Black stone.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 20, 2012
Archpagan. I stated above that Hindus do not worship idols. You know much of Hindu religion as you you know so many things more than me. I was expecting some comment from you.

All those who write about black stone of Kaaba are right. Muslims are really giving undue respect to this stone. I didnt find black stone and even Kaaba in Quran. One Kaaba is there in Quran in pleuran Ka'abain in the sense of ankles.

يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا إِذَا قُمْتُمْ إِلَى الصَّلَاةِ فَاغْسِلُوا وُجُوهَكُمْ وَأَيْدِيَكُمْ إِلَى الْمَرَافِقِ وَامْسَحُوا بِرُءُوسِكُمْ وَأَرْجُلَكُمْ إِلَى الْكَعْبَيْنِ ۚ

"O you who believe! when you rise up to prayer, wash your faces and your hands up to elbows, and wipe your heads and your feet to the ankles" Quran 5:6.

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vbv - existence of god
written by Kafirwala , November 21, 2012

There was a part (iii) to my post. Don't know on what grounds it was grabbed by the admin for scrutiny. It has not been over, I think. Hope before long it will be released.
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references to Ka'aba in Qur'an
written by Yibel , November 21, 2012
The first temple ever built was that at Bakkah (another name for Makkah) Q.3:97
called "A sanctuary of safety" Q.29:65
The House that Ibraheem builds: Q.2:124-127
referred to as Sacred Mosque Q.8:133, 9:28, 48:24, 9:7

"Allah has made the Ka'aba, the Sacred House, the sacred month (Ramadan) and the sacrifical offerings (Eid) with their ornament..." Q.5:98

no fighting at Holy Mosque Q.2:191

referred to as Sacred Temple in 17:1 The Night Journey

qiblah: "Turn your face toward the Holy Mosque..." Q.2:144

Reed Wilson, you really are not a very good Muslim. Even non-Muslims know more about the islamic cult book than you do!
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Reed
written by xyz , November 21, 2012

"All those who write about black stone of Kaaba are right. Muslims are really giving undue respect to this stone"

Your statement should have been " All those who write about black stone of Kaaba are right. Prophet of Islam Muhammad really gave undue respect to this stone"

Am I right??
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Malem
written by xyz , November 21, 2012
"Islam forces itself on no one, there is no compulsion in Islam."

Why Muslims force azaan into a new born's ears??
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Reed
written by xyz , November 21, 2012
"You will not 'sword' in entire Quran."

"Quran 9:5 when the sacred months are over slay them wherever you find them"

Reed can you tell me what weapon Muslims would use to "slay" as per the above command from Allah. Isn't it the sword??

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Reed
written by xyz , November 21, 2012
Quran 3:169

Yusuf Ali: Think not of those who are slain in Allah's way as dead. Nay, they live, finding their sustenance in the presence of their Lord;

Reed, shaheed do eat food provided by Allah as per above ayat.
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Malem
written by Kaser , November 21, 2012
Malem, there is TOTAL, ABSOLUTE, UNCONDITIONAL compulsion in Islam.

Islam is all about SUBMISSION, willing or forcefully. It' ALL ABOUT COMPULSION.

If individuals do not SUBMIT willingly, armed thugs will FORCE them with the sword. COMPULSION Malem - can you even pronounce it?

The only potential area where there is NO compulsion is when non-Muslims SUBMIT to Muslims as Dhimmi and pay the Jizya. Second class citizens as dictated by your unholy Quran.

EVEN THEN, Boko Haram, The Taliban, Ansar Dine, Al-Shabaab ARE ALL ABOUT feverish, foaming at the mouth COMPULSION.
They kill, they maim, they terrorize non Muslims in the name of YOUR religion.

Just because you live in your dreamworld, deluding yourself that there is no compulsion in Islam does not mean it's not prevalent. And your inaction makes you an accomplice.

Islam's COMPULSION brings about its CONTEMPT for non-Muslims, which breeds all the VIOLENCE we see day in, day out.

You are truly a world-class apologist, and a thoroughly incapable of trying to explain to us the "light" of Islam you believe in.
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@ Kaser
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
> You are so right. If only humans stopped forcing upon others their concept of "win".

Sadly, 99.99+% of parents worldwide don't do that with their kids.

Thats why David Deutsch created the parenting philosophy known as Taking Children Seriously.

Freedom was given to blacks in America. Freedom was given to women. Taking Children Seriously is about bringing freedom to the last group of people that haven't yet gotten their right to freedom -- children.
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The delusional great man AKA king of Takyaites tribe (All hail the great Takya Lord) Lyer of Liars
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 21, 2012
RW time you give up your lying and start understanding Quran. Take help from Pickthall, Mohasin Khan, yusuf Ali , Shakir, Shahih Muslim et al instead of eating dust time and again.

9:5 Surat Şād
Pickthall
(Then he said): Bring them back to me, and fell to slashing (with his sword their) legs and necks.
Surat Al-Qamar
Muhsin Khan
But they called their comrade and he took (a sword) and killed (her).
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Infidel and More Dumb
written by Malem , November 21, 2012
Whats the matter lad, Reed has taken you to task and you cannot respond? That is sad, do you generally run home with the ball when you are losing the game as well.

By the way genius Surah 9 is Al Tawbah and 9:5 does not say what you state. Al Sad is 38....Do you just randamly make up things or is it a conscious effort lad?
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Infidel and More Dumb
written by Malem , November 21, 2012
The surahs you list are incorrect and not of what you state is correct either, you genetics are limiting you
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XYZ
written by Malem , November 21, 2012
Azan is to welcome the baby into the world. Its not like we are dipping them in water or something crazy! oh wait a minute theres another religion that does that. Maybe you need to talk with them lad
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Inbred Mal-Man
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 21, 2012
Incorrect Sura in Quran you know better. I always said Quran was incorrect.
Now you have stepped on your nads so whom to blame.
Incorrect in what sword.
Your inbreeding has taken its toll on you.
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Malem
written by Kaser , November 21, 2012
You said:
"Islam forces itself on no one, there is no compulsion in Islam.../snip/... If they do not want to drink alcohol, if they want to eat certain foods, if they want to pray several times per day. Who are you to stop them. You see your argument can be used against yourself..."

But Malem, what if a Muslim WANTS to drink Alcohol... Wants to eat pork... Wants to eat during Ramadan... Why will other Muslims coerce and pressure him/her not to do these things? Would it not be yet another fine example of compulsion in Islam?
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Lies Lies Lies
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 21, 2012
Malman what does relgious police do in Saudi Barbaria?

In case you need a memory jog; They
Round up muslis for prayers.
Make them listen to Friday sermon for 2 hours.
Make sure Muslis and Non Muslis dont eat and drink anything during Ramadan.
Make sure markets are closed during Salat times.
Are they any less muslis or more then the ones you descibed Malman
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Kaser
written by Malem , November 21, 2012
Kaser, I see the issue, you are one of the "I want my cake and eat it to" people. You know the kind that want to eat fatty foods and smoke their entire life, but dont want the heart attack that awaits them. You see lad, Islam, like many thigns in life, takes dedication. You enter it and play by the rules laid out by Allah, no more no less. So you are not a Muslim, so you should not concern yourself with what they do or dont do. Because there is NO compulsion that you join Islam. You can stay the same lost and starving soul you are. You know deed inside you yearn for the love of allah, and it will come on day.

Infidel and pure dumb. Surah 9:5 is And when the sacred months have passed, then kill the polytheists wherever you find them and capture them and besiege them and sit in wait for them at every place of ambush. But if they should repent, establish prayer, and give zakah, let them [go] on their way. Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. and its name is Surah At-Tawbah not Sad...You lad are one large jahsh!
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Kaser ,
written by kope , November 21, 2012
written by Kaser , November 20, 2012

Read-up Kope, you need some science education.
Start with this wikipedia article.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vestigial

Ostrich don't need to fly anymore.
Why? Watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W07_cAigJFI
Ostrich kick ass Kope, they don't need no sissy wings !!!

====================
if ostriich dont need wing, so why they developed wing?
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Malem
written by Kaser , November 21, 2012
You said:
"...You enter it and play by the rules laid out by Allah" That's your opinion Malem.
Rules of Allah = rules made by men. Deal with it.

And Malem, I do not want my cake and eat it too. Do you know what I want?

I want to eradicate all religions from planet earth - through education - and I am not alone.
I want to see men stop killing men based on their imaginary religion.
I want the Boko Haram, the Taliban and others to self-destruct.
I want to see men treat women with the same respect they give other men.
I want to see children protected until they are adults and mature - not used as sex toys or sold as brides.
I want to see the LIKES OF YOU to fall into the dark past of human ignorance and religious fanaticism.

That is all. I will not stop. Ever.

You are the incarnation, Malem, of the religious close-mindedness that drags humans down into ignorance.
Whether or not your are active in oppressing non-Muslims makes no difference.
Your unconditional adoration of Islam, your complete, voluntary blindness to it's evil is the reason why, day in, day out, other Muslims feel empowered by their interpretation of your cult to dispense violence towards non-Muslims... Because you either encourage them, or shut yourself up and do not denounce them.

Look at Islam today:
Acid attacks on women and girls;
Human-bombs;
Shooting church-goers;
Preventing girls from getting education;
Child-brides...

Your Cult is the source of all this.
You should be ashamed at what you see old man, not trying to convince us about the "light" of Islam.

You are a disgrace as a man, and a hypocrite.
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Kope
written by Kaser , November 21, 2012
Evolution does two things Kope-
1- It can reinforce a predominant characteristic. For example, we have, as humans, developed prehensile hands because, over the millennium, they allowed us to develop the ability to manipulate things, build tools and so on. Note that we stopped, a long long time ago, living in trees. We have no more tails. We still have a vestigial tail though, it's not completely gone. Some monkey still have tails and feet that can grab branches - we don't.

2- The Ostrich. It has wings. It probably used them, a long long time ago. It really did not need to fly that much, it ran instead. After millenium and millenium of evolution, it's legs became it's main locomotion method and defensive weapon.

It's called atrophy of disuse. Look it up, very interesting... It means characteristics we do not use will go away in time (like our nails probably). And it means characteristics we do use will increase in time (like our brains, eyes, ect...).
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written by Islam-watch Pastor ,
written by kope , November 21, 2012
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 20, 2012

you wrote "are you saying white man preaches the message of love to mankind? "

No sir it was and it is still Jesus who is preaching the message of love to Mankind. Christianity is not white man message, but God message to mankind.

Or are you saying that Arab man preaches the message of love to mankind?

See what is happening everywhere in the Arab world where Islam holds the ace. Is all about war, terrorism, suicide bombings, child abuse, women oppression, minority oppression. Human right abuses. Hatred of unbeliever in the Islamic cult.

I am sure you know that the Quran is Allah’s hate creed to mankind while the Bible is God’s Love letter to mankind. They not the same. The hate creed will perish but love will abide forever. It is not too late for you yet. You can receive God’s gift of Salvation free of charge. All you need to do is to repent and accept Jesus Message of love that he died for your sins so that his blood can atoned for your sins and make forgiveness possible. It is the only way to salvation.

Cheers

=======================


pastor

look what christianity produced nations of sodomized

even children are not save from christians preachers
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Reed Wilson
written by Duke Indian , November 21, 2012

Thank you Reed for the compliments.

Thank you, xyz for quoting the exact verse from Quran where Allah declares, the shahids are not dead, but Allah sustains them.

In my native language translation of Quran, 3: 169 is translated like this: Don't you think that those who are slain in Allah's way are dead. They are alive in their lord. They get food too.

Reed, what do you say now? What is wrong when I say that shahids are fed by Allah? Please clarify.
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kaser
written by malem , November 21, 2012
Kaser, yes you will stop as children grow up they move on to other things quickly, my guess is your little attnetion span will move on soon. You cannot win here. Islam will grow, in your backyard, and you will not and cannor do anything about :) that's just the way it is lad.
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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
> if ostriich dont need wing, so why they developed wing?

The ostrich evolved from an ancestor that flew -- which is why we call an ostrich a bird.
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...
written by kope , November 21, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012

> if ostriich dont need wing, so why they developed wing?

The ostrich evolved from an ancestor that flew -- which is why we call an ostrich a bird.

===============

what the reason ostrich ancestor that flew ?
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@ Malem
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
> But Malem, what if a Muslim WANTS to drink Alcohol... Wants to eat pork... Wants to eat during Ramadan... Why will other Muslims coerce and pressure him/her not to do these things? Would it not be yet another fine example of compulsion in Islam?

Malem and other muslims would not consider coercion as compulsion. That is one of their inconsistencies.

They think that compulsion is only physical force, physical violence, physical punishment and threats of those things.

Or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Malem doesn't consider threats as compulsion.
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This is Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 21, 2012
This is Rami Rustom

Or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Malem doesn't consider threats as compulsion.

===============

rami you are grown up man ?



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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
> what the reason ostrich ancestor that flew ?

Variation created genes for feathers and properties needed for flight.

Natural selection selected the fit genes over the unfit genes.
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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
>> Or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Malem doesn't consider threats as compulsion.
>
> rami you are grown up man ?

Why is that important to what I said? If I was 10 years old, would that make my statements less meaningful?

Or did you think I was joking? If so, I wasn't joking.

If you didn't think I was joking, then why did you ask me that question?
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Kasab
written by Truth , November 21, 2012
Pakistani terrorist Ajmal Aamir Kasab was hanged in India today
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Malem
written by xyz , November 21, 2012

"written by Malem, November 21, 2012
Azan is to welcome the baby into the world. Its not like we are dipping them in water or something crazy! oh wait a minute theres another religion that does that. Maybe you need to talk with them lad"

Azan is not welcome the baby into the world. It is forced welcome to Islam Allah and Muhammad if you have ever read azan and its meaning lad.

All religions who force there dogmas to new born's are to be condemned.
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Malem the Lad
written by xyz , November 21, 2012
"Infidel and pure dumb. Surah 9:5 is And when the sacred months have passed, then kill the polytheists wherever you find them and capture them and besiege them and sit in wait for them at every place of ambush. But if they should repent, establish prayer, and give zakah, let them [go] on their way. Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. and its name is Surah At-Tawbah not Sad...You lad are one large jahsh!"

Malem lad read your above statement (from Quran ) again. It clearly says " my way or highway"

Don't say ever again there is no compulsion in Islam . To me seems like you don't understand simple quranic compulsive threats for non Muslims.
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To .. Non believer and Infidel
written by fineliving56 , November 21, 2012
I have to say … The last conversation I had with Muslim Kope, I got the feeling he was squirming and boiling …

I understand …Muslims hate us, ex Muslims, more then they ever hated Jew, Christians and atheists, put together

"' To them, our existence, represents *Islam's failure into keeping it's people interested and devoted * .''

For Kope, … I must have stepped on something sensitive in him, to react that way … I am used to it due … I learned to shrug Muslim's insults all my life.

Non believer … I am glad you find my posts hilarious …I am sure you know, I do not need to try too hard, considering the subject at hand …. lol

Infidel … I actually could not come with a reply to your post … lol
0
The Sword word IS mentioned and who ever say it is not is '' li@r
written by fineliving56 , November 21, 2012
At least twice …

The actual word is not mentioned but a synonymous is : …'' Fa'aaqar ''

Q/ 54/29 :

'' but they called their companion, and he took SWORD and HAMSTRUNG HER ''

The word in question is the word : '' Fata'ata fa'aaqar ''

Fata'ata means '' took in Hand '' … and fa' aaqar '' … means …'' to cutoff a humen or an animal behind the knee ''

The word Sward is not used becouse it does not have to … the sentence means to say '' the man took a sward and cut her off by the back of the knee '' hamstrung her '' .

There is others similar to that one …

If you a research on Quran and you type the words '' cut off hands …or cut off legs .. or ..cut off heads .. you will find out that hundreds of Aya, talk about cutting off body parts .

I like to know, what other tool to use to cut heads, hand and arms, other then SWORDS ?/!!

Reed has been trying, too hard to beautify Quran …and for the last three a half years I have been posting I have seen his efforts have no results :

Quran is still UGLY

No amount of make - up applied on the face of Quran could make it less ugly …
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Kope,
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 21, 2012
Your brother Reed Wilson Came to your rescue you and was misfiring Quoting out of context. The so called sword verses of the Bible, there is no example of it either by Jesus or his disciples up-to-date, even when his disciples wanted to defend him with their sword what did he tell them. Matt 26:52 “52 Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.”
All those teachings of hate by Jesus are not to be taken literally but metaphorically meant stare up serious commitment and consecration for the sake of the Gospel even to the point of death. At any case have ever heart of honour killing in the name of Christ, Parent hating or killing their children in Christianity? Reed was only being deceptive as usual,thinking that the people here are ignorant fellows not knowing the true teachings and practice of the scriptures. Even if you don’t know the Bible look around the people who believe the Bible and you will see Christianity in action. Just as you see Islam in action all over the world which is a better interpretation of the Quran.

98% of the terrorist organisation of the world goes by name Isamic........ Have you heard of Christian Jihadist, Christian revolutionist, Christian warriors all in the name of fighting for the sake of their religious beliefs? Even if there are , it cannot be because the Bible enjoin them to do so as is the case with the Quran. So don’t be deceived by Reed Wilson.
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Reed Wilson
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 21, 2012
I have not abandoned my name, but I think people here know me as the Pastor and the only IW Pastor but most importantly you can save space by simply write the Pastor. I don’t think your parent gave you the name Reed, but whatever name that was given you, is not important here. We know you in IW as Reed Wilson.
Secondly you appear to be economical with true by saying that there is no Sword verse in the Quran. I will resist the temptation Quotes several verses from your scriptures for you, because I know you have own interpretation for them even Q9:5 is not a sword verse according to Sheik Reed Wilson.

But we don’t need your interpretation anyway to know the core teachings of Mohammed and his Quran. All you need to do is to read the Islamic History from inception to date, and look at the life of people and nations who believe Mohammed’s hallucination called the Quran. The intolerance, the violence, the manslaughter, the war, the assassinations, the terrorisms, the bombings, the women beating, women oppression, the child Abuses, the polygamy, slavery and “Holy prostitution” the hatred of the Jews and unbeliever that is part of the Islamic creed, that is going on among the Islamic nations and as practiced by the faithful Muslim all over the world is enough and a better interpretation of the Quran than ten thousands sermons of the religion of peace by Sheik Reed Wilson.

Sooth yourself with self delusion and refuse to repent and come out of that evil cult, call Islam.
You . entitle to self determination. The decision you take now concerning the Bible or Quran will determines your destiny.

Cheers.
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My omission.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
Yibel. You write "Reed Wilson, you really are not a very good Muslim. Even non-Muslims know more about the islamic cult book than you do!

I will not contest that statement. In your post 'refence to kaba in Quran' you mention Q.5:98 as under

"Allah has made the Ka'aba, the Sacred House, the sacred month (Ramadan) and the sacrificial offerings (Eid) with their ornament..."

There seems some mistake Yibel. I give Q.5:98 below:

اعْلَمُوا أَنَّ اللَّـهَ شَدِيدُ الْعِقَابِ وَأَنَّ اللَّـهَ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ

It is however in 5:97 the translation of which you have given. Thank you for pointing out. I was not sure of it. I should not be proud of knowledge.

Yibel sacred is not correct translation of الْحَرَامَ in Arabic. It rather means 'forbidden'. Most of the translators has done as sacred. It is their mistake. Forbidden in the sense that there are some restrictions there or certain things are forbidden there. We were not discussing this anyway.

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Continuum,
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 21, 2012
Continuum,

My friend you appear a new poster here, I hope you are not the type that hit and run. You wrote

" I do not see any difference between OT god and Allah...both are vindictive, genocide maniacs....both order murder of unbelievers."

Before I respond to your observations, can you please answer this questions. Do you know why the Bible is made up of 2 Testaments, the Old and the New? Have you read the New Testament before, especially the Gospels? Have you read the the Quran and Hadits before? Can give an example of the similarity between the Quran and the Bible as you alleged.

It is not enough to just give one sided quotations without quoting from the Quran and say they are similar.

I am waiting for your response.
0
...
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
fineliving56. Thanks for confirming that sword is not there in Quran. Also for telling me why the word SWORD was not used there. The humanity could know sword from Bible which was in existence before Quran.

Fin, if sword were there, Quran was not ugly nor it is my duty to 'beautify' it. Else, I will become author of Quran because it is authors prerogative to make changes in his book.

You ask "I like to know, what other tool to use to cut heads, hand and arms, other then SWORDS ?/!!

There could be other tools or even swords. I give a passage from Quran:

فَلَمَّا سَمِعَتْ بِمَكْرِهِنَّ أَرْسَلَتْ إِلَيْهِنَّ وَأَعْتَدَتْ لَهُنَّ مُتَّكَأً وَآتَتْ كُلَّ وَاحِدَةٍ مِّنْهُنَّ سِكِّينًا وَقَالَتِ اخْرُجْ عَلَيْهِنَّ ۖ فَلَمَّا رَأَيْنَهُ أَكْبَرْنَهُ وَقَطَّعْنَ أَيْدِيَهُنَّ وَقُلْنَ حَاشَ لِلَّـهِ مَا هَـٰذَا بَشَرًا إِنْ هَـٰذَا إِلَّا مَلَكٌ كَرِيمٌ

Those women did not use sword. They used sikkin.

I was wondering you will catch me on Ka'aba. Yibel took the lead.

Munazra culture is outdated and out of fashion. It is rather considered backwardness. Academic discussions with some fun are beautiful. Duh-swami has mastery on it. Machmoed did not answer you. He is also expert.

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NO SWORD.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
Infidel and More Proud. You write "RW time you give up your lying and start understanding Quran. Take help from Pickthall, Mohasin Khan, yusuf Ali , Shakir, Shahih Muslim et al instead of eating dust time and again.

9:5 Surat Şād
Pickthall
(Then he said): Bring them back to me, and fell to slashing (with his sword their) legs and necks.
Surat Al-Qamar
Muhsin Khan
But they called their comrade and he took (a sword) and killed (her).

Thanks for the translations. You will always find the sword within brackets. That is why I prefer quoting text. I think it is an offense to use sword there. All the learned translators, if at all they are, shall be questioned.

Malem. Thank you.
0
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
written by kope , November 21, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012

>> Or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Malem doesn't consider threats as compulsion.
>
> rami you are grown up man ?

Or did you think I was joking? If so, I wasn't joking.

If you didn't think I was joking, then why did you ask me that question?
===================
man

you need to learn how to talk
0
Islam-watch Pastor
written by continuum , November 21, 2012
My friend you appear a new poster here, I hope you are not the type that hit and run.


My friend, I am pretty old to this site, almost from the very beginning of this website..

Before I respond to your observations, can you please answer this questions. Do you know why the Bible is made up of 2 Testaments, the Old and the New?


????

simple...old testament is a collection of texts consisting of mixture of history and religious belief of Jews. New testament is made up by Christians twisting/interpreting so called "Old testament"...

Have you read the New Testament before, especially the Gospels?


Quite well dude...and know well none of its teachings go well with teachings of the "old testament"...

Have you read the the Quran and Hadits before?


yes indeed

Can give an example of the similarity between the Quran and the Bible as you alleged.


Where should I start?

Lets start with rape of women and kids?

Deuteronomy 20:10-14

10. When you approach a city to wage war against it, you shall propose peace to it.
11. And it will be, if it responds to you with peace, and it opens up to you, then it will be, [that] all the people found therein shall become tributary to you, and they shall serve you.
12. But if it does not make peace with you, and it wages war against you, you shall besiege it,
13. and the Lord, your God, will deliver it into your hands, and you shall strike all its males with the edge of the sword.
14. However, the women, the children, and the livestock, and all that is in the city, all its spoils you shall take for yourself, and you shall eat the spoils of your enemies, which the Lord, your God, has given you.
15. Thus you shall do to all the cities that are very far from you, which are not of the cities of these nations.
16. However, of these peoples' cities, which the Lord, your God, gives you as an inheritance, you shall not allow any soul to live.
17. Rather, you shall utterly destroy them: The Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivvites, and the Jebusites, as the Lord, your God, has commanded you.
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Who is SHAHEED.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
Duke Indian. I wished you quoted 3:169. Any the verse is as follows:

وَلَا تَحْسَبَنَّ الَّذِينَ قُتِلُوا فِي سَبِيلِ اللَّـهِ أَمْوَاتًا ۚ بَلْ أَحْيَاءٌ عِندَ رَبِّهِمْ يُرْزَقُونَ

Where SHAHEED and where eating or feeding?

"In my native language translation of Quran, 3: 169 is translated like this: Don't you think that those who are slain in Allah's way are dead. They are alive in their lord. They get food too."

This is tolerable translation. I dont know which Arabic in text means food. Where SHAHEED and where eating or feeding?

Let Quran tell you who is shaheed. I read 4:69 for you.

وَمَن يُطِعِ اللَّـهَ وَالرَّسُولَ فَأُولَـٰئِكَ مَعَ الَّذِينَ أَنْعَمَ اللَّـهُ عَلَيْهِم مِّنَ النَّبِيِّينَ وَالصِّدِّيقِينَ وَالشُّهَدَاءِ وَالصَّالِحِينَ ۚ وَحَسُنَ أُولَـٰئِكَ رَفِيقًا

"And whoever obeys Allah ie the Message - those will be with the ones upon whom Allah has bestowed favor of the prophets, the steadfast affirmers of truth, the martyrs(الشُّهَدَاءِ) and the righteous. And excellent are those as companions.

Arabic الشُّهَدَاءِ is pleural of shaheed.

Duke Indian, use of shaheed for those who die in way of Allah is invention of Hadees. Why? Perhaps to belittle Muhammad who did not die in way of Allah or in a battle. One cannot be sure of intentions. Logic supports my claim.

Duke I dont blame the author for 'misleading beliefs', it hadis, the literature revered by the misguided muslims who abandoned Quran.

"Reed, what do you say now? What is wrong when I say that shahids are fed by Allah? Please clarify."

I hope it is clear now.
0
xyz
written by malem , November 21, 2012
Doesn't it get old when someone has to repeat the same answer to you? If you read Surah 9, the entire thing you would see the agreement the Muslims had with the others was a truce for several months, if the others violated the Muslims would have no choice to protect themselves. So there is no compulsion in that statement rather just a defensive clause.

Azan is a welcome statement into the world, I know as it was stated to each of my children and several grandchildren.
0
Islam-watch Pastor
written by continuum , November 21, 2012
Note Deutoronomy 20:10-11: The verses clearly are exactly same as Islamic Jizya (tributary). If the city does not surrender, then besiege it and destroy it (just as Mushrikun destroyed).

Sahih Muslim (19:4294) - "When you meet your enemies who are polytheists (which includes Christians), invite them to three courses of action. If they respond to any one of these, you also accept it and withhold yourself from doing them any harm. Invite them to (accept) Islam; if they respond to you, accept it from them and desist from fighting against them ... If they refuse to accept Islam, demand from them the Jizya. If they agree to pay, accept it from them and hold off your hands. If they refuse to pay the tax, seek Allah's help and fight them"

What is Islam's position on women and kids during war?

O Prophet! surely We have made lawful to you your wives whom you have given their dowries, and those whom your right hand possesses out of those whom Allah has given to you as prisoners of war… [Quran 33:50]

Deuteronomy 20:14 confirms the same...

How is OT god any different than allah? both have demonic characteristics...
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rami
written by malem , November 21, 2012
Is this not the week you and the others in the west celebrate the genocide of the american indian that you slaughtered and stole their lands? Funny how you don't hold yourself to the same standards you do others. Maybe you should have other holiday that celebrate enslavement of african man! And you are trying to tell the world how to behave hahaha
0
Continuum,
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 21, 2012
Continuum,
Thank you very much for the prompt and precise way you responded to my enquiry.

I am afraid if your preconceived ideas and belief will allow you to understand what I am going to tell. For instance you said “New testament is made up by Christians twisting/interpreting so called "Old testament". With such mind set it will be difficult to understand the New Testament. Your example of similarity between the OT and the Islamic scriptures noted. But there are a few things needed to take note of :
1.The command to Israel to kill and take possession was not an open ended command for all times. It has boundary and directed to specific people at a particular time, but the Quran is all time command.

2.In fact Israel fought their wars for the specific land given to them by their God to dwell in. They are not even allow to take captive of anything inside that boundary whether human or beast, all to be destroyed but what you quoted from the Bible only referred to conquest outside to promise land. That was when there were allow taking captive women, children and beast and even having a tributary. But Islam is not so it was to amass empire and conquer land from Mecca to Spain and to India and to conquer the world. The Jews were not known for empire conquest; even today they are fighting to possess the same piece of land given to them by God and nothing more.

The Arabs on the other hand have left their Lands which are 1000 times larger than that of Jews yet they will not allow them to live peacefully without sending rockets and suicide bombers on a daily basis and want to take from the Jews even that tiny piece of land that they have. How can you say this have same spirit.
0
@ Malem
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
> Is this not the week you and the others in the west celebrate the genocide of the american indian that you slaughtered and stole their lands? Funny how you don't hold yourself to the same standards you do others. Maybe you should have other holiday that celebrate enslavement of african man! And you are trying to tell the world how to behave hahaha

What do you mean *I* slaughtered? I wasn't alive back then.

Or are you referring to my ancestors? My ancestors are from Cyprus, Turkey, Syria and Saudi Arabia.
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
>>>> Or maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Malem doesn't consider threats as compulsion.
>>>
>>> rami you are grown up man ?
>>
>> Or did you think I was joking? If so, I wasn't joking.
>> If you didn't think I was joking, then why did you ask me that question?
>
> you need to learn how to talk

If you think that my writing style or content is objectively bad, then point out the flaw you see and explain why you think its a flaw -- i.e. give me a criticism. Then I'll consider your criticism.
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continuum - in addition
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 21, 2012
In addition
3.The Old Testament God is a Miracle working God and proved himself with signs and wonders both in war front and among the children of Israel. Most of the killing is done by his miraculous intervention, but Allah is not known to perform any miracle all the killing and destructions are the handiwork of the Jihadist- Mohammed gangsters.

4.In the Old Testament the captive women are allowed one month to mourn their beloved ones before they can take as wives. This is humane, but it is not so in Islam, Mohammed was known to lead in banging captive women the everyday he slaughtered their husbands.

5.You accused the Christians that they twisted the Jewish scriptures to establish Christianity. What of if you read the Gospel of Christ preach by Prophet Isaiah 500 years before Christ in Isaiah 9:6, 53:1-12 and Micah 5:2 and that of Prophet Daniel in Dan 9:24-27 What of John the Baptist who preached his gospel before Jesus Christ he was not a Christian. Read John 1:29 .

Will this change your perception of the New Testament?

You appear like an intelligent guy, please put some objectivity in your assessment of the two. I am not talking of religion now. Look at the two in the light of how the two affects human civilisation and humanity generally and then access them.

Regards
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Rami
written by Malem , November 21, 2012
Yet you live in the the lands that are theirs and celebrate their demise.....From Turkey? Wait a minute, didnt you guys greet the Armenians the same way? Theres a definite pattern developing here....then again one wonders why you cant understand Arabic.mmmm sounds like another story, like your big business ventures.
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Malem
written by Kaser , November 21, 2012
Malem, then why don't all Muslims vacate Egypt?
It was not a Muslim state until it got invaded. Get outta there you genocidal maniac!!!

Malem, how do you feel about these towering symbols of a past culture that lived without any "light of Islam" - the marvels they built?
What if THEY were right about religion Malem, and Islam is all wrong???

After all, the ancient Egyptians were brilliant architects and engineers...
And they left all these non-Islamic monuments to their non-Islamic culture - all devoted to something other than your make-believe Allah?
0
To abc, again
written by Walter Sieruk , November 21, 2012
Oneman who I didn't site above is Dr. Daniel Shayesth, who in times past was both a Muslim and a Hezbollah member but now a Christian. I was just wondering are you going to try to trash him too because the message that he gives is not refutable. For he also exposed the Islamic god to be a pagan moon god in his book ISLAM AND THE SON OF GOD. For on pages 7,8 he explains that "Allah is identified as one of the 360 or so idols worshiped by the Arabian people for centuries before Muhammad was born. many do not know that Allah was the moon god of the Arabians. This explains the cresent moon found on the minarets of mosques and flags of Muslim nations."
0
re: above
written by Gnostic , November 21, 2012
Now the time has come to show that there are not only islamic fundamentalists but also the christians ones and that their nonsense is not better than the other.

Under point 5. you are repeating the christian view that Jesus was already announced in the Old Testament. This is very funny but not true since the New Testament was written later referring to the OT in order to let it look like this way. It is that easy!

In fact the gospels are not historical accounts but consisting by a large amount on quotes from the OT.

There are hardly any historical facts about Jesus, in the NT if any.

The quran is not better in this regard but even worse. There is nothing new but many christian views are repeated: That he was born by a virgin, performed miracles, even that he was the messias and raised to heaven.

There is even the nonsense story that he created birds.

Why is this nonsense? I will explain: This story is apokryphal and was written relatively late with the intention to show that Jesus as a boy could create birds just the same way god did with Adam according to bible and quran. The intention was to suggest that Jesus is like god.

However, this contradicts the quranic view that Jesus is different from god. Thats why the quran elaborates that Jesus did this with the permission of Allah instead simply revealing that the whole story is only fiction!

The reason why the authors if the quran rewrote the story in the way they did is probably superstition or it would have been too difficult to convince the communities that the story never took place.
0
WOW … the level of dishonesty of Muslim REED
written by fineliving56 , November 21, 2012
Yes….. '' black is white '' … Reed want us to believe that .. I am convinced it is pointless to talk him seriously .

It is absolutely ridiculous to go in any conversation with The Muslim Reed, who Li6s in each and every post of his ..

There is many words to convey the word ''SWARD '' and cutting in Arabic just like any other language … and the fact that Reed does not admit that, makes me feel sorry for him and his hours long efforts in his research of Quran is waisted .

In the English language there is, 65 words that to convey the words ''Sword '' .. and the Arabic language is no different …'' Fa'aqara '' in Quran convey a kill by a sword … you want to li6 … go a head …

but EVERY ONE HERE KNOWS , HE LIE IN EVERY POST HE POST…

I have NO patience for this kind of dissipation … it is discouraging and pointless …

When Reed is ready to be truthful and I would feel he cares about bring bringing out the truth, I will address him … I despise li@ing and li@res …. it annoy me to no end .

But that does not mean I will show his li@s ever time I catches it …

Machmoed was an intelligent honest man, I do not know why he does not post anymore .. may be he got sick of the li@s he sow Muslims are posting on a regular bases … I hope he is well .

To All

** How do you cut a watermelon ? …. in Reed dishonest thinking … Not with a sword/ knife … No….. with a AIR ** ….. hahaha

The length Muslims would go to justify the filth and atrocities in Quran … is beyond anyone imagination .



0
Islam-watch Pastor
written by Continuum , November 21, 2012
Dear friend,

Your arguments do not add anything new to my understanding at all. My argument was god of OT is as evil as allah. Time frame and geography affected is NOT in question here, but the similarity in violence and abusive nature of these gods, yahway and allah.

FYI Noahide laws requires the whole world follow it, for example idolatry is to be avoided and if Noahide laws are implemented, idolators will be beheaded as per Jewish laws.

2.In fact Israel fought their wars for the specific land given to them by their God to dwell in. They are not even allow to take captive of anything inside that boundary whether human or beast, all to be destroyed but what you quoted from the Bible only referred to conquest outside to promise land.


How can you coldly justify these kind of barbaric acts, whether it is localized act or global?

Really how does it make any better when you kill all the inhabitants of a so called "promised land"? Do you realize that it includes suckling infants and innocent children? How is this different from islamic killing in terms of ethics or morality?

The size of land captured or time frame does not make any difference to my question on ethics or morality?

Ethnic cleansing is wrong whether in past or present, whether it is localized or global...If your argument is justified, then ethnic cleansing of Jews will also be justified as it is localized.

That was when there were allow taking captive women, children and beast and even having a tributary.


So biblical god does order raping and capturing women for sexual satisfaction of desert dwelling barbarians, just because it is your religion, but the same done by muslims is intolerable for you.

Both OT and koran are satanic books and worthy of reproach and utter contenpt from decent people.

4.In the Old Testament the captive women are allowed one month to mourn their beloved ones before they can take as wives. This is humane, but it is not so in Islam, Mohammed was known to lead in banging captive women the everyday he slaughtered their husbands
.

Are you kidding me? So waiting to rape captured females for a month makes bible right according to you? Sex slaves have no option here but to become concubines andpiece of meat to desert barbarians, in this case primitive jews of yesteryear.

If this is the morality Christians like you imbibe from bible, then you hypocrites have no right to criticize muslims for their actions. I know many Christians, like muslimes justiify horrific crimes in OT, just because it is their religion, but with a forked tongue criticize nuslims which essentially say the same thing as per their belief.
0
Islam-watch Pastor
written by Continuum , November 21, 2012
3.The Old Testament God is a Miracle working God and proved himself with signs and wonders both in war front and among the children of Israel. Most of the killing is done by his miraculous intervention, but Allah is not known to perform any miracle all the killing and destructions are the handiwork of the Jihadist- Mohammed gangsters.


oh... the miracles....now that makes biblical god's order to capture women and use them as sex slaves right...orders to commit genocide of entire towns and cities justifiable...I am reminded of muslim hadiths claiming about miracles...

I wonder how difficult it is for a miracle working god to create a planet for Jews separately instead of asking them to go for war with entire cities populations eliminated or for the matter to transfer the filthy goyim or unbelievers to a different planet?

5.You accused the Christians that they twisted the Jewish scriptures to establish Christianity. What of if you read the Gospel of Christ preach by Prophet Isaiah 500 years before Christ in Isaiah 9:6, 53:1-12 and Micah 5:2 and that of Prophet Daniel in Dan 9:24-27


Isaiah,Micah etc...simple....since these texts already existed, it is a simple step to manufacture "new testament" to fit these texts or at the least to misinterpret them...as "new testament" came after "old testament"...I will not even asnwer John 1:29 as it requires no answer at all..

Will this change your perception of the New Testament?


Not likely..

You appear like an intelligent guy, please put some objectivity in your assessment of the two.


I think that is what you should do, not me...

I am not talking of religion now. Look at the two in the light of how the two affects human civilization and humanity generally and then access them.


ahh....did you forget the dark ages and how the jews were forced to live in ghettos in Europe? What about inquisition against jews? Minorities like Jews, gypsies etc. were treated like crap, just as muslims in islamic countries treat jews and other minorities today. Slaughter of Jews (calling them as jeebus killers) in christian Europe was common in middle ages.

The world today is better as most of Western civilization came out of the grips of old superstitious biblical world...not because of bible, but despite the bible..majority of western people of this world do not believe to the word literally (thank god, pun intended), but give their own twisted interpretation.When the world rids itself of the three desert religions, life in this world will be better and peaceful.

Regards..
0
No confrontation.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
Clement, the Pastor. I enjoyed your "VBV I don’t want to confront you, but as usual you are wrong." You are amusing as usual.
0
Reed is l@ing again as always
written by fineliving56 , November 21, 2012
4:69 … IS not what REED said … he is aN employed Muslim li@er

The right translation :

'' AND WHO EVER OBEY ALLAH AND ** THE MESSENGER … "" … not '' **the message ***

AL RASSOL in that Aya … to means MUHAMMAD ***THE PROPHET ***

AL RISSALH means *** The message ****


Reed is li@ing … He knows the difference because I told him before many time … he is using ** the lost in translation issue** to try to fool people here because they do not know Arabic … I am sick of him and his LI@S .

WHAT IS SO WRONG ** that the Muslims Arab who knows the Arabic Language and they know I am right ** do not correct him oh his deliberate errors ???!!

But I am here …. And I will EXPOSE ALL HIS LI@S .
0
...
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
fineliving. You write "** How do you cut a watermelon ? …. in Reed dishonest thinking … Not with a sword/ knife … No….. with a AIR ** ….. hahaha".

We started with 'there is no word sword in Quran. No lies there. You are digressing.
0
Reed
written by Duke Indian , November 21, 2012

'use of shaheed for those who die in way of Allah is invention of Hadees. Why? Perhaps to belittle Muhammad who did not die in way of Allah or in a battle. One cannot be sure of intentions. Logic supports my claim.'

No, Reed, I just cannot agree with you. The meaning of the word 'shaheed' is martyr. I don't know about Arabic, but in hindi and urdu, shaheed stands for martyr. One who lays down his life for a given cause. When the jihadist who takes part in violence and in the violence if he loses his life, he is a shaheed. Becuse, he has laid down his life for the cause 'jihad". Only a twister and/or an obfuscator can translate the word as companion. I outright reject your translation and consider it as nothing short of deliberate falsification.

As regards your contention that there is no feeding or eating in the verse 3:119, you have already acknowledged that , "Don't you think that those who are slain in Allah's way are dead. They are alive in their lord. They get food too." is a tolerable translation. What do you mean by 'they get food too.' ? Allah is providing food to them and they eat too. What else is the meaning? How can you say both feeding and eating are not there? This is also another example of your usual falsification of Quran verses.
0
@ Malem
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 21, 2012
> Yet you live in the the lands that are theirs and celebrate their demise.....From Turkey? Wait a minute, didnt you guys greet the Armenians the same way? Theres a definite pattern developing here....then again one wonders why you cant understand Arabic.mmmm sounds like another story, like your big business ventures.

You're confused again. I'm not the one with the big business ventures.

I note also that you've never criticized my understanding of Arabic or any Quranic verse. You've evaded every one of my questions and criticisms of Quranic verses.
0
Bible is NOT Torah and Injil.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 21, 2012
Brookan. This time your article is different. I am wondering if you were the author. Quite many unfounded claims are found there. May I enumerate some:

You write "The holy Qur’an assures more than once that the Holy Bible (Old and New Testaments) was descended from God Himself:

I am sorry to say that not even once. Bible is a man made name which is not found even in Bible itself.

You continue as "It describes the holy Bible also as (Al Zekr Al Hakim), i.e. the message, in its statement: "Before thee, also, the messengers we sent were but men, to whom we granted inspiration: if ye realize this not, ask of those who possess the message (Al Zekr)" [Quran 21:7], and "This is the message (Al Zekr) of those with me, and message (Al Zekr) of those before me" [Surah Al Anbiyaa 21:24]."

Sorry it is not truth. God did send Torah and Injil.Do you consider OT and NT as Torah and Injil? The OT is often translated as Injil but it contains so many Injils such as Gospels of Mark, Matthew, Luke and John. Which of them is referred as Gospel or Injil in Quran?

You continue as "The Qur’an also admits that God preserves the Bible because it is descended by Him, i.e. His (Tanzeel): "We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption)." [Quran 15:9]."

It is again far from being the fact. I read Quran 15:9-10

ِنَّا نَحْنُ نَزَّلْنَا الذِّكْرَ وَإِنَّا لَهُ لَحَافِظُونَ ﴿٩﴾ وَلَقَدْ أَرْسَلْنَا مِن قَبْلِكَ فِي شِيَعِ الْأَوَّلِين

"I myself have revealed this reminder and I am its Protector. (9) We sent Messengers to the ancient people who lived before you."

The reminder or Al Zikr can never be Bible AT/OT as it refers to earlier messages.

These four Gospels refer a Gospel which is none of them. The Gospel of Luke starts with

"Many have undertaken to draw up an account of the things that have been fulfilled[a] among us, 2 just as they were handed down to us by those who from the first were eyewitnesses and servants of the word. 3 With this in mind, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, I too decided to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, 4 so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught."

Therefore, Brookan, these Gospels are based on memory of St. Luke, Matthew, Mark and Luke. How can these qualify as Injil?

Our Yibel is scholar in chief of Christianity and Islam. He does not recognize Gospel or Gospels as Injil.

0
...
written by Reed Wilson. , November 22, 2012
Duke Indian. You write "No, Reed, I just cannot agree with you. The meaning of the word 'shaheed' is martyr."

I have given enough explanation. I will not press on my view. I will not make you agree. You know that shaheed or martyr is not there in respective verse.
0
I am challenging the Arabic speaking MUSLIMS readers here :
written by fineliving56 , November 22, 2012
Why don't, you act like dissent and truthful MEN and SAY the dissent and truthful,thing ,

when you read GRAMMATICALLY WORNG Arabic, used by non arab Muslims HERE in their post .

I mean how could YOU STAY quiet when REED THE DREED, make the clear and obvious

grammar mistake when he says this :

The Arabic word :

'' Al RASOOL '' AS a noun …. which means [ AS HE WRONGLY SAYES '' … a '' THING ''…'' A MESSAGE ''

Whish it is not ..

In fact …. AL RISALAH …means '' the massage '' and NOT the messenger ''

I challenge any of you Muslim readers to actually be MEN and come out and CONFIRM, what, he says is WORNG …

And what I said IS THE RIGHT GRAMMAR of the word messenger .

let us see who is going to start ?!



0
Why Theism is wrong!
written by Gnostic , November 22, 2012
Perhaps the worst thing of theism in general and islam in particular is the fatalism. Islam teaches, and most muslims believe, that all and everything is in the hand of Allah. Even a bird cannot fly without Allahs permission.

The human is nothing and without any capability according to islam. Better to pray than to try to do something. This is the reason why the islamic world is so poor and nothing will ever improve.
0
Fineliving
written by Malem , November 22, 2012
You might want to make sure you are correct before you go telling others they are wrong, especially given your lack of proper quranic arabic knowledge
0
Kope
written by Truthseeker , November 22, 2012
You said

most of bible writen by paul and church

The bible was written by God using men as His tools. Paul never taught anything that differed from the gospels or Old Testament
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Malam
written by fineliving56 , November 22, 2012
I am sure a 100 % … because I know Quranic Arabic or otherwise .

Are you offering to show Reed How wrong he is about the word messenger in 4/69 ..

I thought you said you are an Arabic Egyptian ?

Come on …are you accepting the challenge ?
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re: above
written by Gnostic , November 22, 2012
Paul was against circumcision according to the letters while acts have a different point of view.

Thus we have contradictions between OT and NT and between Pauls letters and Acts.

In the letters Paul also mentioned a conflict with Peter and other jewish christians while the authors of Acts obviously try to smoothen this conflict.
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Fineliving
written by Malem , November 22, 2012
I am not sure where Reed states anything about 4:69, I do not recall the post. However 4:69 begins as "All who obey Allah and the apostle are in the company of those on whom is the grace of Allah...." Im guessing you are talking about the word al risalah versus al rasool, in the Quran it is written وَالرَّسُولَ which the meaning is apostle/prophet that being said النَّبِيِّينَ is also in the same Surah and refers to Prophets. What word is being mistaking in 4:69 for Message?
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The fraud of unchanging Quran -1
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
Bukhari:V6B60N201 “Zaid bin Thabit, the Ansari said, ‘Abu Bakr sent for me after the (heavy) casualties among the warriors (of the battle) of Yamama (where a great number of Muhammad’s Companions were killed). Umar was present with Bakr. “The people have suffered heavy casualties at Yamama, and I am afraid that there will be more casualties among those who can recite the Qur’an on other battlefields. A large part of the Qur’an may be lost unless you collect it.” I replied to Umar, “How can I do something which Allah’s Apostle has not done?” Umar kept on pressing, trying to persuade me to accept his proposal.’ Zaid bin Thabit added, ‘Umar was sitting with Abu Bakr and was speaking (to) me. “You are a wise young man and we do not suspect you of telling lies or of forgetfulness. You used to write the Divine Inspiration for Allah’s Apostle. Therefore, look for the Qur’an and collect it (in one manuscript).” By Allah, if Abu Bakr had ordered me to shift one of the mountains (from its place) it would have been easier for me than the collection of the Qur’an. I said to both of them, “How dare you do a thing which the Prophet has not done?”

Zaid declared that collecting the Qur’an’s surahs would be an impossible task. He said that it would be easier to move mountains than to turn Muhammad’s string of oral recitals into a book. The reason for this rather troubling statement is obvious: Zaid’s search for Qur’anic passages forced him to rely upon carvings on the leg or thigh bones of dead animals, as well as palm leaves, skins, mats, stones, and bark. But for the most part, he found nothing better than the fleeting memories of the prophet’s Companions, many of whom were dead or dying. In other words, the Qur’an, like the Hadith, is all hearsay.

There were no Muslims who had memorized the entire Qur’an, otherwise the collection would have been a simple task. Had there been individuals who knew the Qur’an, Zaid would only have had to write down what they dictated. Instead, Zaid was overwhelmed by the assignment, and was forced to “search” for the passages from men who believed that they had memorized certain segments and then compare what he heard to the recollection of others. Therefore, even the official Islamic view of things, the one recorded in their scripture, is hardly reassuring.
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Oui'
written by Malem , November 22, 2012
اليوم حقّ الفلسطينيين يُتوّج في غزّة
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The fraud of unchanging Quran -2
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
Worse still, the Muslim chosen for this impossible task was the one in the best position to plagiarize the Torah and Talmud. Moreover, it’s obvious he did. Remember:

Tabari VII:167 “In this year, the Prophet commanded Zayd bin Thabit to study the Book of the Jews, saying, ‘I fear that they may change my Book.’”
the worse it gets.

Bukhari:V6B61N511 “Zaid bin Thabit said, ‘I started searching for the Qur’an till I found the last two Verses of Surat At-Tauba with Abi but I could not find them with anyone other than him. They were: ‘Verily there has come to you an Apostle from amongst yourselves.’” [9:128]

This is incriminating. The 9th surah was the second to last revealed. If only one person could remember it, there is no chance those revealed twenty-five years earlier were retained. Furthermore, this Tradition contradicts the most highly touted Islamic mantra: Most Muslims contend Uthman, not Bakr, ordered the collection of the Qur’an a decade later. And who knows what version they finally committed to paper, if in fact they ever did?

Bukhari:V6B61N513: “Allah’s Apostle said, ‘Gabriel [whom Muhammad said had 600 wings] recited the Qur’an to me in one way. Then I requested him and continued asking him to recite it in other ways, and he recited it in several ways till he ultimately recited it in seven different ways.’”

So there were at least seven Qur’ans.
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Malman
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
Malman why dont you go and fight with your brothers in Gaza.
Their butt is getting kicked.
Martydom awaits you with 72 virgins and wine.
ابن حمار
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infidumb
written by malem , November 22, 2012
No one listens to you mate, we just skip over your drivel. Have fun stuffing your turkey :)
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Reed Wilson
written by Duke Indian , November 22, 2012

'You know that shaheed or martyr is not there in respective verse.'

I don't know. 'shaheed' or martyr is the person who gets killed in Jihad or the one who lays down his life fighting in Allah's way . So either one of the terms is required. In verse 3:119, Allah uses the term 'those who are slain in Allah's way'. That is enough to denote that he says about shaheed. The exact word shaheed is not necessary. You are simply creating confusion by mixing up things and obfuscating the real meaning. Your game is up for all to see.

Anyway, now you don't have any argument with your flawed statement that there is no feeding and eating in that verse, do you?
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Reed Wilson
written by Kafirwala , November 22, 2012

Since you have now made it clear that Bible (OT & NT) is not Talmud and Injil, will your lordship please clarify which is Talmud and which is Injil mentioned by Allah in Quran ?
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correction
written by Kafirwala , November 22, 2012

In my above post, I used the terms Talmud and Injil. Please correct it to read Torah and Injil.
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@ Kaser
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 22, 2012
Make a comment to my blog. That'll give me your email address. Lets talk.

http://ramirustom.blogspot.com/
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infidel
written by fine , November 22, 2012
Arabic … huh ?

Nice name you called that, Muslims man … once he called me the same name, except, he used the wrong gender noun .

You did better .. You used the right gender noun on him .

Ahsant, Ya kafir wa al fakoor .
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...
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
written by malem
No one listens to you mate, we just skip over your drivel. Have fun stuffing your turkey :)

And yet here you are replying to him. LMAO. If you can't refute anything at least come up with a snotty reply that doesn't make you look like the idiot that you are, Malem.
Now run along and stuff one of your b!tches wives.
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Continuum,
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
Continuum,

Good I can understand you very well. you appear to have the symptoms of an ex- Muslim. These are people who are traumatised and depressed for coming to the realisation that the religion they so adore and consecrated their whole life for, is actually a fake, a hallucination of a mentally derailed illiterate desert Arab of the 7th century. Usually their first point expressing their range and vengeance is to attack the Judeo-Christian scriptures.

According to their understanding since Mohammed plagiarised must his hallucination from the people of the book, such books must be fake too. This people instead of reading the Judaeo-Christian scriptures with open mind, no they came to look for scriptures that will prove their pre-conceived Islamic mind set. Not knowing that Mohammed being Ignorant of these scriptures himself could only apply those scriptures that further his cause, that is to bring his deserts folks to submission to his lordship in order to have easy access to wealth, women, and be worshipped as god.(Allah) a well known moon idol worshipped by his parents.

But Mohammed was wise, he never allow such hallucinations – the Quran to come between him and money, women and power. He changes them at will for his personal gain under the guise of his god divine decree. You can’t really blame these ex- Muslims on how they think of any other faith, especially, the Judea-Christian faith because Mohammed claimed that they were his Allah’s scriptures before he later jettison them when they no longer serve his purpose. You can see why it pains together with the psychological trauma that goes with such revelation that it was all a ruse. That is why you see most of them end up being Atheist, Agnostic, or free thinkers. We have many of such people in this site, so you are welcome.

This is just by way of Preamble I will now take time to address some of the misconception in your post. thanks
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Where is Torah and Injil.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 22, 2012
Kafirwala. You write "Since you have now made it clear that Bible (OT & NT) is not Torah and Injil, will your lordship please clarify which is Talmud and which is Injil mentioned by Allah in Quran?

Let me settle with Brokaan first. You filed an intervenor's suit. It is fine if it is clear to you. He has to elaborate his claim that Quran refers to Bible.

Why do you bother 'his lordship' to spot Torah and Injil? Quran says Allah revealed Torah and Injil. Jesus Christ was given Injil. He has given receipt for that.

Mark 8:35. "For whoever wants to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me and for the gospel will save it.

Mark 10:29 “Truly I tell you,” Jesus replied, “no one who has left home or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or fields for me and the Gospel.
(In Arabic translations they have translated Gospel as Injil).

You might agree with me, your highness, that by mentioning Gospel or Injil, Jesus did not mean Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Jesus also said that he had not come to cancel Torah.

Now where is that Gospel mentioned by Jesus there in Gospel of Mark? This question bugged Machmoed and myself. I asked Clement and Clement you know. Even scholars like Yibel could not help any.

It is problem with the people who come to my fold that they stop showing up here at IW. Machmoed, duh-swami, Great Buana etc are missed much. Arcpagan and Dwito are gradually disappearing. You expect fineliving and Duke Indian to contribute?

You may kindly do some research and tell me. Someone informed me that Torah is concealed by Jew clergies. I am bewildered on this.

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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
Continuum

You wrote “Your arguments do not add anything new to my understanding at all. My argument was god of OT is as evil as Allah. Time frame and geography affected is NOT in question here, but the similarity in violence and abusive nature of these gods, Yahweh and Allah. “

Now let me clear up this misunderstanding. Yahweh is a personal God not mystical and shapeless god like Allah. Yahweh revealed Himself in stages through a period of time not less than 2600 years before Islam came up out of the blue without any antecedent and with an opposite revelation and characters of Allah. It is through this revelation that we know that human are made in the image of Yahweh, and that Yahweh is Omnipotent, Omniscience, and omnipresence and that he is God of love and justice and as a father he discipline his children. He gave his law and the consequences of breaking the law. And at the cause of time he proved all these attributes to mankind through a chosen race -the Israelites as his pet project for his divine revelation to mankind which culminated in the ultimate sacrifice for the salvation of the whole world. John 3:16

When he ordered for the destruction of some people it was because he is the God of justice. Can you imagine what the world would look like without law and order and justice? Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed because of their sins. The original indigene of Canaan was replaced with the Jews because of their idolatrous and abominable life style not because God hate them it was because he also is the God of justice. You cannot see this attributes in Allah. He never revealed himself to anyone, but started using Mohammed gangsters to kill and destroy lives and property. The first encounter of Mohammed of Allah’s angel it was like a demon possession as recounted by Mohammed himself. The so called Angel did not know Mohammed’s name nor introduce himself but terrorised him and almost squeeze out life from him. One other way to help your understanding is to compare these deities with their attributes. Yahweh and Allah have nothing in common.

Your so called similarity was due to ignorance.
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Pls. wait.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 22, 2012
Mr. Kafirwal. You will find my post for you in near future after review.
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Islam-watch Pastor
written by Continuum , November 22, 2012
Good I can understand you very well. you appear to have the symptoms of an ex- Muslim.


wrong...

These are people who are traumatised and depressed for coming to the realisation that the religion they so adore and consecrated their whole life for, is actually a fake, a hallucination of a mentally derailed illiterate desert Arab of the 7th century. Usually their first point expressing their range and vengeance is to attack the Judeo-Christian scriptures.


May be true for ex-muslims...but I happen to agree with the conclusions of ex-muslims,. At the least they have the courage to accept to see truth as it is, unlike you.

I did not find one point worthy of response in your posts and do not expect christians like you to accept facts, but like muslims your mind is numb to compassion when it comes to the atrocities of bible, just as muslims are numb to violence in koran.

Yahweh is a personal God not mystical and shapeless god like Allah.


How does it make any difference, fyi allah is as anthropomorphic as you or me...allah has hands, shin, face, speaks, sits on a throne etc. etc.

Yahweh revealed Himself in stages through a period of time not less than 2600 years before Islam came up out of the blue without any antecedent and with an opposite revelation and characters of Allah.


wrong again...and proven the same with just single quote already..Deutoronomy (20:10-17)

When he ordered for the destruction of some people it was because he is the God of justice.


I wonder what justice is served in ordering his followers to take women captive as sex slaves (Judges 21:10-24 ), even pre-pubescent girls as sex slaves (Numbers 31:17-18), murdering suckling infants (1 Samuel 15:3)?

I am not supporting islam or muhammad. My point is both yahway and allah are demonic or evil conceptions of god by evil religions created by evil people for the evil people and I have proven it beyond doubt with just one quote from the bible. You cannot even answer properly my very first quote. end of discussion..
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re: continuum
written by Gnostic , November 22, 2012
I agree! How can people say that God is the god of justice and that he killed the people of Sodom and Gomorrha because of their sins as well as the people from Kanaa!

Imagine god would kill all people of New York, Paris or Dubai on one day because of their sins! Is this realistic? That all people of a town, including women and children, deserve to be killed?

And what makes the difference between people believing in one god, many gods or no god? Why it is considered a sin to believe in something different???

Killing is a sin, stealing, having sex with minors, rape, (btw many of them committed by Muhammad, according to my knowledge) but not believing in something!

You may believe that your wife loves you or not and you may be right or wrong.

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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012

You wrote “Your arguments do not add anything new to my understanding at all. My argument was god of OT is as evil as Allah. Time frame and geography affected is NOT in question here, but the similarity in violence and abusive nature of these gods, Yahweh and Allah. “

Now let me clear up this misunderstanding. Yahweh is a personal God not mystical and shapeless god like Allah. Yahweh revealed Himself in stages through a period of time not less than 2600 years before Islam came up out of the blue without any antecedent and with an opposite revelation and characters of Allah. It is through this revelation that we know that human are made in the image of Yahweh, and that Yahweh is Omnipotent, Omniscience, and omnipresence and that he is God of love and justice and as a father he discipline his children.

He gave his law and the consequences of breaking the law. And at the cause of time he proved all these attributes to mankind through a chosen race -the Israelites as his pet project for his divine revelation to mankind which culminated in the ultimate sacrifice for the salvation of the whole world. John 3:16

When he ordered for the destruction of some people it was because he is the God of justice. Can you imagine what the world would look like without law and order and justice? Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed because of their sins. The original indigene of Canaan land was replaced with the Jews because of their idolatrous and abominable life style not because God hate them it was because he also is the God of justice. You cannot see this attributes in Allah. He never revealed himself to anyone, but started using Mohammed gangsters to kill and destroy lives and property.

The first encounter of Mohammed of Allah’s angel it was like a demon possession as recounted by Mohammed himself. The so called Angel did not know Mohammed’s name nor introduce himself but terrorised him and almost squeeze out life from him. One other way to help your understanding is to compare these deities with their attributes. Yahweh and Allah have nothing in common. Your so called similarity was due to ignorance.

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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012

You observed “Really how does it make any better when you kill all the inhabitants of a so called "promised land"? Do you realize that it includes suckling infants and innocent children? How is this different from islamic killing in terms of ethics or morality?”
It is so because Yahweh was making a model nation of holy people out of the children of Israel. It is of necessity that the original sinful people are eliminated so that they don’t have influence on the new creation.

You observed “Ethnic cleansing is wrong whether in past or present, whether it is localized or global...If your argument is justified, then ethnic cleansing of Jews will also be justified as it is localized.”
You are right, ethnic cleansing is wrong only God has right and Power to terminate life. That of the OT is not the same it was an one-off event, to give the children of Israel a place to dwell as a nation in accordance with God’s instruction. It was Yahweh’s replacement project not to be repeated in any part of the world except in Israel and in that land with its boundary. Remember even at then those who willingly submitted to rule of Yehweh were allowed to live among the Israelites in peace. The cleansing was for preservation of holiness and not out hatred and anyone who wants live and rule by Gods law is welcome.

You observed “So biblical god does order raping and capturing women for sexual satisfaction of desert dwelling barbarians, just because it is your religion, but the same done by Muslims is intolerable for you. “
It is not so, something that was meant to be done to a particular people named and location and time if it is done to somebody else in a wrong place and wrong time is not acceptable by any standard.
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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012

“Are you kidding me? So waiting to rape captured females for a month makes bible right according to you --------just because it is their religion, but with a forked tongue criticize Muslims which essentially say the same thing as per their belief.”

It is not the issue of being right, a prisoner is a prisoner ,but the inhuman treatment of the prisoners that is at stake here. The Bible gives them some dignity and humanly treated. All war prisoners and slaves are released after six years, no marriage of a war captive within one month of her captivity. This is the human face of the God of the Bible. Allah has no respect for women, they are like demotic animals even the so call Muslima.


You observed “Isaiah,Micah etc...simple....since these texts already existed, it is a simple step to manufacture "new testament" to fit these texts or at the least to misinterpret them...as "new testament" came after "old testament"...I will not even asnwer John 1:29 as it requires no answer at all..”

Once again you are wrong. Jesus alone fulfilled more than 60 clear OT prophesies, the truth is that the ministry of Jesus Christ will not be appreciated without the knowledge of how the Jews were commanded to serve Yahweh and the New covenant which he promised them and was fulfilled in Christ.Jer 31:31-34 If it was easy to twist Scriptures why did not Mohammed able to site one convincing scriptures or twist so many that spoke about him. Despite his effort he even make allusion to it in his Quran but could not site one verse compare to numerous reference that the writers of the New Testament sited in their writing’s concerning Jesus. Mohammed wanted to legitimise his hallucinations as scriptures by plagiarising so many stories of the OT.

Recalling history is not prophesied fulfilment is it? This is one argument of yours that lack substance.
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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012

“Are you kidding me? So waiting to rape captured females for a month makes bible right according to you --------just because it is their religion, but with a forked tongue criticize Muslims which essentially say the same thing as per their belief.”

It is not the issue of being right, a prisoner is a prisoner ,but the inhuman treatment of the prisoners that is at stake here. The Bible gives them some dignity and humanly treated. All war prisoners and slaves are released after six years, no marriage of a war captive within one month of her captivity. This is the human face of the God of the Bible. Allah has no respect for women, they are like demotic animals even the so call Muslima.


You observed “Isaiah,Micah etc...simple....since these texts already existed, it is a simple step to manufacture "new testament" to fit these texts or at the least to misinterpret them...as "new testament" came after "old testament"...I will not even asnwer John 1:29 as it requires no answer at all..”

Once again you are wrong. Jesus alone fulfilled more than 60 clear OT prophesies, the truth is that the ministry of Jesus Christ will not be appreciated without the knowledge of how the Jews were commanded to serve Yahweh and the New covenant which he promised them and was fulfilled in Christ.Jer 31:31-34 If it was easy to twist Scriptures why did not Mohammed able to site one convincing scriptures or twist so many that spoke about him. Despite his effort he even make allusion to it in his Quran but could not site one verse compare to numerous reference that the writers of the New Testament sited in their writing’s concerning Jesus. Mohammed wanted to legitimise his hallucinations as scriptures by plagiarising so many stories of the OT.

Recalling history is not prophesied fulfilment is it? This is one argument of yours that lack substance.
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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
You observed “ahh....did you forget the dark ages and how the jews were forced to live in ghettos in Europe? What about inquisition against jews? Minorities like Jews, gypsies etc. were treated like crap, just as muslims in islamic countries treat jews and other minorities today. Slaughter of Jews (calling them as jeebus killers) in christian Europe was common in middle ages. “
Again you are wrong , you are right call the period under consideration dark ages, where the content of the Bible where hiding for so many people, but what happen when the printing press was invented and the Bible became a common commodity, the light came back to the world again John 8:12.
The inquisition was a direct response to the Islamic incursion to Europe. It was a natural defence mechanism and has nothing to do with the Christian teachings. One cannot justify war, terrorism, hatred, violence, retaliation, prostitution or polygamy with the Bible references. But Muslim do all these evil with the backing of their scriptures, this is where the difference lies.

Islam is not judged by the action so some few but by the evil and written instruction of their scriptures. The same thing you should do. Don’t judge Christianity by the action of the few during the Dark Age, or even present age but judge Christianity by written instruction in their scriptures. Do you think you understand?
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Continuum
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012

You observed “The world today is better as most of Western civilization came out of the grips of old superstitious biblical world...not because of bible, but despite the bible.. ------ When the world rids itself of the three desert religions, life in this world will be better and peaceful. “

Really? Do you think the world would have been a better place without the contribution of the Judeo Christian faith? You can be right if you only meant that desert Arab cult religion call Islam which has contributed nothing to the human civilisation, except how to shop up human heads and hands beat women and luck them in houses for breeding and sex , how to brainwash little children to commit suicide in the name of martyrdom.
Please Google to find out the contribution of the Jews and Christians in the world of Science, Technology and literatures and its contribution to the development of common law as compare to contribution of Islamic nation in the world.
Imagine what they world would look like without the preaching of the gospel, animals would have being better off. Imagine a world that only Islam is the Government and religion. God forbid bad thing.

I know you still have soft spot for Islam because that was your root, but here in IW Quran ,Hardith and Mohammed is the common enemy not Christianity, because this world be a better place if all humans are true Christian- like Christ. But the opposite will be the case if all humans are true Muslims- Like Mohammed. You are Welcome to Islam-watch if only your desire is to help rid the world of Islam and the Quran. If you think batching both the Quran and the Bible here is your mission , you are in a wrong place. Posters here respect the Bible especially Christ teaching even though they are not Christians. They revered and respect Christian teachings. I hope you will and with all I have said here it is enough for you to shield your sword.

Cheers.
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Islam-watch Pastor ,
written by kope , November 22, 2012


i would not say christuanity is evil but white man is evil, world will never going to have peace until white man be humanise
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Kopey
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
Kopey who is a white man.
What is white mens defintion.

Is he more evil then jews mentioned in quran?
Where in quran is white men described?
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...
written by kope , November 22, 2012


read white man history you will know he is the most evil amoung human
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...
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
1400 years of Islam has racked up more body bags than all the "white man's" evils combined.
Islam in men is like rabbies in a dog - Winston Churchill.
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...
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
Weekly Jihad Report; Nov. 10 - Nov. 16

Jihad Attacks: 50

Dead Bodies: 156

Critically Injured:174

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...
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
a few deadly instances in the last 4 days:
2012.11.21 (Rawalpindi, Pakistan) - Children are among the casualties when a Shahid suicide bomber plows into a Shiite procession and detonates, killing dozens.
2012.11.21 (Karachi, Pakistan) - A suicide bombing is among two bomb blasts outside a Shiite mosque that leave two innocents dead.
2012.11.21 (Kabul, Afghanistan) - A Shahid suicide bomber sends two Afghans to Allah.
2012.11.20 (Eshkol, Israel) - Two Israelis are killed during a Hamas rocket attack.
2012.11.19 (Charmang, Pakistan) - Rockets fired by Islamic militants crush a 6-year-old girl.
2012.11.18 (Maiduguri, Nigeria) - An 70-year-old retired Protestant pastor is executed in cold blood by Islamic extremists.
0
...
written by kope , November 22, 2012
i hope another hitler rise and destroy all evil white man
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KOPE
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
You observed "i would not say christuanity is evil but white man is evil, world will never going to have peace until white man be humanise "

You are right to say that white man is evil because white man is human like you and me. The Bible says the heart of man is evil continually and that all have sin and come short of the Glory of God Rom 3:23.There is no exception.

If you say only the whites are evil what can you say of the Arabs who single headedly gave birth to the most evil and violent religion ever in the world and their Government are leading in the index of the most tyrannical and evil, and corrupt regimes in the world. Following your logic can we say all Arabs are evil and that the world will never know peace until the Arabs are humanise?

No the problem is not with the white or Arabs it is the nature of man which is sinfulness. That is why Jesus came to give us light and save us from the power of evil and sin. Those who believe and take to his teachings are saved and will not work in darkness. John8:12,12:46
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lol kope
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
Hitler wanted to preserve the white man as the master race, not kill them. You're not very smart are you?
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Islam-watch Pastor
written by kope , November 22, 2012

white man is evil because christianity say that god died for his sin, whate man took that as licence to do evil and his god will saved him regardless what ever he does sex, killing ,porn, abortion, prist raping children

are you a white prist children are save with you?
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kope the dope
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
you can only be saved, kope, if you're Christian and ask for forgiveness -- and mean it.
Priest's raping children is not Christian supported. Mohammed and his child raping ways IS Islam supported.
You're making an idiot of yourself with your drivel.
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Ajmal Kasab hanged
written by Rationalist , November 22, 2012
Folks,

The Pakistani terrorist (Jihadi P!g) who was responsible for the death of more than 150 people in Nov 2008 in Mumbai is finally executed.

I HOPE HE WILL BE REWARDED WITH BLACK-EYED HOURIES IN JANNAT.
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Jye ,
written by kope , November 22, 2012
written by Jye , November 22, 2012

Hitler wanted to preserve the white man as the master race, not kill them. You're not very smart are you?
=============

but hitler destroyed white european colonies around the world and killed millions of white bastards plus non white came the west because of hitler

i hope you will get one more hitler
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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 22, 2012
> white man is evil because christianity say that god died for his sin, whate man took that as licence to do evil and his god will saved him regardless what ever he does sex, killing ,porn, abortion, prist raping children. are you a white prist children are save with you?

Your argument assumes that all white men are Christian. Why do you make mistakes like this? Is it on purpose?
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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 22, 2012
> i hope another hitler rise and destroy all evil white man

What about evil non-white men? Should this new Hitler destroy them too?
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Kopey white muslims
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
Kopey what happens to a white who converts.
Does he make islam bad for originaly white men are bad.
If so why is he accepted in Islam?

Otherwise this white man issue is probably somewhere in your head.
Be a man get that vest. Allah awaits you with 72 virgins and wine.
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Kasab
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
comment deleted due to filthy language
0
...
written by Jye , November 22, 2012
written by Rationalist
Folks,

The Pakistani terrorist (Jihadi P!g) who was responsible for the death of more than 150 people in Nov 2008 in Mumbai is finally executed.

I HOPE HE WILL BE REWARDED WITH BLACK-EYED HOURIES IN JANNAT.

Great news. One less demon on earth sent back to hell.
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...
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
You said "white man is evil because christianity say that god died for his sin, whate man took that as licence to do evil and his god will saved him regardless what ever he does sex, killing ,porn, abortion, prist raping children are you a white prist children are save with you? "

I can see your bond of contention. Question is Christ death for the sins of the world a licence to comit sin? Is that the uniform teaching of the Bible? No Can you point out in the Bible where your view of view of what constitute sins was written? No where in the Bible.

Paul the apostle who preached that salvation is by the grace of God and that is a gift from God and is to be received by faith also said in Rom 6:1-7
6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

Except you prove what you said of the white Biblicaly, your theory is wrong and from the pit of hell.




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kope - the above post is for you
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
Those sins you pointed out above, are you saying that islam is free from those sins?
How ? give your proofs
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written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
written by kope , November 22, 2012

written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012

Those sins you pointed out above, are you saying that islam is free from those sins?
How ? give your proofs


===================


no, only white man is free from all sin because his god died for him to enjoy all kind of sin
he dreses his daughters in bikini like whore so he can enjoy
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Infidel and More proud ,
written by kope , November 22, 2012



written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012

Kopey what happens to a white who converts.
Does he make islam bad for originaly white men are bad.
If so why is he accepted in Islam?

======================
muslims dont have skin color like you infidels
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kope- I think I am done with you
written by Islam-watch Pastor , November 22, 2012
It is no longer necessary that I continue to dialogue with you as your language is becoming very vulgar and it seems you are out of ideas of any reasonable proportion. You can choose to remain in bondage of the Islamic cult. It is your choice I am free from guilt of your blood.

bye bye
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...
written by kope , November 22, 2012


pastor

dont work to destroy islam but work to save your cult christianity

you wasting time
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Kopey
written by Infidel and More proud , November 22, 2012
So muslims are trasparent is that what you mean to say like the houries whose bones are visible?
what a dork.
When you go to heaven allah will make u sit on his big coke
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I HOPE HE WILL BE REWARDED WITH BLACK-EYED HOURIES IN JANNAT
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 22, 2012
No he will sit on Thakreys coke.
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...
written by kope , November 23, 2012
go drink cow piss
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Kopey
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 23, 2012
There are no cows where I live but you can go to heaven and drink houri piss for it is better than your camel pisscola..
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Thanksgiving
written by fine , November 23, 2012
Thanksgiving to all

Yes even to you Muslims posters …

You could say what ever you want about this holiday .. but it is the best for me .. it has No particular religion notion behind it … everyone from all religion and non religious can get together and shear food and laughs … and can thank what ever they want in their lives .

There is a lot to mourn these days … I mourn the destruction of my native country and killing a million a humen being for power and greed .. and I mourn the innocent Muslims and jews .. I am so glad the killing stopped … I hope the blood shed in Syria will stopped also .

For me, I am thankful I ended up here where I can voice my own feelings .. and my family is safe

I hope everyone will take a break from name calling … at least for one day ..

whether we like or not, we have to live together here

Our Gods can take a hike in thanksgivings … :)
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Fineliving
written by Kaser , November 23, 2012
I support your post!
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vbv - the existence of God - part (i)
written by Kafirwala , November 23, 2012

So, vbv, this is a follow up post to my earlier post on existence of God.

We are citizens of India, the largest democracy in the world. Apart from that, in the present scientific age, we can say we are world citizens too. So, you can very well rebuke the spook called god from your rooftop . You can abuse him, crticise him, make fun of him, anything you can do, it is within your rights. Nobody can perhaps counter you, since there is no proof that god is there. May be you are doing it from your deep rooted convictions. But before we do that, it would not be out of place if we look at some ground realities.

As we know independent India has got a history of 65 years. During these 65 years, India has produced a good no. of statesmen, scientists, educational stalwarts, thinkers etc.etc. Out of these eminent people how many were atheists? It would be really eye- opening if we take a small statistics. Among the statesmen and political leaders, perhaps Jawaharlal Nehru was the only known atheist. Among scientists and physicists, Homi J. Bhabha was the lone atheist. The present as well as former Chairmen of Indian Atomic Energy Commission, the august body of scientific studies and development in India are both devotees of Lord Srikrishna at Guruvayur temple. Both have no timidity to admit it. Rather they proudly declare it. Another example is our former President and eminent scientist Dr. APJ Abdul Kalam. It was reported in the press that when once he went to visit a mosque, the Imam there very proudly showed him a small Quran and claimed it to be the smallest Quran in the world, Abdul Kalam immediately took a smaller one from his pocket and showed the Imam which shows that he is also a very religious person. Take people from any walk of life, the atheists are very few in number and you can count them on your fingers.
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vbv - the existence of God - part (ii)
written by Kafirwala , November 23, 2012

In India, as you know , not only pilgrim centers, the godmen also do a roaring business. People are thronging at their ashrams like common flies. Take for example, the late Satya Sai Baba. How many crores of rupees he made! Of course, a part of it he spent on social activities. I am not belittling his services to the community. Like him, Amrutananda Mayi also makes a fortune. How many godmen are there like that! Of course they do social service too and I won’t say it is a small thing. I would say that, for the money their devotees shower on them , they must be getting some mental satisfaction or joy in return and I don’t want to criticize anybody, since they are doing it all on their own volition. The thing is people are all ready to make anybody godman, if he or she is able to give them some solace! Sri Narayana Guru was a great yogi and social reformer in my state. He was born in a lower caste and he advised all his people to gain knowledge and fight against the upper castes not with sword, but with education and knowledge. He never married and did not keep company of women like Mohammed did. Recently, the leader of his community has claimed that Narayana Guru was really god! That is the kind of elevation/ veneration the saintly people receive in present day India!

A few years ago I had an occasion to visit Reserve Bank of India at Chennai as part of my official work. Inside the premises at one corner I saw a statue of Goddess Lakshmi installed on a pedestal and garlanded with flowers and some burnt incense sticks placed in front of the deity. I really got surprised and asked the people there what it was, some pooja or something? The answer was like this. “ Don’t you know that Goddess Lakshmi is the deity and seat of wealth and money? RBI is the custodian of Government’s wealth and money. So naturally, we have to seek the blessings of Goddess Lakshmi, is it not?” I readily agreed with them.

This is the kind of reasoning the vast majority of our people have, with regard to god and our life in general. These things I have brought here as nothing but food for thought only. Just to ponder over. So, before you climb your roof top and start your tirade against the imbecile god next time, you may do well if you remember these very earthly things too.
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Thanksgiving
written by kope , November 23, 2012


why do atheists celiibrate thanksgiving?

is not religious superstitious?



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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 23, 2012
> why do atheists celiibrate thanksgiving? is not religious superstitious?

Celebrating holidays is st@pid.
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Circum-castration
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 23, 2012
Baby-boy loses machine part after circum-castration goes bad. Becomes a she or it?
Allah didnt come to rescue.
Keep it up superstitious muslims...
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Continuum
written by The Pastor , November 23, 2012
Please my Friend I don’t want you to run away without clearing your misconception and your query against the Bible.

You observed “You cannot even answer properly my very first quote. end of discussion..”
Oh no this shouldn’t be the ground to end our discussion I thought by addressing your queries one after the other I was able to satisfy you. But you have since gone into the voice mail or hibernated.
Let me again look at your first Quotation, I supposed you meant Deut 20:14-17

There is a principle that is established in verses 15 and 16 which I want you to take note of :

That is whether the people are to be destroyed completely with their little ones and beasts or be spared and taken captives. The principle is that don’t take captives or booty if the people are within the Promised Land but you take if outside the land .Deut 20:15-16

“15 Thus shalt thou do unto all the cities which are very far off from thee, which are not of the cities of these nations.

16 But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth:”
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Continuum- the concluding part
written by The Pastor , November 23, 2012
What does this teaches you about Yahweh. He did not take pleasure in the death of sinners he would spare life if possible. If you look at his promises in other scriptures to the children of Israel, you would have seen how he said he was going to drive the original inhabitants of the land not kill them. If they had run aware and allow the children of Israel to possess the land no one would have been killed but they decided to resist despite knowing what He did to the Egyptians and those who opposed them on their way to the Promised Land.

As I have told you before Yahweh has a plan to reach the whole world with his provision of salvation but decided to have a platform in which to launch his campaign and this happen to be the children of Israel. He was first of all to make them a peculiar people, a holy nation, a model nation God wants of all his creation. To do that he has to give them a land to stay as a nation, and he gave them a law(a constitution)on how to live as an example of what he wants before reaching the world with his message of love to mankind.

The entire Bible preaches the message of love, even the apparent wars and killing was necessary in order to establish the right part to love. The Bible say God is love and when you look at God love as shown to the Children of Israel and now to the whole world through Christ you will see that his own kind of love is unique not like man, his love was unconditional.

He called Abraham and promised him great riches and blessing, free of charge, he delivered the Children of Israel from Egyptians bondage free of charge even when hope are all dashed, He sent Christ to whole to die and pay the price of redemption free of charge. This is God’s love for you. All what God wants from you is to response to his love to you by faith and obeys his commandments period.

Have I answer you well now?


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Continuum -
written by The Pastor , November 23, 2012
The concluding part is still been held by the adinistrator for review , I hope it will be released soonest.
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Continuum- conluding
written by The Pastor , November 23, 2012
What does this teaches you about Yahweh.
He did not take pleasure in the death of sinners he would spare life if possible. If you look at his promises in other scriptures to the children of Israel, you would have seen how he said he was going to drive the original inhabitants of the land not kill them. If they had run aware and allow the children of Israel to possess the land no one would have been killed but they decided to resist despite knowing what He did to the Egyptians and those who opposed them on their way to the Promised Land.

As I have told you before Yahweh has a plan to reach the whole world with his provision of salvation but decided to have a platform in which to launch his campaign and this happen to be the children of Israel. He was first of all to make them a peculiar people, a holy nation, a model nation God wants of all his creation. To do that he has to give them a land to stay as a nation, and he gave them a law(a constitution)on how to live as an example of what he wants before reaching the world with his message of love to mankind.

The entire Bible preaches the message of love, even the apparent wars and killing was necessary in order to establish the right part to love. The Bible say God is love and when you look at God love as shown to the Children of Israel and now to the whole world through Christ you will see that his own kind of love is unique not like man, his love was unconditional.

He called Abraham and promised him great riches and blessing, free of charge, he delivered the Children of Israel from Egyptians bondage free of charge even when hope are all dashed, He sent Christ to whole to die and pay the price of redemption free of charge. This is God’s love for you. All what God wants from you is to response to his love to you by faith and obeys his commandments period.

Have I answer you well now?
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Gnostic
written by The Pastor , November 23, 2012
You observed “I agree! How can people say that God is the god of justice and that he killed the people of Sodom and Gomorrha because of their sins as well as the people from Kanaa! “

We know this through his revelation in the Bible. Yahweh is the only God that revealed himself to mankind systematically. He claimed the sole creator of the universe and of the humanity. He destroyed Sodom and Gomorra and replaced the Cannaanites with Israel because of the sins and abominable life style of those nations. No one can claim ignorant of Gods law, even those who reject, the Bible now and reject Jesus Christ as God provision and solutions for sin because why? God has put his law in human conscience and heart, that is why he could destroy Sodom and Gomorrah even though there was not a Bible for them to read and know what God wants. Ignorance in law is not an excuse.

Rom 2:12-16

“12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law;

13(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)

16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.”

My friends can you see why punishing the law breakers is part of justice?
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kaffirwala
written by vbv , November 23, 2012
I do not subscribe to anygod/godess that represents wealth/money. After all wealth is a creation of man , not god. We percieve value ,an economic value , based on its use and exchange for goods and services. Take gold or diamond ,for instance. What is its real value , in terms of its use ? Can it replace steel, iron, aluminium, titanium etc? No We value gold becuase of its rarity, its colour and lustre, its malliabilty to make ornaments ,etc. Or for that matter diamond, ruby, emarald, saphire,etc. In the stone age , these would not have much value. It is the progress of civilisation, when man sttled and became productive that these things became items that were ascribed high values in monetary terms, And money is the creation of the very same economic man . So also God is the tool of the civilised man to grab power surreptitiously and wield extraordinary influence on the masses by puting the fear of God literally in them with the uncertanities of life , withe the prospect of certain death, with the empty promises of "Heaven" or eternal punishments in "Hell" , and all that sort of bullshits . And these bullshits have brought about a lot of turmoil and wars - this is specially true of the monotheistic cults of west Asia over 2000 years. We see this intolerance imuslim countries, in Israel-Palestine conflict, in some rabidly christian countries ... All this is because of the syndrome "my God is the only true God and evrything else is false; everyone should convert to my dogma and beliefs or else they have no right to exist....etc". That is monotheistic religion and God . Therefore my contention is that we should consign these bullshits to the dustbin of history and become truly secular and humane.
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Ghost storey
written by Alpha , November 23, 2012
A visiting professor at Florida State University is giving a seminar on the supernatural. To get a feel for his audience, he asks: "How many people here believe in ghosts?" About 90 students raise their hands.

"Well that’s a good start. Out of those of you who believe in ghosts, do any of you think you’ve ever seen a ghost?" About 40 students raise their hands.

"That’s really good. I’m really glad you take this seriously. Has anyone here ever talked to a ghost? 15 students raise their hands.

"That’s a great response. Has anyone here ever touched a ghost?" Three students raise their hands. "That’s fantastic. But let me ask you one question further.....Have any of you ever made love to a ghost?" One student in the back raises his hand. The professor is astonished. He takes off his glasses, takes a step back, and says, "Son, all the years I’ve been giving this lecture, no one has ever claimed to have slept with a ghost. You’ve got to come up here and tell us about your experience."

The Kopey replies with a nod and a grin, and begins to make his way up to the podium.

The professor says, "Well, tell us what it’s like to have sex with a ghost." The student replies, "Ghost? Damn..... From back there I thought you said ’goats’!"
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kaffirwala.
written by vbv , November 23, 2012
If a person has a copy of quran/bible/bhagavatgita /etc does not necassarily mean that a person is a believer in God. Many atheists possess all these religious books and not believe in a word it says. They have these books from the point of debunking the nonsense written in these books. Further , all these books , especially the Bible and Quran , have no relevance to todays life at all. The only thing it does is take us back to the stone-age of superstitions and irrational fears. Abdul Kalam is a rocket scientist and he would certainly not believe in a spook living in cloud 9 making empty threats, though he may demonstrate such beliefs for public consumption and political expediency.
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...
written by Reed Wilson. , November 23, 2012
To vbv. You are telling Mr. Kaffirwala "They have these books from the point of debunking the nonsense written in these books."

They are, therefore, biased and can get nothing from those books.
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The Law of Karma
written by Realist , November 23, 2012
God or no God, the Law of Karma works. You reap what you or your ancestors had sow. If you are born in war-torn countries, a slave, a moron, or a cripple , don't blame God but your bad karma. However, there is a true God, not the human-created ones, operating this Law of Karma. Otherwise, things will not balance up and the earth will not travels in a balanced orbit around the sun.
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Realist
written by Kaser , November 24, 2012
Why call this Karma? There is no Karma involved relating to where a human is born!
We are not souls being attibuted a body based on the karma of said soul.

If a poor couple does not breed, then no "unlucky humans with bad karms" are born.
Instead,if that same poor couple breed 10 children, is it becasue they are all unlucky with bad Karma? No! - they are simply the natural consequence of this poor couple reproducing. There is no Karma there...

And there is no Karma involved with the earth's rotation - this is due to gravitational forces, fully understood and mathematically documented, that operate at these levels. No god, no Karma, no unknowns.

Where do you see Karma involved in any of this phenomenon?? Why do you need a god in there? You state simple events, fully understood, and attribute them values they do not have. It's only pure organic and physical processes at work.
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vbv
written by Kafirwala , November 24, 2012
I was not referring to your beliefs or views or your convictions, but to the general perception of society towards god. Whether monotheistic or pluralistic, god is a strong presence in the lives of people all over the world. Your atheism born out of scientific development and modern education is not capable of erasing god's prominence, rather it is getting weaker and weaker as days go by is my point. About 50 years ago, a chief minister in my state proudly declared that he was only happy to see a temple perish. Because, he said when a temple perishes, that much superstitions too will perish. But, no chief minister, nay even a small time politician is bold enough to utter such words today. I think that is the difference that has come about in the outlook of ordinary people in the course of last 50 years or so. If your ire is towards monotheistic god alone, I don't have anything to say other than that your outlook is paranoid and rabid and highly partisan too. In the final analysis, there are no multiple gods in any religion including hinduism. If you know about the concept of Adi Sankara regarding 'Advaithavedanta', you will not commit the mistake of saying hinduism is a polytheist religion. Anyway, what I said was only some ground realities which may serve as food for thought for avid atheists.
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Alpha
written by fineliving , November 24, 2012
Doris Egon … Said it perfectly

'' You talk to God, you are religious, God talk to you are psychotic ''

There is no ghost … no Jinn … no Satan …no angles or such things .. I have not seen these creatures who like to play peekaboo, according to some of us … and others, do not.

hmm I wonder why ?

Do you think it has to do with screw lose , between the ears ?

I think the ones, who do, see such things, Have a lot more to worry about, then mere seeing Jinn or ghost …

I was raised with this non sense around me all my life … the stories I now could make a comedy/horror movie ….

I never believed in them even when I was a Muslimah …I used to tell, some of the die hard believers, … ''when you see Jinns, just send them to me, I have a bone to pick with them … I want to ask them, why I haven't heard a peep out of them, don't they like me ?! … hahaha

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Where is Torah/Injil?
written by Reed Wilson. , November 24, 2012
Kafirwala. You write "Since you have now made it clear that Bible (OT & NT) is not Torah and Injil, will your lordship please clarify which is Talmud and which is Injil mentioned by Allah in Quran?

Let me settle with Brokaan first. You filed an intervenor's suit. It is fine if it is clear to you. He has to elaborate his claim that Quran refers to Bible.

Why do you bother 'his lordship' to spot Torah and Injil? Quran says Allah revealed Torah and Injil. Jesus Christ was given Injil. He has given receipt for that.

Mark 8:35. "For whoever wants to save their life will lose it, but whoever loses their life for me and for the gospel will save it.

Mark 10:29 “Truly I tell you,” Jesus replied, “no one who has left home or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or fields for me and the Gospel.
(In Arabic translations they have translated Gospel as Injil).

You might agree with me, your highness, that by mentioning Gospel or Injil, Jesus did not mean Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Jesus also said that he had not come to cancel Torah.

Now where is that Gospel mentioned by Jesus there in Gospel of Mark? This question bugged Machmoed and myself. I asked Clement and Clement you know. Even scholars like Yibel could not help any.

It is problem with the people who come to my fold that they stop showing up here at IW. Machmoed, duh-swami, Great Buana etc are missed much. Arcpagan and Dwito are gradually disappearing. You expect fineliving and Duke Indian to contribute?

You may kindly do some research and tell me. Someone informed me that Torah is concealed by Jew clergies. I am bewildered.


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Ghosts
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 24, 2012
Fine it seems ghosts are attracted to those who are scared of them.
They will not come near you for you will beat the shit out of them like you do to malman, abc and rw.
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kaffirwala
written by vbv , November 24, 2012
I think you are making a mistake by falling into the trap by indirectly accepting that monotheism is superior to polytheism, as though being polytheistic is a great and unforgivable sin. Monotheism is primitive and intolerant , while polytheism is more tolerant and has a broader perspective of existence. In monotheism it is "if you are not with us , you are against us" , "my God is the only true God and if you do not submit to it you don't deserve to live" , "my God is the only savior" , "your God is false God" ,"you are a third class being fit to be enslaved, or made to pay protection money or just killed for your beliefs",etc. Polytheism even allows people to be agnostic, atheistic or rational . The choice is yours. You talked about a chief misister of an Indian province about his apathy towards temples. There are plenty of people even today with the same attitude , and they are not intimidated by believers. I know this from my personal experience. They simply let you be , so long as you do not impose your disbelief on them. No atheists imposes his beliefs on anyone. Atheists just express their point of view , not pushing anything down anybody's throat. But religious believers, especially of the monotheistic creed, are always upto converting someone ,forcing their dogmas on others through threats, and threatening those who want to apostate with dire consequences like excommunication, death,torture,imprsonment ,etc. That is the way religions, especially the monotheistic cults from west Asia function with such ludicrous and evil concepts such as blasphemey.
You talked of advaitism - this is pure monism , God doesn't exist as a supernatural creature. In advaita philosophy , Brhman and atman are one and the same : Brahman is the underlying force that pervades all the Universe and existence . It is infinite, undying, eternal and beyond all imaginatio , and the Universe is its manifestation. So in that case there is no spook called by whatever name like God/Allah/Yahweh,etc. Mandukya Upanishad dispenses away with the need for such a creature called God.
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Word not sword.
written by Reed Wilson. , November 24, 2012
Islam-watch Pastor. You have considerable contribution with the name Clement. This name has much better meanings than pastor which means a shepherd.

However it becomes all the more misleading when you write Islam-watch Pastor. You know pastor also means spiritual overseer; especially : a clergyman serving a local church or parish. You are not appointed by IW as pastor. Anyway it is upto you to keep any name.

You write "I know you have own interpretation for them even Q9:5 is not a sword verse according to Sheik Reed Wilson."

We were discussing presence of word 'sword' in Quran. The verse Q9:5 is a verse which rather inhibits battle or fight. The Haram months or forbidden months are not less than four months.

Look for more pertinent quotation from Quran to prove that word sword was there. Quran is a sword without 's' letter. It remains as word and not sword.

Thank you Clement. Best of luck.
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Sward IS mentioned in Quran
written by fineliving , November 24, 2012
And I have proved it in other posted …

The word SWORD in Arabic has many synonyms … all languages have synonyms of all words …. AS HE WELL KNOEW ….

Reed conveniently forget that Fact …… and he expect us to let him slide on his fibs …. No way

There is about 45 words in Arabic that means sword in arabic or could be used to mean a sword

For example … '' Saif '' …"' Husam'' '' Kangar '' …'' Muus '' …

In Fact … the Arabic words … '' Safa Al rajul '' … means … '' to strike a man with a sword ''

The word Sword … does not have to be used every time and actually more sufficient to use phrases like ...'' Safa al rajul '' is used .

BTW …..

I repeat … '' Al rasool'' is NOT '' Al risalah '' … the first one is '' a man'' [ humen ] and the second one is a '' message or a letter [ a thing ]

Reed is a manipulator of words of Quran.
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Sword
written by fineliving , November 24, 2012
Here is more synonyms for Sword in arabic … for Reed

'' Nasil'' …'' Midya '' .. Sikeen … '' Wahat al migaf '' … reeshat maruha ''

The verb '' Qa'ir '' means …[ to stab with a sword or a knife ] …comes as a verb and is WELL UNDERSTOOD to mean to kill with a sward without ***the mention of the actual word '' sward ''***

Reed ask us not to be literal to understand Quran … YET HE IS DOING, JUST THAT .

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vbv
written by Kafirwala , November 24, 2012

In belief of god, there is no differentiation like mono or poly and it is all fabrication of your deluded mind. Either you believe in god or you don't. It is as simple as that. If you think the west Asian religions are the only monotheistic religions, you are again mistaken. What about buddhism? sikhism? confucianism? etc. Perhaps, hinduism and different varieties of paganism are the only polytheistic belief systems. And your rhetoric on the basis of mono or poly is simply delusional and misguiding to say the least. If it is about god, it should be pro or anti. You seem to be firing your shots against the west Asian or the so- called semetic religions only. You know that your arguments won't stand, so you are giving a coating of atheism to your arguments, that is all. You are shooting into the empty air. In fact, you are no atheist either. Atheism is one of your many pretensions. That is all what I make out from your highly selective, paranoid and delusional rhetoric. All sound and fury, but no substance.

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About the book || Reviews by: Steven Simpson | Abul Kasem | Prof Sami Alrabaa | Ibn Kammuna

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'Islamic Jihad' in Bangla
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Aasma Riaz: "Thank you so much for your book "Islamic Jihad" and showing me the "Big Picture". For 7-8 days, I was glued to your book, absorbing so much information that I did not know existed. You have crisply covered so much in your book and quoted historical references extensively. I am just overwhelmed with different emotions after reading your book..., a priceless tome."

Editor: M A Khan | Site design: Dan Zaremba
Founded on 20 November 2005


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