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Are American Muslims Better Than European Muslims? PART 2

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In the article "Are American Muslims Better Than European Muslims, it was emphasized that there is essentially no difference between Muslims, no matter what country or nationality they belong to. Now we have a poll results at our disposal that proves our hypothesis correct.

In the said article, we wrote:

"A Muslim can never believe in the equality of non-Muslims with Muslims, equality of all races, equality of men and women, freedom of speech, press, and assembly. In Islamic thought, American Muslims are living not in democracy and freedom guaranteed by the constitution but under the tyranny of American non-Muslims: American kafirs. Only when American Muslims are living under Sharia Law will they be finally liberated and they will be living in true freedom. Their priority now is to overthrow the tyranny of American kafirs not by conquest since American Muslims do not have the number and power but by destroying the liberal democratic government by introducing Sharia Law through stealth jihad.

In conclusion, all Muslims – whether American or European – are fundamentally the same due to their allegiance to the same book, the Quran, as well as the same Sunnah. The claim that American Muslims are better than European Muslims is pure nonsense."

WND/WENZEL POLLS

Nearly half of 600 Muslim-American citizens polled, who plan to vote in the 2012 presidential election, believe parodies of Muhammad should be prosecuted criminally in the U.S., and one in eight says the offense is so serious that violators should face death penalty.

The poll also found 40 percent Muslims in America believe that they should not be judged by the U.S. law and Constitution, but by the Shariah law.

Astonishingly almost half of those Muslims surveyed (46 percent) said they believe that those Americans, who engage in criticism or parody of Islam, should face criminal charges.

More shockingly, one in eight respondents said they think that Americans, who criticize or parody Islam, should face death penalty, while another 9 percent said they were unsure on the question.

7.2 percent of the respondents said they “strongly agree” with the idea of executing those, who parody Islam, and another 4.3 percent said they somewhat agree with it, while 80 percent said that they somewhat or strongly disagree with the idea. When those, who said they were not sure, are added, one in five Muslims across America cannot say they believe Christians or others who criticize Muhammad should be spared the death penalty.

More Muslim women (10.4 percent) than Muslim men (4.9 percent) said they strongly agree with the idea, while 12.4 percent of the women and 7.1 percent of the men were uncertain about the issue when Prophet Muhammad is involved.

Four in 10 said that Muslims in America should not be judged by the U.S. law and Constitution, but by the Islamic Shariah law.

A much smaller percentage said, they think the U.S. should establish an entirely separate court system to adjudicate legal matters involving Muslims.

Some 39 percent of Muslims said, they believe the existing U.S. courts should consult Shariah law, when adjudicating cases involving Muslims, while a plurality of 45 percent said, they do not agree with this idea. Asked if the U.S. should establish separate courts based solely on Shariah law to adjudicate cases involving Muslim, 21 percent said it should. Two-thirds of respondents – 66 percent – said that separate courts are not necessary to adjudicate Muslim issues.

9 out of 10 of the Muslim respondents said, they agree with the First Amendment. This contradicts with their answer to another question, wherein 32 percent Muslims were found to believe that Shariah should be the supreme law of the land in the United States (smells taqiyah).

Another shocking finding in the survey is that of how Muslims view the religious freedom of Christians. Asked whether Christian U.S. citizens have the right to evangelize Muslims, just 30 percent agreed Christians have such the right. 42 percent said, they do not have such a right, while 28 percent were "unsure" on the question.

One in five said, Muslim men should be allowed to follow their religion in America and have more than one wife, and 58 percent said criticism of their religion or of Muhammad should not be allowed under the Constitution.

Nearly one in three said, Israel either has no right to exist or they were uncertain.

These finding are based on Muslims answering the questions as such. Given that lying (al-Taqiyah) is a fundamental part of Islam, the truthfulness of their answer to awkward questions is suspect.

In sum, here in America, we have in our midst a well-organized people, who do not believe in democracy and freedom, equality of peoples and sexes, but in the supremacy of Islam and Sharia Law. The question, therefore, is: How are our so-called good American Muslims different from European Muslims.

---

Jake Neuman is the author of “Islam and Sharia Law Are Treason: Jihad Is Treason” and “Prophet Muhammad (AKA ALLAH): Monster of History.

Comments (155)Add Comment
0
Are American Muslims Better Than European Muslims?
written by kope , November 03, 2012
Jake Neuman


you should elect a president who could deport all muslims from america

i have been waiting for one more hitler to rise amoung you for final solution
0
Jake
written by Kaser , November 03, 2012
Interesting numbers.
I would like to see demographics associating the statistics above with the education levels of the respondents.
I also wonder, how truthful these answers are based on the very simple fact that for a Muslim, not advocating reprisals for insults to the prophet is/might be considered an apostate by some Muslims in their community? A great risk to take for a simple survey like the one you quote.

I would be that these answers do reflect the overall view of the Angry Muslim Males, Clerics and Mullahs, but deep down, most educated Muslims must think otherwise ... but may be afraid to say so...
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 03, 2012
"Waiting for" or "Hoping for" one more Hitler Kope???
Take a look at Boko Haram and Ansar Dine Kope my boy, they are modern incarnations of our long gone Nazi monster.
Deporting Muslims, no... Simply making sure the overall population classifies Islam in the same bag as Communism, Fascism, ...
And Kope my boy, every day that passes, Islam is helping our cause - it brings itself down to "cult" status, where it belongs, with every suicide bombing, fanatic cleric spewing hate on TV, riots in civilized countries and I could go on.

By the way Kope, according to one of your fellow Muslim Clerics, having put out a Fatwa authorizing Sodomy to widen the Anus to pack in more explosives.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ik5GZap_-_A

Now Kope, explain to me, as a Westerner, how I'm supposed not to burst out laughing when I see something like this !!!
This is the light of Islam???
Peace my boy.
0
...
written by kope , November 03, 2012
what the f**k you going to do with these surveys? that the question for Jake Neuman and Kaser ?

0
Come on balam
written by abc , November 03, 2012
Where is the snake speech????
What's happened to my buddy balam!!!!
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abc / Kope
written by Kaser , November 04, 2012
To abc: Indeed! And where is my friend Malem???

To Kope: Keep trying to educate Hateful Islamic drones like you.
We have a fu***ing long road ahead of us as it's very hard to undo Years of Madrassa conditionning.
Not all of you have the open mind and intellectual capacity of humans like Fineliving56.
0
preaty white boy Kaser
written by kope , November 04, 2012
according to surveys muslims f**king your country what are you going to do

if you dont want another hitler?
0
Kope
written by KAser , November 04, 2012
What did you not understand from my previous post?
0
Kaser
written by kope , November 04, 2012
why dont you spell out clearly , are you scared boy? haha


you see, you all anti muslims are dumb and dont know what do you want and how to get.

do you want to kick all muslims out of west or not?

speak loud and clear
0
Muslims in the west
written by Montegue , November 04, 2012
The west is gentlemen like; it gives ropes to Muslims as a present for them hang themselves. Had it not for Saudi's money, Milosevic would have left no Muslims in his country. Freedom in the west will continue to erode until such time sectarian conflicts will destroy the most thorny minority. There is no feast that never ends.
0
No equality in Islam
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
Quran is full of prejudice verses, yet Muslim brag about equality of their religion with no basses .

Inequalities …

In between, blacks and lighter blacks or whites, they are called Abeed [ black slaves ] they could be owned,used for sex, castrated, killed,beaten as the owner see fit .

In between, Men and women … Quran and hadeeth, discriminate against women … women in Islam are only one step up from dogs … need to say more ?

In between, Master and captured serfs [ black or white] … could be bought and sold,used for sex and their sons do not have rights as much as sons from wives, forced to marry or kept without marriage .

In Between, Muslims in whole and other Non Muslims people of The Book '' Christians and Jews ''

In between Muslims and ex Muslims and Mulihdeen … they come in the bottom of the list … even doges, are sit in higher degree, then Infidels and ex Muslims at least doge have the right to live outside Muslim homes.

If Muslims own up to this clear truths, about Quran then we could put that to rest ..That Islam had the mentality of it's time, that it was created.

If it was not, it would have abolished such inequalities, but it did not … and that is why it is time to get rid of it and close that dark chapter of our Humanity and start a new .


0
fineliving56
written by kope , November 04, 2012
written by fineliving56

If it was not, it would have abolished such inequalities, but it did not … and that is why it is time to get rid of it and close that dark chapter of our Humanity and start a new .................................


how do you going get rid of islam? show us your plan if you born to human or shutup
0
Kope
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
I will tell you how ….

One muslim at a time …

I did it…. and I am still a life and kicking …

You could be next and so on …

Few years ago .. 15% of American people identify themselves as Non religious … now it is 25 % … that is aside from the closeted ones who are everywhere, but they stay silent for fear of judgment by family and friends .

If you have it realized it yet …. you are no REAL Muslim

0
fineliving56
written by kope , November 04, 2012
i always knew barking dogs dont bites now we have proof this dogs dont bite only barks


do you want to know our plan for you?
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 04, 2012
Kope - civilized people do not use violence against others, like you insinuate you would do yourself.
I have absolutely no problems with Muslims, Jew, Christians and so on...
Islam will die like Christianity is dying - one apostate at a time...

You see Kope-baby, only one religion still actively tries to change the country I live in, and I cannot accept this.
I, and many others, do not stand by idle. We educate, inform, and reject any and all "special requests" Islam makes.

And no we don't want to hear your hate-filled made-up plan.
Kope, you're a loser. Hunched over your keyboard, typing-away your filth.
You must not have a woman in your Life Kope - you are probably one sexually frustrated deadbeat.

Keep up the hostility my boy, you are definitively entertaining !
0
...
written by Jye , November 04, 2012
Kope is just the typical savage minded Muslim. Pathetic little insecure man, who uses violence and threats to validate his manhood. Just ignore it.
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Kope
written by Tips , November 04, 2012
"how do you going get rid of islam? show us your plan if you born to human or shutup"

Good (humanity) and evil (Islam) will stay. We just have to expose and keep fighting against evil (Islam).
0
Kaser
written by xyz , November 04, 2012
"To abc: Indeed! And where is my friend Malem??? "

Malem is having tough time with his wives. One is 52 years and second is 9 years old. Wink wink.

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Kope
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
Yes … keep up the threats

Be my guest … Kope …. tell me about YOUR plan FOR ME .. the women who buried her Quran in the back yard like you bury manor under a tree .

Do not forget , before you do anything stupid

Remember what America have done with Osama … he believed ex Muslims should be beheaded, look what happen to him … now he is nothing but fish poop .

Are you volunteering to the deed … Muslim cowered ?
0

written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
I could see I have stepped on the only sensitive nerve that Muslim got … if his post is any indication !
0
silly boy
written by snoopy , November 04, 2012
kope,
You are one confused,goofy bugger.

Hitler was allied with muslims .He was from Germany .

Himmler and the mufti planned to build a concentration camp in Nablus,Palestine .
400,000 muslims joined Hitler's army.

Muslims were part of the final solution .Nazis and muslims are brothers in hate,destruction and greed.

Mein Kampf has been a bestseller in the ME since 1941.

Thousands of escaped Nazi's migrated to the ME. Syria had it's own fuhrer .There were Nazis in your militaries ,media,politics and mosques .

We know who you are,we met you in 1940.
Don't worry about America,we'll do just fine.
0
silly boy
written by snoopy , November 04, 2012
kope,
You are one confused,goofy bugger.

Hitler was allied with muslims .He was from Germany .

Himmler and the mufti planned to build a concentration camp in Nablus,Palestine .
400,000 muslims joined Hitler's army.

Muslims were part of the final solution .Nazis and muslims are brothers in hate,destruction and greed.

Mein Kampf has been a bestseller in the ME since 1941.

Thousands of escaped Nazi's migrated to the ME. Syria had it's own fuhrer .There were Nazis in your militaries ,media,politics and mosques .

We know who you are,we met you in 1940.
Don't worry about America,we'll do just fine.
0
to kope
written by ANNAD , November 04, 2012
You threaten us with violence? You are ridiculous men. Check the history. You people could have all the violence you brought in the west handed back to you in no time. Don't flatter yourself calling westerners stupid and soft and decadent. See what happened after 9/11? It's true, your bros managed to killed 3000 innocent people and destroyed some property. Now, check the retaliation - how many Muslims died as a result of this attack? How much of their property was destroyed?
And what is worse for your cause, more, much more people starting to pay attention to Islam, me included.

So do you really think that your violence was worse it? Do you think that you further your cause by these attacks?

What did you people achieve now? Spreading an idea about Islam being peace and harmony or Islam being violence and hate?
0
...
written by kope , November 04, 2012

fineliving56 Are you volunteering to the deed(DEAD) … Muslim cowered ?

I could see I have stepped on the only sensitive nerve that Muslim got … if his post is any indication ! .....................



no, dumb f**k
0
to kope
written by ANNAD , November 04, 2012
no, dumb f**k

Yeah... very impressive argument. Is that all you could present?

Not much, not much.

Just one more time you proved to us that you are intellectually inferior. Thanks to Islamic millenium long prohibition on critical thinking and generations of inbreeding.
0
...
written by kope , November 04, 2012
here is my prediction about future of the west

point one

human need god

point two

christianity makes no sense

point three

without religion human go depression

point four

western people join islam in mass

point five

anti islam will rise

point six

christians will elect fascist anti muslims leaders into power for to kick muslims out from the west and bring god's kingdom on earth and fags and atheists will not allow in kingdom of god

point seven

seculars people would not like fascist's christians leaders in power

point eight

civil war will happen between christians and non christians

point nine

after civil war islam will take over west




0
ANNAD
written by kope , November 04, 2012
written by ANNAD , November 04, 2012

You threaten us with violence?

are you retarded?
0
...
written by kope , November 04, 2012



written by ANNAD , November 04, 2012



See what happened after 9/11? It's true, your bros managed to killed 3000 innocent people and destroyed some property. Now, check the retaliation - how many Muslims died as a result of this attack? How much of their property was destroyed? ................

911 was necissary for to remove dictator saddam hussain


removing dictator saddam hussain was necissary to removing ALL DICTATORS in muslims's countries,


removing ALL dictators in muslims's countries was necissary to improving education and economic

improving education and economic is necissary to stop invader killing us


god works mysterious way

0
@ Kope - Predictions
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 04, 2012
> human need god

Unexplained assertion. Its ridiculous. What humans need is explanation. They need something that makes the world make sense to them. Religion offers that. And horribly. There are much better explanations. I make sense of the world with Objectivism and Popperism.

> christianity makes no sense

Agreed. Although Islam is about the same or worse.

> without religion human go depression

Unexplained assertion. This one is easily refuted with just one atheist that isn't depressed. So my existence refutes your assertion.

> western people join islam in mass

I think you're trying to say that the percentage of Westerners is increasingly becoming Muslim. Thats false. More Westerns are leaving Islam per year than Westerns becoming Muslims per year.

> anti islam will rise

As long as Muslims blow themselves up killing innocent people, yes anti-Islamism will be rampant.

> christians will elect fascist anti muslims leaders into power for to kick muslims out from the west

The West is composed of many countries. Are you saying that *every* single country's leaders will kick out Muslims? That ridiculous.

> and bring god's kingdom on earth

Are you talking about the coming of the Day of Judgement? Its a myth.

> and fags and atheists will not allow in kingdom of god

Atheist know that their existence will end upon death of their bodies. So we're ok with not going to your mythical heaven.

> seculars people would not like fascist's christians leaders in power

Agreed.

> civil war will happen between christians and non christians

That is ridiculous. Atheists and christians are living happily ever after in America. We are peaceful towards each other.

> after civil war islam will take over west

LOL!
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 04, 2012
Twisted logic if I ever saw one...
But I congratulate you Kope - you must have used up great amounts of cognitive functions to write such long posts.
Take a rest, you must be exhausted.

Once dictators are removed, then finally, an Islamic government will take over. God is great! God is great! God is great!
This is progress, Islamic way. And this will improve education and economics?
Education like in Afghanistan? Economics like in Saudi Arabia - living off oil, and oil only?

"God" does not work in mysterious ways Kope, humans do. And not mysterious ways Kope - Dumb, evil ways sometimes.
There is no god, baby-boy, you're gonna have to accept this eventually.
You know what I'm talking about. Aside from your 5 daily prayers, your hateful friends, never has god manifested itself in any form or fashion.
Never... - but still you believe he's there, scheming with his Islamic army to FINALLY, after 1400 years, take over earth...

You know Kope, it's the first time in history an ideology has visions of dominating the planet - Islam is REALLY original with this.
Really!!! - never before has anyone tried to conquer the world...
And by looking at history, you have about a 100% chance of NOT succeeding!
As for your nine points above - good luck with that, you're gonna need it.

Kope, you crack me up you sexually frustrated pathetic little man !
Now go back to your internet porn, it's gonna calm you down.
0
Truth about Islam
written by Rationalist , November 04, 2012
"Islam has had a calamitous effect on converted people. To be converted you have to destroy your past, destroy your history. You have to stamp on it, you have to say 'my ancestral culture does not exist, it does not matter'. Islam is in its origin an Arab Religion. Islam is not simply a matter of conscience or private belief. It makes imperial demands. A Convert's worldview alters. His holy places are in Arab lands. His sacred language is Arabic. His idea of history alters. He rejects his own: he becomes, whether he likes it or not, a part of the Arab story." ..... VS Naipaul, Nobel Laureate in Literature.


WHICH ONE OF THE ABOVE IS FALSE? Especially with subcontinent Muslims the situation is quite true. Every Muslim traces his ancestry to Arabs, Persian, Turks, and so on. They try Arabize or Persianize themselves at all levels. They hate their ancestral religion(s) in order to feel the warmth of Islam. Islam has ruined Muslims.
0
Kope's mind
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
Is a fine example of Muslim Mind

VIolent, sadistic, sabotaging and cowardly

All we have to do is read, that Muslim nincompoop's post, up there and know .

As if, the world needs more proves of Muslims utter madness and ridiculousness

20,000 terrorist attacks, have been committed since 9/11, by Muslims … but ***never as major and mass distructin as 9/11 .***

Why ?

Because …the West woke up to the real threats of Islam and Muslims …. now Muslims terrorists are being plucked from peaceful society, like one would pluck lice from Muslim Kope's head .

The world is ON to the likes of MUSLIM Kope .

notice …

He is too much of a cowered to come out and ACTUALLY say …

*** to dominate the world equates mass killing of westerners … becouse even a limited Muslim like him would understand that …*** NOT ALL WESTERNER WILL ACCEPT AN OUTRAGE AS ISLAM TAKING OVER THIER LAND AND MINDS .****

Muslim Kope is too much of a chicken to OUT AND SAY … " we Muslim will slay all Westerners who will refuse to convert …. like his pedophile criminal thief of a prophet Muhammad DID long time ago .
0
fineliving56
written by kope , November 04, 2012
you christians are dumb ass hole
0
Be a man Kope and come out and say, what you really want to say and you are too much of a cowered to do it
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
Ha ha ha

With all the Posts I have posted and the Muslims zombi Kope … did not get it in his pee wee head that I am an ex Muslima who did NOT convert to any religion AND WILL NEVER DO .

Now …. Who is barking insults ?



0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 04, 2012
Glad to see you're back to your one-liner posts Kope.

I'm an atheist Kope... Not a Christian.
But it's ok, I can understand you classify all non-Muslims in the same bag. We are non believers. And according to your cult, there are two classes of people right Kope?
Believers and Non-believers. Two classes right?
Or should that be three classes: Believers, Non-believers and Women... That't right, three classes.
Ooops! Gosh, I forgot slaves... FOUR classes then: Believers, Non-believers, Women and slaves... That's it, I've got it now...

But DANG ! I forgot apostates, they are kind of in a class by themselves.

So here goes: Believers, Non-believers, Women, slaves, Apostates.
But Apostates are pretty much walking corpses right Kope - they deserve death. So le'ts kind of say they are half a class.

There you have it Kope - The World according to Islam 4 and-a-hlaf classes of people - death warrants, drone Women and slaves. And non-believers that will end up believing, or it's the sword. When you are done killing the apostates, and killing the non-Muslims (including the Muslims that don't think like you) - ONLY THEN will earth be a paradise.

Ahhhhhhh Kope - you are indeed a soldier of Allah!
God is great! God is great! God is great !!!!
0
Fineliving56
written by Kaser , November 04, 2012
When you read people like Kope, seeing all this intolerance and hatred, it must help you even further solidify and strengthen your resolve that you made the RIGHT choice to leave Islam?

Have a great day Fineliving!
0
...
written by kope , November 04, 2012
written by Kaser , November 04, 2012

Glad to see you're back to your one-liner posts Kope.

I'm an atheist Kope... Not a Christian....................


i know you are deluted atheist jack ass
0
Hajji Malem
written by xyz , November 04, 2012
Hajji Malem rights to xyz

"No, never been to old Paki, but the fellow who cleans the units in our development is one, very hard laborers they are (especially in the UAE)"

Above comment from Malem (supposedly a Yemeni Arab) who has recently returned after performing pagan rituals in Kaaba to xyz is an eye opener. I never new Muslims not only hate each other on sect bases but on nationality bases as well.

This is what Balam always says how poisonous are Muslims. My advise to Malem/ abc / kope just spit Islam for one day and you guys will feel hatred free I promise you.
Islam is just hatred otherwise how Muslims will hate and kill each other not only sect but nationality base as well. Please I request you get rid of this hateful cult.

Comment from Malem should be enough for you to leave Islam . For humanity sake leave this hateful mafia this is dangerous and very poisonous.


0
xyz
written by kope , November 04, 2012
world will never going have unless you hindo stop drinking cow piss
0
Kaser
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
I doubt there any room or need of any reinforcement to my feelings of contempt '' for Islam .

Kope hate is diluted Islamic hate for the West … I have seen concentrated islamic hate radiating from Muslims … and it is not pretty .

Peace, to all of us …we want to live and let live in happiness and harmony … But Islam does not know the meanng of these two words .

They love to live in never ending struggle … even if they take over the world [ which is gibberish ] it will be not enough for them …

We [ the West ] have no choice but to destroy Islam … we have no choice !!!.. it sadden me to say that but it is true .

Good day to you too .
0
Xyz
written by fineliving56 , November 04, 2012
Muslims, Have been drinking camel urine since Muhammad like the taste of it and drank all he can drink from it … !!!

May be, that why Muslims, want to dominate the world .. the camel URINE made you want to do it .

It has powers ?! …

lol

0
Kope madar chod
written by xyz , November 05, 2012
"world will never going have unless you hindo stop drinking cow piss"

Kope kutte ke bache what kind of comment is this. I am talking about Malem's (kutti ka baccha ) hatred comment against Pakistanis and you are talking about cow piss what kind of motherfxxxxxr are you kope.
0
re: Kope
written by Gnostic , November 05, 2012
Kope you rendered your scenario for the future above, so here is mine:

1. Muslim countries will double there population in the next 20-30 years.

2. Muslim countries will run out of oil, water and food.

3. Muslims will suffer but still try to improve their situation by praying. But they will see no improvement at all.

4. The west will produce its engergy with solar cells, shale gas and anything else without arab oil. Prices will go down and muslm economies will collapse because muslims cannot produce anything with their brainless ideology.

5. Islam is over. Nobody will believe in this any more. Climate change will destroy Egypr, Bangla Desh and many other muslim countries and many will blame Saudi Arabia and other muslim OPEC-countries for it.

6. The world will have to deal with 2 billion muslims not able to find food, housing and jobs. The muslim world will be poorer than Africa which has become a growth center of the world in contrast to the arabs and other muslims who just do not get it!
0
re: Kope
written by Gnostic , November 05, 2012
Kope you rendered your scenario for the future above, so here is mine:

1. Muslim countries will double there population in the next 20-30 years.

2. Muslim countries will run out of oil, water and food.

3. Muslims will suffer but still try to improve their situation by praying. But they will see no improvement at all.

4. The west will produce its engergy with solar cells, shale gas and anything else without arab oil. Prices will go down and muslm economies will collapse because muslims cannot produce anything with their brainless ideology.

5. Islam is over. Nobody will believe in this any more. Climate change will destroy Egypr, Bangla Desh and many other muslim countries and many will blame Saudi Arabia and other muslim OPEC-countries for it.

6. The world will have to deal with 2 billion muslims not able to find food, housing and jobs. The muslim world will be poorer than Africa which has become a growth center of the world in contrast to the arabs and other muslims who just do not get it!
0
Gnostic
written by kope , November 05, 2012
your brain is small then fineliving56 she could have writen better
0
Kope Madar Chod
written by xyz , November 05, 2012

How are you kope apni maan chod rahe ho. You should be ashamed of yourself . Where is Malem kutti ka baccha and abc who is same like your tatta.
0
re: Kope
written by Gnostic , November 05, 2012
I forget to mention that more and more muslims will kill each other like they are already doing in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Syria, Lybia, Somalia, Mali ....
0
Xyz
written by abc , November 05, 2012
What you calling me for mr VIP!
"Kope Madar Chod"

You kiss your family with that dirty mouth???
0
...
written by kope , November 05, 2012
just imaging he kiss his wife with smell of cow piss
0
written by Gnostic , November 05, 2012
written by kope , November 05, 2012
written by Gnostic , November 05, 2012

I forget to mention that more and more muslims will kill each other like they are already doing in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq, Syria, Lybia, Somalia, Mali ....


thats what happen when you have a small brain
0
Kope
written by abc , November 05, 2012
Take it easy fella. I don't think xyz is a Hindu!
Besides this verbal hostility is not going anywhere.
0
...
written by kope , November 05, 2012
i agree with that but we must follow stick and carrot approach with this hindos
0
This is not me
written by xyz , November 05, 2012

I don't know who is this axxhole using my name.

I just wanted to know why Hajji Malem is using hatred comments towards Pakistanis.
I want to confirm that Muslims not only hate each other on sect basis but also nationality basis.

Maybe abc or kope can put some light on this. And yes I am a Pakistani living in Dubai and I left Islam many years ago. If someone has problem with this he ( kope or malem ) can kiss my axx.
0
Xyz
written by abc , November 05, 2012
I don't know what malem has said or what he meant.
If he has shown hatred towards Pakistanis then he is wrong.
Arabism is not an Islamic principle and he should not be proud of it.
0
xyz
written by malem , November 05, 2012
Seems people are utilizing other peoples blog names. I have no issue with people from Pakistan, never did nor any other part of the world. My office building is owned by a Pakistani gentlemen whom I go to he mosque with quite often. As for hatred the comments about me, my kids and my wives, well I just let that roll off my shoulder as I have no use for such comments.
0
Xyz
written by abc , November 05, 2012
There you go, a perfectly reasonable explanation.
Now take a chill pill!
0
Gnostic's scenerio continued
written by Yibel , November 05, 2012
Afganistan's GDP is currently 97 percent welfare - from the western nations. Egypt imports food which the government then subsidizes to make it affordable. US gives billions of dollars and forgives loans in order to keep Egyptians fed. Pakistan is in the same boat. Same with Iraq.

Northern Africa must import food as well. Without oil exports, Libyans would be starving now, as would Saudi Arabia. Iran will run out of exportable oil in a few years, and Syria already has. Syria has also been in a drought for several years and has had to import food. Jordan is in a similar situation; wells are drying up and Turkey has diverted river water to irrigate land in Turkey that used to flow into Jordan causing pastures and farmland to dry up.

If there is a drought in North America that lasts for even a few years (this past growing season is an example) much of the Muslim world is in for a world of hurt because North America is the world's bread basket, just as Egypt used to be during the heydays of the Roman Empire. Countries such as Japan and the other Pacific region nations are already looking for ways to reduce their dependence on North American grain.

Global climate change is already causing conflicts that could erupt into a major world war as shortages of food and water become more pronounced.
0
...
written by Truthseeker , November 06, 2012
***Nearly half of 600 Muslim-American citizens polled, who plan to vote in the 2012 presidential election, believe parodies of Muhammad should be prosecuted criminally in the U.S., and one in eight says the offense is so serious that violators should face death penalty.***

Huh...and you muslims think its perfectly acceptable to parody Christianity and Jesus christ, the only true perfect man. And yet you all cry like babies when people parody Muhammad, when the shoe is on the other foot.
0
The Muslim Malam who accuse me of lying, needs to first to deeply research, otherwise, he risk looking silly… but I think it is too late
written by fineliving56 , November 06, 2012
I told him, to ask if he want to know , like any other civilized man, would do …. but he, instead, accused me of lying, so he proved he is not civilized.

His accusation was about whether, Quran order Muslims to pray 3 or 5 times a day .

I said 5 … not becouse I want to show him wrong .. but I am after the TRUTH of Quran and if THAT , hurt Muslims feelings … that is tough … I say … live with it.

Must Muslims provided proves, that mandatory prayer are 5 times a day … [ fardd ] is because Muslims found that Quran have mentioned it, in different parts of Quran . but not necessarily, by using the word * SALAT * … there is Arabic word that means Salat .

SALAT … have a synonym word which is : *SAB'BIH bihamdika '' …or tasbeeh * which literally means '' to pray to Allah'' or '' to glorafy Allah'' using prayer beads called '' Masbaha '' … that tradition of prayer looks like it was stolen from other religion … it is similar to catholic rosary .

So in Quran .. Surah Al Nur and Al Ruum … all have to talked about '' Sa'abih means to make SALAT .

AL Noor , in 24/36 …

'' This light shines high in those houses where it is permitted to be raised to be honored, for the celebration of his name and prayed to, in *** morning [ salat the fajir ] and evening [ salat al magrib ] .

Al Ruum, 30 / 17/18

17 - [ to Muslims] pray [ Fasub'bhana ] when you inter the * evening [ salat Asr] , and prayers and your * mornings , [ fajir prayer ]

18 - And praise on to him, in heavens and to earth and[ pray] to him in * late afternoon [ salat asha ] and when '' the day begin' to decline'' * [ tuzhiroon come from Zuhur … noon time ] Salat al zuhir ]

So as we can see …

We have 5 prayers a day …[ SALAWAT ] and they are :

1- Morning [ al Fafir] … 2 -noon [ al Zuhir] … 3 - afternoon [ al Asr] …4 - evening [ al magrib ] …5- and late evening Salat al [ Asha]

So … as we all see Malam is wrong ..the Quran's Muslim has been wrong with all his prayers …that is not just me who is saying Muslims have to pray 5 times as I said … Muslims of Al Azhar and every devout Muslim say this fact .

It looks like Malam …have been shorting his Allah with 2 salats a day .. all he had to do, now is count all the times he missed all his life up to now and make it up … or Allah have * hot fire waiting for him * .. .. :)

or ..

He could drop the entire silly thing called Islam and become free …

Wishful thinking ?! … of course … no doubt about that


0
Fineliving
written by Malem , November 06, 2012
If it does not say Pray then it is not Pray...nice try though!
[30:17] Therefore, you shall glorify GOD when you retire at night, and when you rise in the morning.
[30:18] All praise is due to Him in the heavens and the earth, throughout the evening, as well as in the middle of your day.
2:238 - Maintain with care the [obligatory] prayers and [in particular] the middle prayer and stand before Allah , devoutly obedient.
11:114 And establish prayer at the two ends of the day and at the approach of the night. Indeed, good deeds do away with misdeeds. That is a reminder for those who remember.
17:78 Establish prayer at the decline of the sun [from its meridian] until the darkness of the night and [also] the Qur'an of dawn. Indeed, the recitation of dawn is ever witnessed.

That is 3 times, not 5....you should read the quran
0
...
written by kope , November 06, 2012
every body have their own understaning of islam, they should follow how and what ever their undertanding, one thing to remmember all are muslims what ever sect you followed

muslims, christians, jews, hindus, buddhists, all go to heaven if they do good to other human
0
Better?
written by Guy Macher , November 06, 2012
All Muslims believe the same filth, and succumb to the same hatreds. All Muslims are unfit to live in civilized countries.
0
Guy Macher
written by kope , November 06, 2012
western people are converting islam because they dont want your sex craze culture any more

read my blog please

http://hfghj23458654fgha.xanga.com/
0
...
written by kope , November 06, 2012
let me tell you about sects in islam

ALL sects of muslims are wrong about islam even my own i was born to

we muslims have to go back to early islam without sect and no school of thought
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Including Atheists
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
If at all there is heaven, yes, Kope all good people will go there, including Atheists. Paradoxically, there are few good people from the Muslim stock. For to a good human is to a bad Muslim and vise versa.
0
Correction
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
I mean, to be a good Muslim is to be a bad human. And since, presumably, majority of Muslims are good Muslims there are few good humans among them.
0
Worldpeace ,
written by kope , November 06, 2012
god will judge who is good who is bad amoung human
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Malem, fineliving
written by Kaser , November 06, 2012
Seems the Saudis, think there are 5 prayers.
How can they be wrong, I mean, the Quran is their CONSTITUION no?

http://www.islamicfinder.org/prayerDetail.php?country=saudi_arabia&city=Riyadh&email=&start=0&home=2012-11-6&aversion=&athan=

0
...
written by kope , November 06, 2012
saudis follow their conscious and malem follow his conscious both are correct

even one is wrong god will forgive because we human makes lot of mistake in life
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Kope
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
Kope, even humans can appropriate good and bad among them. If Muslims choose to be good humans they must avoid following their scriptures that incite violence, hatred for non Muslims, et al. If you are a good human (and I want to believe so), Kope, it is not because of Islam but your humanity.
0
...
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
Kope, even humans can appropriate good and bad among them. If Muslims choose to be good humans they must avoid following their scriptures that incite violence, hatred for non Muslims, et al. If you are a good human (and I want to believe so), Kope, it is not because of Islam but your humanity. You cannot be both a good Muslim and a good human, they are mutually exclusive.
0
Worldpeace
written by kope , November 06, 2012
saying whole group of people are bad that not make you good person, you sound like skin head they say all black are bad
0
Kope
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
Kope, I said good Muslims like Osama bin Laden and members of Boko Haram (in my country Nigeria) are bad humans, and it shows. I may be a bad human as you insinuate, but I have a chance to change. On the other hand, Muslims commit bad things as a religious duty expecting rewards
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Worldpeace
written by kope , November 06, 2012
look this is only one earth we have to lives togather in peace or kill each other

that is the choice we have to make

for me all religions and all race of people are important for to make better world
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Kope
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
I agree with you, Kope. Welcome to humanity. There may be truth in all religions but there are many negatives in them as well. It is our duty to weed the negative and bequithe a better world to the coming generations of humanity. In this project Muslims are behind, primarily, because of Islam, an ideology of We and Them.
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Worldpeace
written by fineliving56 , November 06, 2012
Have you noticed that todays's kope posts are, all about, peace, acceptance of others, love, and harmony … and everything goes .

While, so far up to yesterday, his posts were all about domination of Muslims over all others … threats … hate for all white people …. I mean what happen ??

Do not get me wrong, I like this Kope a lot better …

but I do not think he is the same Kope of yesterday's …

BTW … What he said today … is everything we have been trying to tell all that time .. did he suddenly got it ?!
0
Fineliving
written by Worldpeace , November 06, 2012
Yes, I notice that, fineliving. Afterall we are humans. Hope others will embrace the human spirit of love and peace. Have a fine day everybody.
0
abc/ kope
written by xyz , November 06, 2012
As per Malem there are 3 prayers instead of 5

"That is 3 times, not 5....you should read the quran"

OMG Abc/ kope can you see how clear is Islam.? An Arab Muslim Malem is proving from Quran there are 3 prayers and not 5 in a day.

Whole of Islamic world pray 5 times unlike few like Malem.

Isn't this enough proof my brothers abc/ kope to leave Islam?? Kope said Muslims have to leave sects to get united but here we are Quran itself is so contradictory which ( for me) is a proof that all sects in Islam are a result of quranic and Hadith contradictions confusions and not the vice versa.

abc/ kope can you confront Malem on this issue. I want to know what is your findings from Quran Hadith So called Prophet Muhammad and Allah. Is it 5 prayers or 3 prayers???

Such a contradictory and confusing teachings cannot be from a real GOD.

For god sake use your brains.
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wtf
written by Jye , November 06, 2012
It's Twilight Zone stuff in here... Has someone whacked Kope over the head with the humanity stick?
0
written by fineliving56 , November 06, 2012
written by kope , November 06, 2012
written by fineliving56 , November 06, 2012

Have you noticed that todays's kope posts are, all about, peace, acceptance of others, love, and harmony … and everything goes .................

you dont realy know me

i could be savior of the world realy
0
written by Jye , November 06, 2012
written by kope , November 06, 2012
written by Jye , November 06, 2012

It's Twilight Zone stuff in here... Has someone whacked Kope over the head with the humanity stick? ..............................


here is what i believe

"Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress, for Allah loves not the transgressor. Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not aggressors. And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers. But if they desist, then lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrongdoers." (Al-Baqarah 190-193)[1]


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XYZ- Kaser
written by Malem , November 06, 2012
My point is the Quran states there are 3 times per day to pray. Now if someone wants to Pray 5 times, the Quran does not prohibit that and if as Fineliving does, they interpret it to be 5 times a day so be it. Nothing wrong with communicating to Allah more or showing your appreciation with him more. Sometimes due to my schedule I am unable to pray during the middles of the day so I might pray 2-3 times at night. The point of Islam is to show your appreciation for all that Allah has provided and will provide. It is those who dont understand Islam that try to put wedges between muslims by bringing up such topics, but they will fail as usual.
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Prayer
written by Gnostic , November 06, 2012

The scholar Goldziher pointed out that there are three prayers in christianity in contrast to 5 in islam. According to his theory islam was strongly influenced by zoroastrism where 5 prayers a day were standard.
0
Just google '' Explore Quran''
written by fineliving56 , November 06, 2012
and surch '' prayer ''
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Malam …. you are such an obfuscate - tor … a bad one .
written by fineliving56 , November 06, 2012
For the life of me , I can not, one Muslim who will agree on everything Islamic, any where ? wow

When one search '' prayer '' in website '' explore Quran'' you will find that the Muslims who created this website have explained the Ayas I talked about in my last post with word '' Sab'ah ''

IS, IN FACT MEANS SALAT .. THEY WROTE IN BRACKETS THAT THE WORD '' SAB'AH '' MEANS '' SALAT '' AND THAT IS HOW THEY DERIVED THE NOTION OF THE MONTEREY 5 PRAYERS A DAY .

it is not ME who is saying, '' Sab'ah '' to mean'' Salat '' it is Arab Muslims imams who insist, that IS what it means .

Malam

You are such obfuscator …

First times I said Muslims have to pray 5 times according to Quran … you told me "" to stop LYING ""

And when I brought you proofs you said …"" nice try, and I have to do and read Quran again "" .

Then … now you say all is good … Muslims can pray what ever they want .. 1,2,3,4,5 ,100 prayer a day !!!!??? .. just because KOPE went ahead and said … it is fine with to do that .

LOOK WHO IS LYING NOW …. do you see your self ??? … how hypocritical you are ???!!

So which is it …?

was I lying … or …. was I Correct ? …. after all the proves, I have brought, according to you all Arab Muslims brothers and according to … '' Explore Quran '' ? ..and many more .

Malam … you make sick
0
Fineliving
written by Malem , November 06, 2012
Here are the facts, the Quran does not direct Muslims to pray 5 times a day, it says 3. However it does not say you cannot pray 5 times or 6 or 7. There is no lying just facts
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 06, 2012
> god will judge who is good who is bad amoung human

Are you saying you can't judge whether or not *you* are good?
0
He he
written by abc , November 06, 2012
The granny is going to blow her gasket!
Someone give her some valium!
0
He he
written by abc , November 06, 2012
The granny is going to blow her gasket!
Someone give her some valium!
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@ Kope - Terrorists are good?
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 06, 2012
> saudis follow their conscious and malem follow his conscious both are correct. even one is wrong god will forgive because we human makes lot of mistake in life

By that logic, terrorists are correct too. So, are you saying that terrorists are good?

Or do you mean something else?
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@ Kope - About Worldpeace
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 06, 2012
> saying whole group of people are bad that not make you good person, you sound like skin head they say all black are bad

Kope, you misunderstood Worldpeace. He said that *some* Muslims are bad and *some* Muslims are good. And by good and bad, he means the objective good and bad. (He doesn't mean what the Quran says is good or bad.) So, he *didn't* say a whole group of people is bad.
0
KOPE
written by Truthseeker , November 06, 2012
You said
****we muslims have to go back to early islam without sect and no school of thought ****

You dont even know what early islam was....in fact it had a lot more to do with Christianity than you realise. They even believed in Jesus as the son of God who died on the cross for our sins, and if you have ever read anything about the Sanaa Qurans you would learn that what they largely were, were mostly bible stories (much more properly quoted than the badly fouled up bible stories that you have in your current versions.)

0
KOPE
written by Truthseeker , November 07, 2012
You quoted

****"Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress, for Allah loves not the transgressor*****

How about john 3:16 For God so LOVED THE WORLD (and we are ALL transgressors) that He gave His only begotten Son so that whomseover believeth in Him shall not perish but have eternal life


You also quoted

****And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them.Such is the reward of disbelievers. ****

Luke 9:54 And when his disciples James and John saw [this] (that the Samaritans had rejected Jesus), they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?

Luke 9:55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.

Luke 9:56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save [them]. And they went to another village.
0
KOPE
written by Truthseeker , November 07, 2012
You said ****muslims, christians, jews, hindus, buddhists, all go to heaven if they do good to other human ****

How many people wish that could be true. But.....

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean [thing], and all our righteousnesses [are] as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

0
when to pray
written by Yibel , November 07, 2012
It was during the Night Journey that Muhammad established the prayer times:
According to Islamic tradition, Allah instructs Muhammad that Muslims must pray 50 times a day; however, Musa tells Muhammad that it is very difficult for the people and they could never do it, and urges Muhammad to go back several times and ask for a reduction, until finally it is reduced to 5 TIMES a day.
"Recite your prayers at sunset, at nightfall, and at dawn: the dawn prayer has its witnesses. PRAY DURING THE NIGHT AS WELL: AN ADDITIONAL DUTY, for the fulfilment of which your Lord may exalt you to an honourable station." Q. 17:71
“So be not you in doubt of meeting him’ when you met Musa during the night of Mi’raj over the heavens” Q. 32:23

BTW, the two gawds named in Chapter 17 are
Al-Muqaddim, The Expediter, He Who Brings Forward Q.17:34 and
Al Haleem, The Forbearing, The Indulgent Q.17:44
In Chapter 32, Muhammad's gawd is named Al-Muntaqim, The Avenger Q.32:22

Muhammad (or was it Jibril?) had a hard time making up his mind! So many gawds to choose from? So hard to decide! Or maybe Muhammad just had a bad memory. After all, the 17th surah was Muhammd's 50th tall tale, while the 32nd was his 75th. Hard to remember details from one time to the next when you're making it up as you go along!
0
Abc
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
You have three kids and one day they will get married and they will have kids of their own, and YOU abc … will become a grandaddy .

You believe your Allah, created this natural cycle …[ grandparents ]

Are you putting down Allah's creation ?! … tesk …tesk

Now abc is going to hell … no Jannah for you … there for …. no virgins for Abc … hahaha

I do not use valium … but I do take a pill called ..* logic and common sense * that is why I am cured from Islam … hahah ….

you should try it your self …. may be it will cure you from a sickness called * religion Islam * .
0
Truthseeker
written by kope , November 07, 2012


written by Truthseeker , November 07, 2012

You said ****muslims, christians, jews, hindus, buddhists, all go to heaven if they do good to other human ****

How many people wish that could be true. But.....

Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean [thing], and all our righteousnesses [are] as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. ....................


does your scripture makes sense to you if it does please explain?

all our righteousnesses are filthy rags?

feeding hungery , healing sick, helping poor all are filthy rags?
0
Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 07, 2012




written by This is Rami Rustom , November 06, 2012

> god will judge who is good who is bad amoung human

Are you saying you can't judge whether or not *you* are good? ...................

yes we can judge people but there is no guaranty we are correct about them
0
Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 07, 2012


written by This is Rami Rustom , November 06, 2012

> saudis follow their conscious and malem follow his conscious both are correct. even one is wrong god will forgive because we human makes lot of mistake in life

By that logic, terrorists are correct too. So, are you saying that terrorists are good?

Or do you mean something else?...............


who is going to decide who is a terrorists and who is not a terrorists?

0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
> yes we can judge people but there is no guaranty we are correct about them

Sure we can't be guaranteed. So what?

Do you judge that you are good?
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
> who is going to decide who is a terrorists and who is not a terrorists?

Lets talk about who is *objectively* immoral. Or rather, what acts are *objectively* immoral.

Is it moral to target and kill innocent people?
0
Kope
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
if you, keep up the civility like you have been doing ..people might think, hope is possible for Muslims …

Do we dare to hope ?

You ask who is going to decide who is a terrorist s or not a terrorist ?

OK …

Do you consider Osama bin Laden and his likes, terrorists ?

From your answer for that Question … we may might narrow down a possible answer for you question … OK
0
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
written by kope , November 07, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012

> who is going to decide who is a terrorists and who is not a terrorists?

Lets talk about who is *objectively* immoral. Or rather, what acts are *objectively* immoral.

Is it moral to target and kill innocent people? .....................


killing innocent people let to hell
0
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
written by kope , November 07, 2012


written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012

if you, keep up the civility like you have been doing ..people might think, hope is possible for Muslims …

Do we dare to hope ?

You ask who is going to decide who is a terrorist s or not a terrorist ?

OK …

Do you consider Osama bin Laden and his likes, terrorists ? '.......................



IF osama did 911 and god found him to be guilty he will go to hell

0
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
written by kope , November 07, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012

> yes we can judge people but there is no guaranty we are correct about them

Sure we can't be guaranteed. So what?

Do you judge that you are good? ...................


only god will decide i am good or bad i try to be good but most time failed
0
Kope
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
I am not talking about what Allah wants …. I would care if I believe he excites .

First he has to prove, he exists … so far nothing .. I am sorry …I know you do not agree but Quran is no prove of him, it is lousy and shameful way to tell about him self … if Allah was a real God he should have done better … a lot better .

The reason I asked YOU if you think Osama is a terrorist, so I could understand, what YOU consider, a person, a terrorist .

Now … I know you believe, if someone commit an immoral act like killing 3000 people in one day and calls it, a good thing to do because his Allah told him to do it, * is nothing but a TERRORIST * . …

So ….

That leads me to think, also, YOU must believe a man *MUHAMMAD*, who killed tribes of Jews and pagans because he believed his Allah told him to do it, IS NOTHING BUT A TERRORIST him self

Is that correct statement ?




0
...
written by kope , November 07, 2012
islam is fastest growing religion in christian's nations

did i answered your question?
0
Kope
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
No, it does not

You side tracked

Isn't Muhammad as much of a terrorist, as Osama bin Laden ? … after all they both killed people in the name of their Allah and his Quran. ?
0
...
written by kope , November 07, 2012
try this one

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfbtqxWxYc4
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
>> Lets talk about who is *objectively* immoral. Or rather, what acts are *objectively* immoral.
>
> Is it moral to target and kill innocent people?

> killing innocent people let to hell

That explanation is ambiguous about a certain part. What if a women was being gang raped. She is surrounded by men who have raped her and are in line to rape her. She grabs a knife from one of the rapists, breaks free, and makes her escape by shoving and stabbing her way through the surrounding crowd. Most of the crowd had been cheering the rapists on, some were pushing their way to the front intending to participate, but some who were pressing forward at the rear of the crowd had only just arrived and were still trying to find out what the big attraction was.

This women killed innocent people. According to your explanation, she would go to hell.

Did you intend to mean that?

Notice that I said "target and kill innocent people" and you left out the "target" part.
0
Kope
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
Why would I want to look at ninjas who supposed to be women … don't I have enough looking at all my life .

No thanks

You are wrong ..if some delusional people converting to Islam … that does not mean the whole world would …

75% of westerners who go to Islam , leave it in the first year .

Think about that …

BTW

I will take your non- answer, ANSWER to my Question up there, as, you KNOW Quran's Muhammad is no better then Osama bin Laden , he was nothing but a terrorist as ruthless as any war criminal there has been …

By avoiding answering my question, you showed that you agree with what I said , but you are not welling or too prideful to admit to such rightful comparison … so you come back with a youtube useless video .

Islam is dying from Inside out … millions of ex Muslims are born every year is a proof of that .

Take care
0
Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 07, 2012
i understanding what are you trying to say

i think you need some mentel help

0
fineliving56
written by kope , November 07, 2012
watch this


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZagJALOfLE&feature=related
0
fineliving
written by malem , November 07, 2012
more than 90% of westerners becoming muslims stay as muslims. westerners love them so much they just re-elected one!
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
> i understanding what are you trying to say. i think you need some mentel help

You mean, because I'm thinking about things deeper that you have? That means I need mental help?

Are my ideas disturbing for you? I guess so. Doesn't that mean that *you* are the one with the problem that needs solved?

Instead of addressing my criticism of your explanation, you choose to attack *me*. That is evasion. Why are you evading criticism?

By evading criticism you admit that your explanation is flawed. Is that what you intended? If not, then this time, don't evade my criticism.

0
KOPE
written by FOOL , November 07, 2012
you are hopeless
0
Rami
written by malem , November 07, 2012
It is not Kopes decision as to whether a person is good or not good in the eye of Allah, it is Allah. Kope stated that earlier. What you are trying to do with presenting such a case is to try and get someone to fall into a trap of stating whether that person is innocent or not, or in this case good or not good etc.. Allah is the person who is the judge at the end of your life, it is he who will determine where you will go.

By the way FOOL, your name fits you perfectly! great job lad
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 07, 2012
> It is not Kopes decision as to whether a person is good or not good in the eye of Allah, it is Allah. Kope stated that earlier. What you are trying to do with presenting such a case is to try and get someone to fall into a trap of stating whether that person is innocent or not, or in this case good or not good etc.. Allah is the person who is the judge at the end of your life, it is he who will determine where you will go.

No. I'm not asking whether or not a specific person is going to be judged such that he goes to hell or heaven.

I'm asking if a certain act is moral or not. Are you saying that you can't answer this question? And if you can't answer this question, then how do you know what to do with your life? How do you know what is right or wrong?

I asked: Is it moral to target and kill innocent people?

You should be able to answer that. If you can't answer, then you're saying you think its moral. You're saying you would do it.

So would you do that? If you did it, do you consider it an evil act? Is it a sin?
0
Rami
written by Malem , November 07, 2012
The Quran prohibits the direct killing of an innocent person for no reason. I wonder how the west answers this question with the constant drone targeting that takes out innocent people....
0
Malam
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
No Malam … WOW you are so wrong . google it … 75% of westerners who convert to Islam leave it in the first year .

Obama is not a Muslims you are wrong again ..

He started out a Muslim as a child but he was raised by a Christian by a white mother ….

people attached Islam to him to get of rid of him … why do you think all Islamic countries, now hate him and want his head … it is because they realized he is NOT A MUSLIM …. he killed thier hero Osama and other Muslim terrorist .

He is a closeted ATHEIST …… who ACT like a Christian to appease CHRISTIANS people, and get them to elected him .. without some Christians and blacks and women … he would not have been elected a second term, yesterday … that is a fact

He was taped, unknowingly in the beginning of his first election, saying '' how religious people are not as sophisticated as non religious people '' or something to that effect, and they called him " an leadest '' who thinks, religion is synonymous with backwardness …. later he had to apologize for this honest but revealing remark that tells of his real feelings about religions in all .

Obama is a politician through and through … and thats means he could color him self as he likes what ever the situation warranted …

he praised Muslims .. but he killed their leader and he is after ever one them and he want to pluck them like you one pluck, hair

He said he was a Christian but distanced him self from his paster when the paster became a weight he cannot carry .. he goes to church for show .

Malam … you actually believed he is a Muslim … hahaha … be careful … he might come and pluck you … just behave Muslim Malam .. just do not do anything Obama dose not like …. hahaha

The time has NOT come for an atheist or agnostic man or women, to be able to be elected a president of America … but it will one day .

Mitt was not elected because he was religious mormon who thinks governments and presidents has the RIGHT to dictate what happens in every American women's uteruses ….. he said he will repeal ROW VIRSUS WADE CASE when he becomes a president .. most young women DID NOT like that at all … women who voted for Obama were almost double in comparison to women who voted for Mitt … and that is a fact .

BTW … Obama … not only a non Muslim … he does not know of real Islam and Quran and relies on Muslim devotes to give him pointers … that is why , it does not bother him to defend Islam and kill Muslim trouble makers .

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About Obama
written by fineliving56 , November 07, 2012
I wrote a long post to show you how wrong you about Obama ..

His not a Muslim ,,, I think he is a closed atheist …I explained in my the post .=taken away .

Mitt would have WON the presidency, if he was NOT a Mormon who thinks his God HAVE THE RIGHT and could tell women what to do when it comes to their bodies and their reproductive system and each eggs they ever produce …

He want small governments … too bad his idea of government was not small enough to leave women to decide whether, they want or able or not able to raise every fertilized age that happen inside their uterus .

No...

he wants the government to dictate such personal issues … and Now they are stuck with Obama whom half of Americans do not like .

But with all that … America will still survive and over come all these problems .


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@ Malem/Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
> The Quran prohibits the direct killing of an innocent person for no reason. I wonder how the west answers this question with the constant drone targeting that takes out innocent people....

Terrorists target and kill innocent people.

The US military targets and kills those terrorists (defined above), and as a consequence, the drone strikes also kill innocent people.

But, take note. Some non-terrorists are not innocent. They harbor terrorists, which means they are guilty too. Instead of harboring terrorists, they should alert the police about the terrorists.
0
Rami
written by Malem , November 08, 2012
Terrorists are not acting as good Muslims if they act that way. So your assumption that somehow they represent a Muslim is wrong.

So its a consequence when the west does it, interesting I guess that is called conditional targeting.

0
MALEM
written by FOOL , November 08, 2012
If wise people are stupid like you, I am better a fool.
0
Rami Rustom ,
written by kope , November 08, 2012
LISTEN TO ME CAREFULLY

ALL RELIGIONS PROHIBITED KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE

IF THAT YOU CANT UNDERSTAND SEEK HELP
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
> LISTEN TO ME CAREFULLY. ALL RELIGIONS PROHIBITED KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE. IF THAT YOU CANT UNDERSTAND SEEK HELP

Since you never answered my question about the raped women, I guess you believe that her act of defending herself and accidentally killing an innocent man, is a sin.
0
@ Malem
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
> Terrorists are not acting as good Muslims if they act that way. So your assumption that somehow they represent a Muslim is wrong.

What assumption? I said nothing about their religious affiliation. Read my post again. Quote the part that makes the assumption you say.
0
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
written by kope , November 08, 2012
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012

> LISTEN TO ME CAREFULLY. ALL RELIGIONS PROHIBITED KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE. IF THAT YOU CANT UNDERSTAND SEEK HELP

Since you never answered my question about the raped women, I guess you believe that her act of defending herself and accidentally killing an innocent man, is a sin.


(((( you are very twisted man no wonder that you are an atheist )))
0
Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 08, 2012
i think you understand what i am saying but you want to argue like a child

but remember you just look stupid
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 08, 2012
Yeah Kope but you seem to conveniently forget that for Radical Islam, Apostates are not "innocent people"
Non-belivers and not "Innocent people"
Islam teaches to kill apostates and slay the non-believers. For crying out loud, it teaches to beat you disobedient wife !!!
So please, quit it with your delirious concepts of Islam being the religion of puppies, cuddly bears and bunny rabbits.
Its followers kill every day in it's name.
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 08, 2012
Yeah Kope but you seem to conveniently forget that for Radical Islam, Apostates are not "innocent people"
Non-belivers and not "Innocent people"
Islam teaches to kill apostates and slay the non-believers. For crying out loud, it teaches to beat you disobedient wife !!!
So please, quit it with your delirious concepts of Islam being the religion of puppies, cuddly bears and bunny rabbits.
Its followers kill every day in it's name.
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Malem
written by Kaser , November 08, 2012
You said: "Terrorists are not acting as good Muslims if they act that way. So your assumption that somehow they represent a Muslim is wrong."
This is according to YOUR interpretation of the Quran/Islam.
Seems many many Muslims don't interpret it the same way you do my friend.
This results in many many Nigerian deaths... And Iraqi deaths... And Afghani deaths... Ect...

And there is this constant double-standard.

AMERICANS, with their super-technology must surgically strike their enemies, apologizing when they hit civilians. Civilians that fall in any of the following categories: Combattants, Sympathizers, Human shields or actual innocent victims). As to the "human shields" victims - what does that say about those that use them as shields? I do not often see Americans strap young kids to the front of their tanks.

TERRORIST, mostly kill innocent victims. Blowing themselves up in markets, restaurant, public places, police stations. Oh, and sometimes checkpoints with military personnel. But it's much easier to target innocent civilians. And what about the human bombs the terrorits use? Conditioned young men sent to their deaths in exchange for promises of 72 virgins?
Except those like the 9/11 hijackers - chanting Allahu Akbar before the planes hit...

Islam - the religion of suicide bombers. Something to be proud of???
0
written by Kaser , November 08, 2012
written by kope , November 08, 2012
written by Kaser , November 08, 2012

Yeah Kope but you seem to conveniently forget that for Radical Islam, Apostates are not "innocent people"
Non-belivers and not "Innocent people"
Islam teaches to kill apostates and slay the non-believers. For crying out loud, it teaches to beat you disobedient wife !!!
So please, quit it with your delirious concepts of Islam being the religion of puppies, cuddly bears and bunny rabbits.
Its followers kill every day in it's name. ........

((( let talk honestly so we can understand eachother clearly .
i admitted we have radical who are intolerent toward other people but radicals also exist in amoung non muslims too they are inolerent toward muslims.

we have to educate radicals amoung us and you before we kill eachother ))))
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@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
> i think you understand what i am saying but you want to argue like a child. but remember you just look stupid.

I can't be sure about that. You left it ambiguous. When people do that, it means they want to have plausible deniability. Since what they say could be interpreted in more than one way, they can switch to the ones they want during discussion. This is a common evasion technique.

To prevent that, I make sure that I'm clear on your position so that I can reduce ambiguity.
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
> let talk honestly so we can understand eachother clearly. i admitted we have radical who are intolerent toward other people but radicals also exist in amoung non muslims too they are inolerent toward muslims. we have to educate radicals amoung us and you before we kill eachother.

You weren't talking to me but I'd like to engage with you about that. What do you think it would take for things to get fixed? How do the radicals not be radicals anymore? How do we figure out how to do that?

I think whats needed is tolerance. Tolerance of dissent of ideas. Consider the 20 countries of Muslims protesting the Mohamed video. And the violence that has occurred. These people do not exhibit tolerance of dissent of ideas. What would they have to learn so that they don't think and act that way?
0
Rami Rustom
written by kope , November 08, 2012
you need to learn how to debate, remember you are not FBI againt trying to get some f**king confussion from me

when you debate with other try to be smart not jack ass
0
Kope
written by Kaser , November 08, 2012
The big difference Kope, is that Islam TEACHES supremacism, while Western countries try to eradicate it - reason why Muslims are welcomed in Western Countries, But Christians and Jews ARE NOT welcome in Islamic countries.

Believers are better than non-believers. Jews are pigs, Christians are vile.
Women are also second class citizens - even unable to pray in the same Mosques à Men.

Like I said before, this supremacist thinking breeds intolerance, which breeds contempt which breeds violence.
Islam is unique in terms of the sheer scope of these acts - no other ideology uses violence to such a large extent.
0
@ Kope
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 08, 2012
> you need to learn how to debate, remember you are not FBI againt trying to get some f**king confussion from me. when you debate with other try to be smart not jack ass.

I debate with you the same way I do with everyone else. And I've never encountered a problem until you.

What did I do wrong? I asked you questions about your position, because I'm not clear on your position. You're calling this a bad debate technique?
0
Kaser
written by Malem , November 09, 2012
Islam does not teach supremacism, where do you see that. That would be if you went around the world for example, bombing countries, invading them to do what you want.....wait a minute I know a country like that!

Kope, you are correct with Rami
0
Malem
written by Kaser , November 09, 2012
Going around the world, bombing countries is an ACTION... an EVENT.
The question is this: What is the MOTIVATION behind bombing these countries (Iraq and Afghanistan, I presume).
I believe the motivation is purely strategic, and based solely on ENERGY reserves there.
Energy reserves that are in the hands of fanatic, freedom-hating dictators or weak governments.
There is a power void there, somebody has to fill it. If not the USA, then China or Russia.
Russia is too poor to undertake such a campaign and it's got oil and gas reserves a plenty.
China cannot piss the West off, we might stop giving them billions for cheap Nike shoes and cheap electronics.
So China keeps quiet.

But Malem, what about the motivations of the Darfur genocide? The Armenian genocide? The Boko Haram attacks? The Ansar Dine oppression? The Al-Shaabab actions?
Most of them are ethnic of religious in nature. All of them in the name of Islam.

I don't see the Americans "praising god" when the launch an attack.
I don't see the American strapping bombs and blowing themselves in public markets.
I don't see the Americans making Islam illegal in the States, like Christianity is illegal in Saudi Arabia.

I do see Shiites killing Sunnis.
I do see Sunnis killing Shiites.
I do see Muslims killing Christians.

I did see Iraqis killing Iranians.
I did see Iraqis killing Kurds.

I could go on.

Like I said - If it was not the USA in Iraq or Afghanistan, it would be China or Russia.
Deal with it - the US was quicker to react to secure these energy reserves.

Most middle eastern countries are unable to govern themselves.
They are too busy praising Allah, praying FIVE times a day, and believing Allah controls everything.
After all, he is most wise, all knowing and all...
0
@ Everyone
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 09, 2012
For those of you that have been following the discussion between Kope and I, I need your help. My intent was to have a discussion where we reach the truth. But somehow the discussion was sabotaged. Kope thinks I was the cause of that.

I've noticed many discussions get sabotaged on this site. And I thought I had figured out a way to prevent the sabotaging. But apparently I failed. I refrained from name calling and sarcasm (even when others did it to me -- I took the moral high ground). That allowed me to engage with Kope/Malem/abc/Reed. But with each one of them, discussion ended anyway. The latest discussion ended in an interesting way. Kope said I'm debating badly. But he didn't explain what I'm doing wrong so that I could fix it. Why did this happen? I think I know why.

The conventional understanding of debates and debate methods is like this. Each person chooses a side to be the truth. During their discussion, each person is trying to persuade the other that his side is true. Do you see the problem here? I'll explain what the problem is by explaining something else that these conventional debaters don't know about -- philosophical discussion.

What is philosophical discussion and how does it work? In a philosophical discussion, each person has his set of ideas. And one or more of one guys ideas conflict with one or more of the other guy's ideas. So they are having a discussion in order to resolve a conflict between their ideas. How do they do that? Well first, both people need to understand than any of their ideas might be mistaken. That means that by the end of the discussion, a person might change their mind about their idea. It means that neither person should assume the truth. The point of the discussion is to discover the truth, not to assume it before the discussion starts. Ok, so then what? How does the discussion play out? Here's the general steps:

(1) One guy states his theory. Another guy has a conflicting theory, so he states it too.

(2) Each guy tries to create criticisms of each other's theory (and their own theory). A criticism is an explanation of a flaw.

(3) Then each guy considers each other's criticisms and tries to criticize them.

(4) Repeat until no one has any more criticisms to offer.

At the end of this, what is left? Well there are 3 possible outcomes:

(i) The first guy's theory is unrefuted (that means there are no unrefuted criticisms of his theory).

(ii) The second guy's theory is unrefuted.

(iii) Both theory's are refuted.

(to be continued...)
0
@ Everyone (continued)
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 09, 2012
Now I'll recap what I explained:

(1) The theories are guesses.

(2) Each guy tries to create criticisms of the theories. Note that the criticisms are themselves guesses. A criticism is an explanation of a flaw in an idea (as in any one of the original theories or any one of the criticisms). What would happen if someone stated a flaw without explanation? It useless. Its not persuasive. So how should someone criticize the unexplained assertion? By explaining that "Your assertion that my idea is flawed is explanationless." This criticism refutes the unexplained assertion. Also, he could ask for an explanation, "What is your explanation for your assertion that my idea is flawed?"

On another note, conventional debaters don't criticize their own theories. Why not? Because they already assumed their theories to be true.

(3) What happens if someone doesn't address a criticism of one of his ideas? It means he's burying his head in the sand about his idea. This sabotages discussion. It sabotages trut-seeking. This is called evasion. Why do people evade criticism? Sometimes the evasion is subconscious. Sometimes its conscious. Why do people subconscously evade criticism?

See my article "Why do people rationalize?":
http://ramirustom.blogspot.com/2012/10/why-do-people-rationalize.html
0
Rami
written by Kaser , November 10, 2012
Kope is unstable.
Sometimes he seems tolerant and calm, even open-minded!
Other times, ultra-racist and aggressive.
It's very difficult to carry a discussion.
You just experienced it.
0
kaser
written by malem , November 10, 2012
Sorry lad china OWNS you, you sold your souls for cheapp sneakers mate.
0
Malem
written by Kaser , November 10, 2012
The federal debt is owned primarily by the US population.
28% of it is owned by international or foreign investors.
Of this 28% amount, China owns 26% of it, down from 27% a year ago.
So 26% of 28% = 7.28% of the federal debt belongs to China.
Hardly owning the United States...
0
Insight on western muslims from a muslim (80% are beggars)
written by Infidel and More Proud , November 10, 2012
http://www.memritv.org/clip/en...0/3617.htm
Yahya Abu Zakariya: It has become customary for the sheiks preaching in mosques to talk, in their sermons and lectures, about "the infiltrating infidel West," "the European-Crusader West," "the abode of infidels and the abode of Islam."
I have presented claims that the Muslims in Andalusia engaged in fornication, homosexuality, and debauchery. Today, if you go to the West and tour the European continent, where there are 50 million Muslims... 80% of these Muslims are beggars, living on Western welfare. In other words, the European pays taxes, and the state gives the Muslim money to buy food. The Muslim in the West does not earn his daily bread. If he were in the Islamic world, he would die – even the cows and the goats cannot get their sustenance in the Islamic world. 80% are unemployed. Let me give you an example from Sweden. There are 500 Islamic associations and only one Jewish association. Every mosque in Europe suffers from theft. In accordance with the European law for support of religions and cultural diversity, the state provides Muslims with funding, and the managers of the mosques steal those funds. At times, you encounter an Imam who employs his wife as the floor sweeper, and then tells her to stay at home. Then you have fake divorces. A Muslim divorces his wife on paper, and when social services give her a home, he takes his wife back and they rent out the house on the black market. I used to visit Muslim prisoners in the West. Those drug deals and rapists would say to me: Tell the warden to get us halal food. They wanted their meat slaughtered in the Islamic way. I would say to them: Even if you were eating pork, it would renounce you. You peddle drugs in the name of Muhammad and Islam, yet you claim that you belong to the pure Islamic civilization.
The Muslims do not rise to the level of their religion. The bombings that took place in London, in Madrid, and all around, the Western image of a Muslim boastfully slaughtering... The camera shows a long-bearded Muslim slaughtering another Muslim, while crying "Allah Akbar." What do you expect from the West when it is exposed to such rotten ethics? To simply ignore this and absolve them?
Ali Abd Al-Aal: Man, you are weird.
Yahya Abu Zakariya: As weird as the Islamic world.
Ali Abd Al-Aal: I really don't know what to do about you.
Yahya Abu Zakariya: May God help you.
Ali Abd Al-Aal: Give me a chance to talk here. We are aware of everything you mentioned. These things exist, but I don't think we should be wasting your time, my time, and that of the viewers on your listing of tragedies, afflictions, and crimes...
Yahya Abu Zakariya: I did not come here in order to denounce America and Europe. I am entirely with you: Let's bring down America, but first, let's stop slaughtering one another, and then we can attack America.
0
kaser
written by malem , November 10, 2012
You obviously skipped econimcs class. the debt which is now around 17 trillion is only 1 component, if china stopped buying bonds tomorrow the west would come to a screaching halt, they only buy to keep their own currency devalued, plus the billions in trade surplus, plus the rush of companies leaving the west for china, the west become like greece soon, just a service economy, no manufacturing 30-40 percent unemployed just another puppet state for father mao
0
Malem
written by Kaser , November 10, 2012
0
Malem
written by Kaser , November 10, 2012
Nice try Malem. Watch China "The Glass Tiger" start to face the same problems are others.
The time when they could count on cheap labour does not last for ever.
But I have respect for Chinese. They are hard workers. They took their place.

The world's economic superpowers still run the show, and nowhere is Islam present, sadly...
And all of them have Freedom of religion - unlike where Islamism rules.
Conclusion Malem? Islam = economic stand-still and poverty.

The top 5...
#1 - USA: 15,000 B$ GDP
#2 - China: 7,000 B$ GDP
#3 - Japan: 6,000 B$ GDP
#4 - Germany: 3,600 B$ GDP
#5 - France: 2,800 B$ GDP
...
#17 - Indonesia!!!!: 830 B$ GDP - Congratulations a predominantly Muslim country!
#18 - Turkey!!! 760 B$ GDP

So cry me a river Malem, the good old US of A are there for a long long time...

But watch Egypt further circle the drain with the "Brothers" now in charge, and establish an Islamic state.
Already tourism is all but dead. Have you received your 1B$ USA welfare check yet???

Allahu Akbar! Allahu Akbar! Allahu Akbar!
Praise Allah, for he has given it's followers ignorance and irrelevance on the world stage!!!
But good back muscles - bending over 5 times a day...
0
kaser
written by malem , November 11, 2012
Yes you will continue to give billions to egypt and no questions asked hahaha
0
Malem
written by Kaser , November 12, 2012
Oh, I'm sure there are many questions asked...
Such as making sure Egypt plays nice with Israel...
Such as making sure Egypt does not disturb too much while we suck all the oil out of the region.
Such as making sure Egypt still remains a "religious freedom" state...
Mouuuhahahahaha!!!!!
0
...
written by Georgina , November 12, 2012
I do not blame the muslims - they are just obeying their childhood indoctrination.
I blame the judiciary - for not throwing all their claims out of court and making them pay the costs.
You want to wear a mask at work and your boss says no? Get another job.
You want time off to pray? Do it silently, in your tea break or lunch break.
You want your children separated at school? No way, they will be taught gender equality and civilized behaviour.
You think bullying/harassing your co-workers is religious freedom? You are fired.

If they didn't get away with so much, they would stop doing it.
0
@ Georgina
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 12, 2012
> I do not blame the muslims - they are just obeying their childhood indoctrination.

I disagree. They are to blame. They can choose better. They are not "ruled" by social ideas. They have their own minds. They have free will to choose better. But you're right that their parents are to blame for indoctrination. And their parents parents are to blame. And so on.

> I blame the judiciary - for not throwing all their claims out of court and making them pay the costs.

Agreed.

> You want to wear a mask at work and your boss says no? Get another job.

Freedom!

> You want time off to pray? Do it silently, in your tea break or lunch break.

Right.

> You want your children separated at school? No way, they will be taught gender equality and civilized behaviour.

You can send your children to a private Muslim school if you want. If that doesn't exist in your town, then move to a town that does have a Muslim school, or make one yourself.

> You think bullying/harassing your co-workers is religious freedom? You are fired.

Unless your boss is a Muslim who agrees with that behavior.
0
Georgia and Rami
written by Malem , November 13, 2012
If you infringe on others freedom of religion you will have to face the court. That is the basis of law in the West, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. That is whether Georgie or Rami like it or not.

What you are saying is that you do not want to extend the same freedoms to certain religions.
First if a women chooses to wear a hijab or veil, that should be their choice. You let the Jewish people where Yamakas? You let the Amish where headcovers? Many Indians wear headscarves? So what you are saying is you just want certain religions to have freedom and not all? At least we have the established.

You want time off to pray. So you have a Holiday for Christians sevral times per year, Jewish people are allowed to go home from work before the sun goes down and not have to work certain holidays. But you dont want to extend that to Muslims...Seems like a pattern is developing Rami!!!

Children in the West have School Choice, no big deal. Muslim based schools, Christian Schools, etc.. they can all exist. BUT you cannot make just Muslims go to public school can you? Or is this the same ONLY for certain religions we allow special exceptions again. Definitely a pattern here Rami

So Rami and Georgia, you just want to limit freedoms for certain religions that YOU think should have them. Intolerance is what that is called, its also against the laws of the WEst when it comes to freedom of religion

Anyone bullying anyone should be deal with according to the law, no matter what religion or non religion they are.
0
@ Malem - How freedom works
written by This is Rami Rustom , November 13, 2012
> What you are saying is that you do not want to extend the same freedoms to certain religions. First if a women chooses to wear a hijab or veil, that should be their choice. You let the Jewish people where Yamakas? You let the Amish where headcovers? Many Indians wear headscarves? So what you are saying is you just want certain religions to have freedom and not all? At least we have the established.

You're confused about how freedom works. Each person is free to wear whatever clothing they want. But, some businesses want to use cameras for security, in which case they want all hats and sunglasses removed. If a woman wears a scarf that covers her face, this a problem for the bank. The solution for the bank is to refuse to serve the face-covered woman. This *is* freedom. The bank has the freedom to deny service. And the women does not have the legal right to infringe on the bank's freedom of its no hat/sunglasses rule.

> You want time off to pray. So you have a Holiday for Christians sevral times per year, Jewish people are allowed to go home from work before the sun goes down and not have to work certain holidays. But you dont want to extend that to Muslims...Seems like a pattern is developing Rami!!!

Those businesses have the freedom to make their own rules for their employees. They can choose to schedule their employees so that they have time off during holidays. This is their choice. Its not forced on them by employees. Now if all the employees had to have the same time off (for whatever business reason), then I guess they would choose a schedule that fits the majority of the employees, which happens to be the Christian holiday schedule. If some employees don't like it, they can talk to management. If management says no, they have the freedom to go to another employer. Those employees do not have the legal right to infringe on the businesses freedom to set its employee schedules.

> Children in the West have School Choice, no big deal. Muslim based schools, Christian Schools, etc.. they can all exist. BUT you cannot make just Muslims go to public school can you? Or is this the same ONLY for certain religions we allow special exceptions again. Definitely a pattern here Rami

I don't know what you're talking about. In Illinois, Muslims can go to whatever private school they want to go to. And if they choose to go to a public school, they can only go to the school assigned to where they live. Or they could choose not to go to any school at all.

> So Rami and Georgia, you just want to limit freedoms for certain religions that YOU think should have them. Intolerance is what that is called, its also against the laws of the WEst when it comes to freedom of religion.

You are confused. Muslims have the freedom to practice their religion. But they do not have the legal right to force other people to follow their religious traditions.

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About the book || Reviews by: Steven Simpson | Abul Kasem | Prof Sami Alrabaa | Ibn Kammuna

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