For thousands of years, the world has been in an almost constant state of religious tension, dispute and violence. During this time, humanity has been hit by a continual wave of religious fanaticism that enslaves the body, mind and soul of man to a heinous and oppressive ideology. This psychology, however unfortunate, is obviously innate to the human mind.
Also innate to the human mind, fortunately enough, is the desire to be free and liberated from all enslaving and degrading regimes and ideologies. The psychological and oppressive aspect of the human mind also possesses the mania to associate itself with ‘God’, the greatest power of the cosmos and the living world. Hence, this psychotic criminal element that desires to enslave and exploit humanity passes itself off as a ‘bread of religion…’
Let us challenge all those, having a religious bent, to show us that ‘where is the humanity within their religions.’ In the case of the fanaticism that frequently defines a religion, the problem is, if this fanaticism becomes less harsh, cruel, brutal, intolerant and violent, it won't be the same religion anymore ...or will it? And Islam has the biggest ego to reprimand human beings into believing everything is greener on its side of the valley.
Let the People Go!
All free, liberated and sovereign human beings need to demand fanatical religionists to demonstrate the humanity of their religion. Such a demonstration would mean allowing the following:
- Women may wear whatever they wish, in whatever colors they desired. They may expose their beauty for the entire world to see. If there were any decent god out there, SHE would be disgusted by the treatment of Her beautiful creation within fundamentalist religion.
- Women may choose their husbands OUT OF LOVE. If men may have more than one spouse, women may do likewise. Women should be able to live in an abuse-free environment full of joy, happiness and love. ALL of humanity needs to strive for such a state of enlightened life. Anything less than striving for …true love and community is degradation of humanity, the living creation, and of any creator of such.
- Children are free to believe in what they wish about God, religion, afterlife, etc.; they can be taught about a wide range of beliefs and disbeliefs without ever being brainwashed into one religion/cultism.
- Children should not be compelled to recite long, boring, VIOLENT and bigoted 'sacred scriptures' that teach them not only to hate themselves but also to hate others who are not like them, who do not share their rigid beliefs and their cultural traditions.
- Children should be allowed to be children and not be indoctrinated into adult communal matters, including and especially warfare, hatred of others, bigotry, prejudice, genocide, misogyny, etc., ad nauseam. Teaching children such hateful things, including hating themselves and life in general, constitutes CHILD ABUSE of the highest order. This child abuse includes telling innocent and beautiful little children that they are ‘born in sin’ and are just pieces of garbage, which is utterly unworthy in the eyes of the great and glorious God/Allah, who is wholly separate and apart from this ‘lower’ creations. This emotional and psychological child abuse is a LIE. Period. It should not be allowed.
Just their mental abuse, beating children physically for not learning or accepting their religion is pure EVIL. Leave the children alone! They will develop naturally as healthy and happy human beings—and, if there's any true religion on the Planet Earth, that is it! Nothing more and nothing less!
For the children to know what life is all about, let them be just children.
And let the children show YOU the way out of the manmade HELLS created on Earth because of absurd religions. No decent god worth the salt would be interested in oppressive and brutal anti-human psychosis that passes itself off as ‘religion’ in our living world. To humanize the current violent, malevolent and woman-hating religious fanaticism, it would require utter changes in the thinking to point, where it no longer exists. With this sort of religious bias existing in societies, it is impossible to humanize the human mind, because it is so entirely inhumane and anti-human.
In the long run, that which is truly humane in any given religion, what constitutes common decency and morality, is already intrinsic within the human mind and does not need religion either to create or sustain it. If religion is to serve any purpose at all, it must emphasize and develop that common decency and morality, which provides the greatest chance for benevolence to thrive to its fullest potential of the ‘belief system’.
Comments (41)
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written by Sim , August 11, 2009
Its such a religion that it will devour a good part of humanity and as the muslim population swells in western world, the bombings , hate, killings, terrorist acts will continue to increase. A far of malay muslim or Indian or Japanish muslim who have never seen a jew hates them so much while using many technologies created by them. Its really pathetic.
European muslims hate europe the most, similarly indian muslims hate hindus more. American muslims hate america. So what these all lead up to? chaos, poverty and misery.
The pakistani muslims even though get so much food aid from westerns but hate them and given a chance will not shy away from killing.
The non-arab muslims have become slaves of arabs by the master work of the thug muhammed.
European muslims hate europe the most, similarly indian muslims hate hindus more. American muslims hate america. So what these all lead up to? chaos, poverty and misery.
The pakistani muslims even though get so much food aid from westerns but hate them and given a chance will not shy away from killing.
The non-arab muslims have become slaves of arabs by the master work of the thug muhammed.
written by vbv , August 11, 2009
I have always been saying that islam is an arab cult to promote the supremacy of arabs over the rest of humanity.this they do effectively by converting the stupid 'kaffirs' promising them a lewd 'paradise' with a caveat that if they do not follow their diktats it will be an eternal 'hell' for them with fire and unimaginable tortures for eternity. the stupid 'kaffirs' are taken in by such bullshit tales - atleast quite a lot of them do!
The best way to put down this sinister farce is to expose it in the free world ,not succumbing to the bullying tactics of the fanatical muslim zealots.
The best way to put down this sinister farce is to expose it in the free world ,not succumbing to the bullying tactics of the fanatical muslim zealots.
written by kmgy , August 12, 2009
Just because one religion (Islam) is so evil does not necessarily mean ALL religions are evil.
written by SteelyDanorak , August 12, 2009
Lennard, you've had a bad time at the hands of religious fanatics; in a mild way so have I. But I grew up with a religion that not only wasn't fanatical but that saw fanaticism as an abberation. Far from being defined by it, we defined ourselves as "not like the head cases who give us a bad name". Fanaticism is at least as likely to be fuelled by nationalism as by religion; but true religion is trans-national and should be calling on people to recognise their essential kinship as members of one race. The kind of Christianity in which I was raised did that consistently and still does. So when you say
"If religion is to serve any purpose at all, it must emphasize and develop that common decency and morality"
not only do I agree entirely, but I'd say there is a good deal of religion around already that does this; and that a good deal of the popular atheism that we see sanctions a sod-you, every man for himself attitude to life. Given the story it has to tell - we're here because we've evolved like this, period - that shouldn't surprise us. Religious people of the kind I meet tend not to be gangsters, drug dealers, child murderers, pimps and bankers on the fiddle (couldn't resist that one), whereas such scumbags also tend not to be religious. Atheists are for the most part perfectly decent people; my point is that if they do go off the rails there is nothing in their philosopy that tells them they shouldn't. In religion, there is.
If a faith community accepts the basic standards of decency that you describe, I don't see it as abusive to raise a child within its environment. Children get a sense of identity and belonging which gives them a basic security; they can always kick over the traces later in life, as of course many do. "Indoctrination" is something else, but the word is semantically slippery. I teach the faith, you indoctrinate. Telling children they are just the random products of natural selection, that their lives mean no more than they want them to mean and when they're dead, they rot, could be seen as just as emotionally abusive.
Not everything in religion is bad, not everything in atheism is wonderful. I understand your anger but maybe you should take a few deep breaths.
"If religion is to serve any purpose at all, it must emphasize and develop that common decency and morality"
not only do I agree entirely, but I'd say there is a good deal of religion around already that does this; and that a good deal of the popular atheism that we see sanctions a sod-you, every man for himself attitude to life. Given the story it has to tell - we're here because we've evolved like this, period - that shouldn't surprise us. Religious people of the kind I meet tend not to be gangsters, drug dealers, child murderers, pimps and bankers on the fiddle (couldn't resist that one), whereas such scumbags also tend not to be religious. Atheists are for the most part perfectly decent people; my point is that if they do go off the rails there is nothing in their philosopy that tells them they shouldn't. In religion, there is.
If a faith community accepts the basic standards of decency that you describe, I don't see it as abusive to raise a child within its environment. Children get a sense of identity and belonging which gives them a basic security; they can always kick over the traces later in life, as of course many do. "Indoctrination" is something else, but the word is semantically slippery. I teach the faith, you indoctrinate. Telling children they are just the random products of natural selection, that their lives mean no more than they want them to mean and when they're dead, they rot, could be seen as just as emotionally abusive.
Not everything in religion is bad, not everything in atheism is wonderful. I understand your anger but maybe you should take a few deep breaths.
written by g , August 12, 2009
The greatest gift my parents gave to me was not growing up with any religious afflication. As we grew older, my brother and I could choose, on our own, our own path. And it's taken me a long time to find the one that is right for me and even this is still evolving. A religion that does not continue to evolve is a dead religion.
written by M Jones , August 17, 2009
What would you replace it with? Atheism has been tried and found wanting, with 170 million corpses to its name. Islam - probably around the same, maybe a few less. Japanese imperialism? Fascism added a few more to the overflowing cemetaries on planet earth. Or maybe we could try Hinduism, where milions of people die of starvation while perfectly good cows wander around the streets.
The problem is that the human heart is such that it will always tend to evil. You are probably writing from one of the nations with a Protestant history, the nations that have more freedoms, more charity and more law and order than other nations and probably more than any other in history. Perhaps you should study the influence of their religious book (the one whose founder says to love thy neighbour as thyself) and perhaps if wehad more of that in schools we'd have less of the unsavoury street violence that is a growing menace in our cities.
The problem is that the human heart is such that it will always tend to evil. You are probably writing from one of the nations with a Protestant history, the nations that have more freedoms, more charity and more law and order than other nations and probably more than any other in history. Perhaps you should study the influence of their religious book (the one whose founder says to love thy neighbour as thyself) and perhaps if wehad more of that in schools we'd have less of the unsavoury street violence that is a growing menace in our cities.
written by continuum , August 18, 2009
"Or maybe we could try Hinduism, where milions of people die of starvation while perfectly good cows wander around the streets."
Dumb xian, India was the richest country in the world and over 90% Hindu with 40 % literacy rate when British invaded India, while Britain's literacy rate was far below that of India as recorded by British census. India was a rich country for over 2000 years before your corpse god was even born.
The reason India became poor is because Britain plundered India (over 10 trillion US dollars in today's value, this is the reason India was called crown Jewel of British empire) and destroyed many local industries, agriculture etc.
So shut the fuck up and xianity has not offered anything to west. It is because of Science and undue power which west has over world resources that west is rich.
Dumb xian, India was the richest country in the world and over 90% Hindu with 40 % literacy rate when British invaded India, while Britain's literacy rate was far below that of India as recorded by British census. India was a rich country for over 2000 years before your corpse god was even born.
The reason India became poor is because Britain plundered India (over 10 trillion US dollars in today's value, this is the reason India was called crown Jewel of British empire) and destroyed many local industries, agriculture etc.
So shut the fuck up and xianity has not offered anything to west. It is because of Science and undue power which west has over world resources that west is rich.
written by kmgy , August 20, 2009
Without the British India could not have known democracy. Stop blaming others for your own miserable state. India is independent for 62 years since 1947, in comparison Germany rose from the ashes of WW II in 1945 and become an economic powerhouse in just in five years called the "economic miracle" or Wirtschaftswunder . It is the people themselves that make a nation great or miserable.
written by continuum , August 20, 2009
"Without the British India could not have known democracy. Stop blaming others for your own miserable state."
Look here idiot.... Did you see the comment made by the other fellow where he blamed Hinduism for poverty in India. My reply is to refute that claim and show that India was a rich nation for over 4000 years when Western countries did not have a clout and control mechanisms they have now which they implemented through extensive colonialism and exploitation of countries around the world.
Britain has created such conditions for India, other colonial countries and countries like USA, Britain etc. are actively involved in keeping India down by supporting terrorist countries and imposing restrictions on international markets. Besides the economic decisions are made by Western countries for the entire world. Your western nations have control mechanisms (economic, military, and other strategic control mechanisms) set up around the world to control all nations of the world using sophisticated methods.
This is the main reason western countries are rich. It is power and control mechanisms which make western countries rich and which in turn feeds economic and scientific development in cycles.
Germany was able to rise up because America helped them to rise up after the war. Real life has no miracles.
Look here idiot.... Did you see the comment made by the other fellow where he blamed Hinduism for poverty in India. My reply is to refute that claim and show that India was a rich nation for over 4000 years when Western countries did not have a clout and control mechanisms they have now which they implemented through extensive colonialism and exploitation of countries around the world.
Britain has created such conditions for India, other colonial countries and countries like USA, Britain etc. are actively involved in keeping India down by supporting terrorist countries and imposing restrictions on international markets. Besides the economic decisions are made by Western countries for the entire world. Your western nations have control mechanisms (economic, military, and other strategic control mechanisms) set up around the world to control all nations of the world using sophisticated methods.
This is the main reason western countries are rich. It is power and control mechanisms which make western countries rich and which in turn feeds economic and scientific development in cycles.
Germany was able to rise up because America helped them to rise up after the war. Real life has no miracles.
written by continuum , August 20, 2009
By the way, whether Britain was there or not, India would have had democracy or other equivalent systems by its own. British bastards plundered India and democracy is merely an accident. So stop BSing idiot.
written by continuum , August 20, 2009
"in comparison Germany rose from the ashes of WW II in 1945 and become an economic powerhouse in just in five years called the "economic miracle" or Wirtschaftswunder ."
By the way, was Germany occupied for over 200 years (prior to 1945) and systematically plundered (over 10 trillion dollars) by any country?
Was Germany plundered and attacked continuously by Muslims for over 1000 years?
Comparing India and Germany under the same scale is not right. All European countries including Germany had colonies of their own and plundered and exploited the natural resources of these countries.
Truth hurts does it not when I call British as thieves.
By the way, was Germany occupied for over 200 years (prior to 1945) and systematically plundered (over 10 trillion dollars) by any country?
Was Germany plundered and attacked continuously by Muslims for over 1000 years?
Comparing India and Germany under the same scale is not right. All European countries including Germany had colonies of their own and plundered and exploited the natural resources of these countries.
Truth hurts does it not when I call British as thieves.
written by kmgy , August 21, 2009
You are no different from a hardcore Islamists in defending Islam, resorting to the use of foul-language and even using threats. I could have also call you a Super Idiot and even curse you in the vilest language but it will not help in presenting arguments. It will only lead to a vicious cycle of name calling. By the way you must be thankful to the British for the English language otherwise you will not have the slightest idea of what is discussed here.
written by continuum , August 21, 2009
So the idiot does not have any logic nor historical facts to support his points. Calling a spade a spade is not foul language.
Why should I be thankful to British that they gave us English language which is merely an instrument to colonize India? British gave education to India to make Indians less Indians according to their own claims as recorded by officials of their own government.
However, stupid racist bigoted xians like you will do anything to make bunch of thieves and plunderers (British) to look like they were some benevolent benefactors to Indians. There are Indians who learn other European languages like French, German etc. without the help of Germans or French directly. So we need not be grateful to British for anything who gave nothing and plundered our country.
Are you a British, descendant of thieves? No wonder you are pissed off arguing like foolish muslim descendant. LOL....
Why should I be thankful to British that they gave us English language which is merely an instrument to colonize India? British gave education to India to make Indians less Indians according to their own claims as recorded by officials of their own government.
However, stupid racist bigoted xians like you will do anything to make bunch of thieves and plunderers (British) to look like they were some benevolent benefactors to Indians. There are Indians who learn other European languages like French, German etc. without the help of Germans or French directly. So we need not be grateful to British for anything who gave nothing and plundered our country.
Are you a British, descendant of thieves? No wonder you are pissed off arguing like foolish muslim descendant. LOL....
written by continuum , August 21, 2009
"This child abuse includes telling innocent and beautiful little children that they are ‘born in sin’ and are just pieces of garbage, which is utterly unworthy in the eyes of the great and glorious God/Allah, who is wholly separate and apart from this ‘lower’ creations. This emotional and psychological child abuse is a LIE. Period."
Xianity is a manipulative evil religion, which is only next to Islam in fomenting hatred for unbelievers, but does this job in an efficient and more sophisticated way.
No wonder with such teachings you will find that brainwashing little children with hatred for unbelievers are found only in Semitic religions. It is a wonder that the followers of this religions teach and are convinced that their religions teach peace and love.
Xianity is a manipulative evil religion, which is only next to Islam in fomenting hatred for unbelievers, but does this job in an efficient and more sophisticated way.
No wonder with such teachings you will find that brainwashing little children with hatred for unbelievers are found only in Semitic religions. It is a wonder that the followers of this religions teach and are convinced that their religions teach peace and love.
written by continuum , August 21, 2009
Do these verses in bible suggest pedophilia was allowed, besides the fact that murdering men and taking women and girls by force. Also take a look at European history on what was the age limit for marriage.
Numbers 31
17. So now kill every male child, and every woman who can lie intimately with a man you shall kill.
18. But all the women children, that have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Although the topic deals with religions in general (I do not think eastern religions are evil), I would like to compare biblical god to allah, which shows that they are essentially same entity. A society that worships an entity that acts/teaches like a demonic entity will behave like that. No wonder Muhammad and his companions who worship such dark entities (despite being imaginary) acted in this manner. These verses show why christians and muslims hold such disdain for other religions and other religious followers.
Both gods are equally vicious. Both gods have utter disdain for all other religions and condemn the followers of those faiths to eternal damnation.
But if you do it not, and you can never do it, then fear the Fire (hell) whose fuel is men and stones, prepared for the disbelievers. (Al-Baqarah 2:24)
Yes! Whosoever earns evil and his sin has surrounded him, they are dwellers of the Fire (i.e. hell); they will dwell therein forever. (Al-Baqarah 2:81)
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9 (New International Version)
and give relief to you who are troubled, and to us as well. This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power
“[H]e that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him”(John 3:36).
John 3:36 (New International Version)
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him."
This was a tough nut to break. Sometimes it seems allah and jehovah has very close competition between them for this. But I think Christian god wins in selective cases like 1 Samuel 15:3, but in general allah seems to be more cruel for non-believers. In the end, both gods have unlimited hatred for the unbelievers whom allegedly these gods have created.
“that dreamer of a dream shall be put to death; because he spoke falsehood about the Lord,.......If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods . . . thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people . . . If thou shalt hear . . . Certain men . . . have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods . . . Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword” (Deuteronomy13:6-15).
Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allâh, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allâh and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islâm) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah[] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. (At-Tawbah 9:29)
I think the Judeo-Christian God wins this race on cruelty. Allah although cruel, seems to stop the warfare after there is no resistance.
So, when you meet (in fight Jihâd in Allâh's Cause), those who disbelieve smite at their necks till when you have killed and wounded many of them, then bind a bond firmly (on them, i.e. take them as captives). Thereafter (is the time) either for generosity (i.e. free them without ransom), or ransom (according to what benefits Islâm), until the war lays down its burden. Thus [you are ordered by Allâh to continue in carrying out Jihâd against the disbelievers till they embrace Islâm (i.e. are saved from the punishment in the Hell-fire) or at least come under your protection], but if it had been Allâh's Will, He Himself could certainly have punished them (without you). But (He lets you fight), in order to test you, some with others. But those who are killed in the Way of Allâh, He will never let their deeds be lost, (Muhammad 47:4)(Koran 47:4).
“And when the Lord thy God hath delivered [a city] into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: But the women, and the little ones . . . shalt thou take unto thyself . . . But of the cities of these people, which the Lord thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth”(Deuteronomy 20:13-16).
Again Judeo-Christian god wins this race as well.
And to these, He said in my ears, "Pass through the city after him and smite; let your eye spare not and have no pity. Old man, young man, and maiden, young children and women, you shall slay utterly, but to any man upon whom there is the mark you shall not draw near, and you shall commence from My sanctuary." So they commenced from the old men who were before the House. And He said to them, "Defile the House and fill the courts with the slain [and] go out," and they went out and smote in the city. (Ezekiel 9:5-7).
Allâh does not forbid you to deal justly and kindly with those who fought not against you on account of religion and did not drive you out of your homes. Verily, Allâh loves those who deal with equity. (Al-Mumtahinah 60:
But if they incline to peace, you also incline to it, and (put your) trust in Allâh. Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Knower. (Al-Anfal 8:61)
Hmmm.... I do not know what to say here. Christian god has utter contempt for themm, while allah seems to have contempt for homos but his brothels have lots of boys.... weird...
And a man who lies with a male as one would with a woman both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon themselves.(Leviticus 20:13).
Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.(1 Corinthians 6:9-10).
"Verily, you practise your lusts on men instead of women. Nay, but you are a people transgressing beyond bounds (by committing great sins)." (Al-A'raf 7:81)
And there will go round boy-servants of theirs, to serve them as if they were preserved pearls. (At-Tur 52:24)
And round about them will (serve) boys of everlasting youth. If you see them, you would think them scattered pearls. (Al-Insan 76:19)
Well, NOT considering death sentences by stoning (both gods prescribe these punishments of stoning), both gods also prescribe whipping the sinners. You decide which one is more vicious ? or does it even matter ?
The woman and the man guilty of illegal sexual intercourse, flog each of them with a hundred stripes. Let not pity withhold you in their case, in a punishment prescribed by Allâh, if you believe in Allâh and the Last Day. And let a party of the believers witness their punishment. (This punishment is for unmarried persons guilty of the above crime but if married persons commit it, the punishment is to stone them to death, according to Allâh's Law). (An-Nur 24:2)
and it shall be, if the guilty one has incurred [the penalty of] lashes, that the judge shall make him lean over and flog him in front of him, commensurate with his crime, in number. He shall flog him with forty [lashes]; he shall not exceed, lest he give him a much more severe flogging than these [forty lashes], and your brother will be degraded before your eyes.(Deuteronomy 25:2-3).
Both equally....as they both have utter hatred and contempt for unbelievers and both want you to burn in hell forever.
But if you do it not, and you can never do it, then fear the Fire (Hell) whose fuel is men and stones, prepared for the disbelievers. (Al-Baqarah 2:24)
“But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him” (Luke 12:5).
“And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell” (Matthew 10:2.
Both place least value on women.
Allâh commands you as regards your children's (inheritance); to the male, a portion equal to that of two females; (An-Nisa 4:11)
1. And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying,
2. Speak to the children of Israel and say to them: When a man expresses a vow, [pledging the] value of lives to the Lord,
3. the [fixed] value of a male shall be as follows: From twenty years old until sixty years old, the value is fifty silver shekels, according to the holy shekel;
4. And if she is a female, the value is thirty shekels;
5. And if [the person is] from five years old until twenty years old, the value of a male shall be twenty shekels, while that of a female shall be ten shekels;
6. And if [the person is] from one month old until five years old, the value of a male shall be five silver shekels, while the value of a female shall be three silver shekels;
7. And if [the person is] sixty years old or over, if it is a male, the value shall be fifteen shekels, while for a female, it shall be ten shekels. (Leviticus27:1-7).
Well, sometimes it seems to be allah and sometimes it seems to be Christian god. Over all allah wins this race in my experience.
“Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence" ; (1 Timothy 2:11-12).
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church" (1Corinthians 14:34-35).
Indeed Allâh has heard the statement of her (Khaulah bint Tha'labah) that disputes with you (O Muhammad SAW) concerning her husband (Aus bin AsSâmit), and complains to Allâh. And Allâh hears the argument between you both. Verily, Allâh is All-Hearer, All-Seer. (Al-Mujadilah 58:1)
There is a tie between the two gods on this.
Verily, Allâh is not ashamed to set forth a parable even of a mosquito or so much more when it is bigger (or less when it is smaller) than it. And as for those who believe, they know that it is the Truth from their Lord, but as for those who disbelieve, they say: "What did Allâh intend by this parable?" By it He misleads many, and many He guides thereby. And He misleads thereby only those who are Al-Fâsiqûn (the rebellious, disobedient to Allâh). (Al-Baqarah 2:26)
“And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness” (2 Thessalonians 2:11-12).
Numbers 31
17. So now kill every male child, and every woman who can lie intimately with a man you shall kill.
18. But all the women children, that have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Although the topic deals with religions in general (I do not think eastern religions are evil), I would like to compare biblical god to allah, which shows that they are essentially same entity. A society that worships an entity that acts/teaches like a demonic entity will behave like that. No wonder Muhammad and his companions who worship such dark entities (despite being imaginary) acted in this manner. These verses show why christians and muslims hold such disdain for other religions and other religious followers.
Which god (allah and jehova or jesus) has promised the cruelest fate for people of different religions?
Both gods are equally vicious. Both gods have utter disdain for all other religions and condemn the followers of those faiths to eternal damnation.
But if you do it not, and you can never do it, then fear the Fire (hell) whose fuel is men and stones, prepared for the disbelievers. (Al-Baqarah 2:24)
Yes! Whosoever earns evil and his sin has surrounded him, they are dwellers of the Fire (i.e. hell); they will dwell therein forever. (Al-Baqarah 2:81)
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9 (New International Version)
and give relief to you who are troubled, and to us as well. This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels. He will punish those who do not know God and do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. They will be punished with everlasting destruction and shut out from the presence of the Lord and from the majesty of his power
“[H]e that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him”(John 3:36).
John 3:36 (New International Version)
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God's wrath remains on him."
Which god orders the most violent plight for nonbelievers while on Earth?
This was a tough nut to break. Sometimes it seems allah and jehovah has very close competition between them for this. But I think Christian god wins in selective cases like 1 Samuel 15:3, but in general allah seems to be more cruel for non-believers. In the end, both gods have unlimited hatred for the unbelievers whom allegedly these gods have created.
“that dreamer of a dream shall be put to death; because he spoke falsehood about the Lord,.......If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods . . . thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people . . . If thou shalt hear . . . Certain men . . . have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods . . . Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword” (Deuteronomy13:6-15).
Fight against those who (1) believe not in Allâh, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allâh and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islâm) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah[] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. (At-Tawbah 9:29)
Which god orders the cruelest warfare?
I think the Judeo-Christian God wins this race on cruelty. Allah although cruel, seems to stop the warfare after there is no resistance.
So, when you meet (in fight Jihâd in Allâh's Cause), those who disbelieve smite at their necks till when you have killed and wounded many of them, then bind a bond firmly (on them, i.e. take them as captives). Thereafter (is the time) either for generosity (i.e. free them without ransom), or ransom (according to what benefits Islâm), until the war lays down its burden. Thus [you are ordered by Allâh to continue in carrying out Jihâd against the disbelievers till they embrace Islâm (i.e. are saved from the punishment in the Hell-fire) or at least come under your protection], but if it had been Allâh's Will, He Himself could certainly have punished them (without you). But (He lets you fight), in order to test you, some with others. But those who are killed in the Way of Allâh, He will never let their deeds be lost, (Muhammad 47:4)(Koran 47:4).
“And when the Lord thy God hath delivered [a city] into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: But the women, and the little ones . . . shalt thou take unto thyself . . . But of the cities of these people, which the Lord thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth”(Deuteronomy 20:13-16).
Which god has the least pity and most contempt for the enemies of his followers?
Again Judeo-Christian god wins this race as well.
And to these, He said in my ears, "Pass through the city after him and smite; let your eye spare not and have no pity. Old man, young man, and maiden, young children and women, you shall slay utterly, but to any man upon whom there is the mark you shall not draw near, and you shall commence from My sanctuary." So they commenced from the old men who were before the House. And He said to them, "Defile the House and fill the courts with the slain [and] go out," and they went out and smote in the city. (Ezekiel 9:5-7).
Allâh does not forbid you to deal justly and kindly with those who fought not against you on account of religion and did not drive you out of your homes. Verily, Allâh loves those who deal with equity. (Al-Mumtahinah 60:
But if they incline to peace, you also incline to it, and (put your) trust in Allâh. Verily, He is the All-Hearer, the All-Knower. (Al-Anfal 8:61)
Whose god has more contempt for homosexuals?
Hmmm.... I do not know what to say here. Christian god has utter contempt for themm, while allah seems to have contempt for homos but his brothels have lots of boys.... weird...
And a man who lies with a male as one would with a woman both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon themselves.(Leviticus 20:13).
Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.(1 Corinthians 6:9-10).
"Verily, you practise your lusts on men instead of women. Nay, but you are a people transgressing beyond bounds (by committing great sins)." (Al-A'raf 7:81)
And there will go round boy-servants of theirs, to serve them as if they were preserved pearls. (At-Tur 52:24)
And round about them will (serve) boys of everlasting youth. If you see them, you would think them scattered pearls. (Al-Insan 76:19)
Which god has prescribed the more vicious physical punishment of sinners?
Well, NOT considering death sentences by stoning (both gods prescribe these punishments of stoning), both gods also prescribe whipping the sinners. You decide which one is more vicious ? or does it even matter ?
The woman and the man guilty of illegal sexual intercourse, flog each of them with a hundred stripes. Let not pity withhold you in their case, in a punishment prescribed by Allâh, if you believe in Allâh and the Last Day. And let a party of the believers witness their punishment. (This punishment is for unmarried persons guilty of the above crime but if married persons commit it, the punishment is to stone them to death, according to Allâh's Law). (An-Nur 24:2)
and it shall be, if the guilty one has incurred [the penalty of] lashes, that the judge shall make him lean over and flog him in front of him, commensurate with his crime, in number. He shall flog him with forty [lashes]; he shall not exceed, lest he give him a much more severe flogging than these [forty lashes], and your brother will be degraded before your eyes.(Deuteronomy 25:2-3).
Which god should you fear most?
Both equally....as they both have utter hatred and contempt for unbelievers and both want you to burn in hell forever.
But if you do it not, and you can never do it, then fear the Fire (Hell) whose fuel is men and stones, prepared for the disbelievers. (Al-Baqarah 2:24)
“But I will forewarn you whom ye shall fear: Fear him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into hell; yea, I say unto you, Fear him” (Luke 12:5).
“And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell” (Matthew 10:2
. Whose god places the least value on the lives of women?
Both place least value on women.
Allâh commands you as regards your children's (inheritance); to the male, a portion equal to that of two females; (An-Nisa 4:11)
1. And the Lord spoke to Moses, saying,
2. Speak to the children of Israel and say to them: When a man expresses a vow, [pledging the] value of lives to the Lord,
3. the [fixed] value of a male shall be as follows: From twenty years old until sixty years old, the value is fifty silver shekels, according to the holy shekel;
4. And if she is a female, the value is thirty shekels;
5. And if [the person is] from five years old until twenty years old, the value of a male shall be twenty shekels, while that of a female shall be ten shekels;
6. And if [the person is] from one month old until five years old, the value of a male shall be five silver shekels, while the value of a female shall be three silver shekels;
7. And if [the person is] sixty years old or over, if it is a male, the value shall be fifteen shekels, while for a female, it shall be ten shekels. (Leviticus27:1-7).
Whose god puts women in their place with the harshest of restrictions on their speech?
Well, sometimes it seems to be allah and sometimes it seems to be Christian god. Over all allah wins this race in my experience.
“Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence" ; (1 Timothy 2:11-12).
"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church" (1Corinthians 14:34-35).
Indeed Allâh has heard the statement of her (Khaulah bint Tha'labah) that disputes with you (O Muhammad SAW) concerning her husband (Aus bin AsSâmit), and complains to Allâh. And Allâh hears the argument between you both. Verily, Allâh is All-Hearer, All-Seer. (Al-Mujadilah 58:1)
Whose god is the champion of deceit?
There is a tie between the two gods on this.
Verily, Allâh is not ashamed to set forth a parable even of a mosquito or so much more when it is bigger (or less when it is smaller) than it. And as for those who believe, they know that it is the Truth from their Lord, but as for those who disbelieve, they say: "What did Allâh intend by this parable?" By it He misleads many, and many He guides thereby. And He misleads thereby only those who are Al-Fâsiqûn (the rebellious, disobedient to Allâh). (Al-Baqarah 2:26)
“And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness” (2 Thessalonians 2:11-12).
written by kmgy , August 22, 2009
"Dumb xian fuck up idiot." Is this the words of a decent person? Mr. continuum try to save some money and visit USA, Europe, Australia, Canada, and New Zealand, (countries where Christians are the majority) and see for yourself. If you are stuck in your native land that is a pity for you have no basis for comparison firsthand.
written by kmgy , August 22, 2009
Here is a simple experiment for you to help you differentiate Christianity from Islam without leaving your native land:
1). Go to a Christian neighborhood and condemn Christianity to your heart's desire.
2). Go to a Muslim neighborhood and condemn Islam. (Be sure to secure a life insurance for your heirs).
Or if you're scared and do not have the guts then try to have an open mind and visit www.beyondtoday.tv.
1). Go to a Christian neighborhood and condemn Christianity to your heart's desire.
2). Go to a Muslim neighborhood and condemn Islam. (Be sure to secure a life insurance for your heirs).
Or if you're scared and do not have the guts then try to have an open mind and visit www.beyondtoday.tv.
written by continuum , August 22, 2009
Editor: Continuum, Please stop copy and pasting your Mahabhrat here, not to overload the site. Make concise, brief comment on the topic. If you post the same again, we may be forced to blacklist your IP.
I ask the moderator to read before he foolishly deletes again. One may argue all the above incidents are isolated, only that persecuton of non-believers in xianity runs for 1600 years....
I ask the moderator to read before he foolishly deletes again. One may argue all the above incidents are isolated, only that persecuton of non-believers in xianity runs for 1600 years....
written by continuum , August 22, 2009
Editor: Continuum, Please stop copy and pasting your Mahabhrat here, not to overload the site. Make concise, brief comment on the topic. If you post the same again, we may be forced to blacklist your IP.
I guess we have Maha-mudhas here as moderators and/or editor(s).
Is the topic not about religion? I wonder why is it getting deleted when one exposes xianity?
For your information, those posts are not copy paste from anywhere. They are posts I have made before and saved a copy.
Apparently for you people, exposing christian terrorism that happens today (despite the fact that I provided bbc links and other authentic links to prove my case) is forbidden in this website.
The editor M.A. Khan did not have problem when comments were posted against Hinduism and even had an intent to start a website against Hinduism. However this mudha janma cannot tolerate xianity being exposed in this site.
written by continuum , August 22, 2009
Here is a simple experiment for you to help you differentiate Christianity from Islam without leaving your native land:
Since the editor has been repeatedly deleting my posts refuting your statements, let me reveal something to you.
1. For your information, I have travelled to most western countries and know what the religious xian schools teach their children about unbelievers. The hatred they preach is not much different from Islamic hatred. Both teach hatred.
2. Second, your suggestion that if I criticize xianity in xian neighborhood of my country I will not be physically harmed is based on what. You ask me if I had travelled to western countries. Let me ask you the same, if you had traveled to my country to know anything.
Have you heard of NLFT? It is a xian terrorist organozation that kills 12 year old Hindu kids for practising Hinduism in places like Tripura. Look at the following link.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/717775.stm
Most probably the foolish editor MA Khan (xian in all probability) is going to delete my post again.
2. LTTE, a xian terrorist org of Tamil speaking people.
http://www.christianaggression.org/item_display.php?type=ARTICLES&id=1112887194
3. Catholic church involved with terrrorists in Si Lanka.
http://www.army.lk/morenews.php?id=15498
4. Xian evangelists destroying Buddhist worship places in South Korea.
http://www.buddhapia.com/eng/tedesco/2.html
http://www.buddhapia.com/eng/tedesco/pic1/list.html
written by kmgy , August 23, 2009
All of the above could be the work of Buddhist or Hindus themselves and put the blame on Christians. The fact stands out that in Christian-dominated countries, religious freedom of ALL faiths (Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc.) is observed. ALL faiths are welcomed even evil Islam.
written by continuum1 , August 23, 2009
All of the above could be the work of Buddhist or Hindus themselves and put the blame on Christians.
Really!! Is this some xian logic?
Lets see what the following links say..
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/717775.stm
The government in India's north-eastern state of Tripura says it has evidence that the state's Baptist Church is involved in backing separatist rebels.
Mr Sarkar said that allegations about the close links between the state's Baptist Church and the rebel National Liberation Front of Tripura (NLFT) have long been made by political parties and police.
Mr Sarkar told the BBC that Mr Halam was found in possession of more than 50 gelatine sticks, 5kg of potassium and 2kg of sulphur and other ingredients for making explosives.
Chief Minister Sarkar says he has proof
He said that two other junior members of the same church, arrested last week, had tipped the police off about the explosives which were meant for the NLFT rebels.
It is clearly and completely christian terrorism to any sane person willing to read.
The fact stands out that in Christian-dominated countries, religious freedom of ALL faiths (Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc.) is observed. ALL faiths are welcomed even evil Islam.
Yes... religious freedom in so called christian dominated countries came after 1600 years of persecution of non-believers, after separation of state and church was implemented by secular governments against the will of churches in your countries. Even today you have evangelists in USA claiming USA is a xian country and that Hindus/Buddhists shoud not be allowed in USA despite the fact that USA is a secular country. Until 1965 Hindus were not allowed to immigrate in USA for example while xians lived in India for 1600 years without persecution of any kind.
http://www.sullivan-county.com/news/pat_quotes/hindus.htm
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Pat_Robertson
"If anybody understood what Hindus really believe, there would be no doubt that they have no business administering government policies in a country that favors freedom and equality."
"We're importing Hinduism into America. The whole thought of your karma, of meditation, of the fact that there's no end of life and there's this endless wheel of life, this is all Hinduism. Chanting too. Many of those chants are to Hindu Gods -- Vishnu, Hare Krishna. The origin of it is all demonic. We can't let that stuff come into America. We've got the best defense, if you will -- a good offense."
You call the above freedom of religion. A xian pastor above calls for imposing bans on Hinduism and Hindusin USA. There are umpteen evangelists and xians like you as above who feel the same way about Hinduism or Buddhism. Given a chance in government these fundamentalists and their followers which amount to 40-50% of population will enforce this ban. So much for religious freedom in christian countries.
Can you point one christian majority nation in history, before secularism was adopted by western governments, which allowed freedom of religion (European pagans included)?
Secularism came as a reaction to christian churches' intolerance. Your chuches could not even tolerate rival xian sects. That is why catholics killed protestants and vice versa. In Ireland this happens/happened even in this 21st century.
All of this freedom of religion is a result of your churches losing power and not because of your nations being a majority xian country.
On the other side compare Buddhist and Hindu countries around the world historically and even today. Never was there a time when these countries were ruled even by Hindu/Buddhist kings and governments, did they ever persecute other religious believers.
India was the only nation that gave Jews a plce to live for over 2000 years without persecution of any kind. Even your Syrian xians (4th century AD) came running to India to escape persecution of other xian sects in middle east.
written by continuum1 , August 23, 2009
There are numerous xian churches in USA and other western countries with majority xian population that call for ban on Hinduism or Buddhism or any other Eastern religion.
The following report shows clearly what xians actually want is no different than Muslims. The only difference in this case is that xians have changed their strategies and have the capability today to do so. In medieval times it was brute force to convert non-xians and today it is mass psychological manipulation, brainwashing little children into hatred of unbelievers and raw financial and political power to convert the weak and poor people. I hope the editor of this site sees the dangers of this religion.
http://www.hinduamericanfoundation.org/issues/interfaith?q=media/pr/hindu-americans-expose-online-hate-latest-report
Hindu Americans Expose Online Hate in Latest Report
WASHINGTON, D.C. (March 6, 2007) – Internet websites promoting religious hatred and intolerance towards Hindus and Hinduism are proliferating, and this trend has adverse long-term consequences for the Hindu American community, according to the latest report released by the Hindu American Foundation (HAF) today. Entitled Hyperlink to Hinduphobia: Online Hatred, Extremism and Bigotry Against Hindus, the publication argues that exposing online hate-speech is a crucial first step in combating a major factor behind prevalent negative stereotypes of Hinduism.
In its fifty-two page report, the Foundation traces the origins of online religious hate and bigotry, and presents evidence of the text and pictures from actual websites that illustrate their concerns. According to statistics provided in the report, “demonic” and “satanic” are the terms most commonly used today to describe Hinduism by numerous anti-Hindu websites easily accessible on the Internet.
The following report shows clearly what xians actually want is no different than Muslims. The only difference in this case is that xians have changed their strategies and have the capability today to do so. In medieval times it was brute force to convert non-xians and today it is mass psychological manipulation, brainwashing little children into hatred of unbelievers and raw financial and political power to convert the weak and poor people. I hope the editor of this site sees the dangers of this religion.
http://www.hinduamericanfoundation.org/issues/interfaith?q=media/pr/hindu-americans-expose-online-hate-latest-report
Hindu Americans Expose Online Hate in Latest Report
WASHINGTON, D.C. (March 6, 2007) – Internet websites promoting religious hatred and intolerance towards Hindus and Hinduism are proliferating, and this trend has adverse long-term consequences for the Hindu American community, according to the latest report released by the Hindu American Foundation (HAF) today. Entitled Hyperlink to Hinduphobia: Online Hatred, Extremism and Bigotry Against Hindus, the publication argues that exposing online hate-speech is a crucial first step in combating a major factor behind prevalent negative stereotypes of Hinduism.
In its fifty-two page report, the Foundation traces the origins of online religious hate and bigotry, and presents evidence of the text and pictures from actual websites that illustrate their concerns. According to statistics provided in the report, “demonic” and “satanic” are the terms most commonly used today to describe Hinduism by numerous anti-Hindu websites easily accessible on the Internet.
written by a guest , August 24, 2009
Top Twenty Religions in the United States, 2001
(self-identification, ARIS)
Religion 1990 Est.
Adult Pop. 2001 Est.
ADULT Pop. 2004 Est.
Total Pop. % of U.S. Pop.,
2000 % Change
1990 - 2000
Christianity 151,225,000 159,030,000 224,437,959 76.5% +5%
Nonreligious/Secular 13,116,000 27,539,000 38,865,604 13.2% +110%
Judaism 3,137,000 2,831,000 3,995,371 1.3% -10%
Islam 527,000 1,104,000 1,558,068 0.5% +109%
Buddhism 401,000 1,082,000 1,527,019 0.5% +170%
Agnostic 1,186,000 991,000 1,398,592 0.5% -16%
Atheist 902,000 1,272,986 0.4%
Hinduism 227,000 766,000 1,081,051 0.4% +237%
Unitarian Universalist 502,000 629,000 887,703 0.3% +25%
Wiccan/Pagan/Druid 307,000 433,267 0.1%
Spiritualist 116,000 163,710 0.05%
Native American Religion 47,000 103,000 145,363 0.05% +119%
Baha'i 28,000 84,000 118,549 0.04% +200%
New Age 20,000 68,000 95,968 0.03% +240%
Sikhism 13,000 57,000 80,444 0.03% +338%
Scientology 45,000 55,000 77,621 0.02% +22%
Humanist 29,000 49,000 69,153 0.02% +69%
Deity (Deist) 6,000 49,000 69,153 0.02% +717%
Taoist 23,000 40,000 56,452 0.02% +74%
Eckankar 18,000 26,000 36,694 0.01% +44%
Mr. continuum this will refute your allegation. Hinduism has grown by 237% in USA in 10 years time from 1990-2000. You can come to America the beautiful land and worship your Hindu gods freely.
written by continuum , August 24, 2009
Mr. continuum this will refute your allegation. Hinduism has grown by 237% in USA in 10 years time from 1990-2000.
How does this refute my allegations?
My allegations were against christianity and fundamentalist christians and NOT against secular US government and its constitution which enables this growth against the wishes of these fundamentalist xians.
I have already shown with evidence that many powerful christian organizations in USA want to ban Hinduism, Buddhism or any other non-christian religon and even rival christian sects.
In terms of hatred for non-believers, Christianity is no different than Islam historically and at present. These christians only differ in their strategies and methods use to convert and are more sophisticated than their Islamic counterparts. Hatred of non-believers and making non-believers evil, less than human are central teachings in both religions.
written by kmgy , August 24, 2009
--"Hatred of non-believers and making non-believers evil, less than human are central teachings in both religions."--Mr. continuum, you have been mislead or feed with false presumption. For your information, The Ten Commandments and Jesus' Sermon on the Mount are the core doctrine of Christianity. You commented that US government is secular, the truth is 76% of US population is Christian. Almost ALL of the US politicians and lawmakers are Christians, being enlightened people passed laws allowing religious freedom for ALL faiths (Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.) and to prevent one religious domination in getting the upper hand in politics separated Church and State. But the belief in Almighty is enshrined in the US Constitution. The highest political authority, the US President takes his oath of office with his left hand on a Bible. The US dollar is printed with the words, In God We Trust. Americans love to sing God bless America. You can come to America and worship your Hindu gods in peace without being molested.
written by continuum , August 24, 2009
Mr. continuum, you have been mislead or feed with false presumption.
There is no presumption I made anywhere. I have quoted many xian leaders in America calling Eastern religions as evil and calling for ban on Eastern religions with evidences from their own websites and quotres form xian religious leaders.
For your information, The Ten Commandments and Jesus' Sermon on the Mount are the core doctrine of Christianity.
Here is your first commandment...
Exodus 20:3-17
1. You shall have no other gods before Me.
That rules out christianity ever accepting secularism altogether. Secularism does NOT recognize any God or religion and recognizes only freedom of religion as long as the religion does not call for destruction of secularism and its principles. However christianity encourages destruction of other religions by this single command through any means.
You commented that US government is secular, the truth is 76% of US population is Christian. Almost ALL of the US politicians and lawmakers are Christians, being enlightened people passed laws allowing religious freedom for ALL faiths (Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.) and to prevent one religious domination in getting the upper hand in politics separated Church and State.
You christians have always been liars and against freedom of religion.
How do you know those lawmakers were/are indeed christians? Even if they were, can you show me any evidence from bible that says "freedom of religion" as a tenet of this religion?
On the other hand, the very first commandment in 10 commandments demands believers to enforce the public NOT to have any other Gods. By this single statement it demotes other religions as less than equal than their religion and as a consequence it leads to special treatment for believers while treating non-believers as second class citizens.
The truth is that American lawmakers passed the bill despite what xianity teaches and history shows christians in USA opposed this law.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/virg_rel.htm
In Virginia, as the War of Independence approached, the Church of England had become entrenched in a position of power and was having an increasing influence over political affairs in Virginia. Nine of the 13 colonies had an established "official" state religion. Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826) was profoundly convinced in the importance of individual freedom of religion and freedom from religion. He felt that this was the best guarantee that the religious intolerance and bloodshed seen in of many European countries would not be exported to America.
In 1777, he drafted An Act for Establishing Religious Freedom. 1 In 1779, he became Governor and introduced the act into the legislature. However, strong opposition from the primarily Anglican "old guard" stalled the bill. An alternative bill was advanced by Patrick Henry. It proposed that Christianity become the established religion of the State and that all denominations be given equal privileges.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/amend_1.htm
The text of the First Amendment:
Some early draft amendments to the religion section were:
* James Madison, 1789-JUN-7 "The Civil Rights of none shall be abridged on account of religious belief or worship, nor shall any national religion be established, nor shall the full and equal rights of conscience be in any manner, nor on any pretext infringed. No state shall violate the equal rights of conscience or the freedom of the press, or the trial by jury in criminal cases."
* House Select Committee, JUL-28 "No religion shall be established by law, nor shall the equal rights of conscience be infringed,"
* Samuel Livermore, AUG-15 "Congress shall make no laws touching religion, or infringing the rights of conscience."
* House version, AUG-20 "Congress shall make no law establishing religion, or to prevent the free exercise thereof, or to infringe the rights of conscience." (Moved by Fisher Ames)
* Initial Senate version, SEP-3 "Congress shall make no law establishing religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."
* Final Senate version, SEP-9 "Congress shall make no law establishing articles of faith or a mode of worship, or prohibiting the free exercise of religion."
* Conference Committee "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof."
The final wording was accepted by the House of Representatives on 1789-SEP-24; and by the Senate on 1789-SEP-25. It was ratified by the States in 1791.
But the belief in Almighty is enshrined in the US Constitution.
You are a liar. You constitution does NOT give preference to any religion whatsoever.
The highest political authority, the US President takes his oath of office with his left hand on a Bible. The US dollar is printed with the words, In God We Trust. Americans love to sing God bless America.
1. How does it change the first amendment?
2. The Presidential oath of office is described in Article II, section 1 of the Constitution:
Before he enter on the Execution of his Office, he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation:--"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."
Nothing in this section requires that the oath of office be taken on the Bible. Neither do the words "so help me God" appear in the oath. While Presidents often include this phrase in their inauguration ceremonies, the words are customary; they are not required by the Constitution and have no legal significance.
You can come to America and worship your Hindu gods in peace without being molested.
That is because it is no longer a xian country, although it is xian majority. Otherwise your pastors would have had us Hindus burned at stake for witchcraft which they do happily in India by sponsoring terrorism in Tripura, India. Should I quote the bbc news again. It is there above for you to see.
written by kmgy , August 25, 2009
Anti-Christian Violence in India, 1997-2000
Though incidents of violence against Christians have occurred in nearly all parts of India, the violence has been largely confined to north, central, and western India, to the states of Gujarat, Maharashtra, Uttar Pradesh, Madhya Pradesh, and the capital area of New Delhi -- not coincidentally, most of these areas have been under BJP rule in recent years. Some of the more gruesome incidents took place in eastern India, in the state of Orissa. Intimidation of Christians has extended to such acts as arson (the fire-bombing of Churches), the distribution of threatening literature, the forcible reconversion of recent converts back to Hinduism, the burning of Bibles; there have also been incidents, though much fewer in number, involving the rape of nuns and the murder of both Christian priests and missionaries. Cases of physical assault have also been recorded from various parts of the country: on 5 November 1999, 26 students -- not all Christians -- of St. Joseph’s Evening College, Bangalore, were attacked by 40 VHP activists for allegedly converting lower-caste Hindus (the Dalits) to Christianity (Walter Fernandes, "Caste as vested interest", The Hindu [4 January 2000]). In Gujarat alone, where the BJP grip over power is very strong, 22 churches were burnt or destroyed, and another 16 damaged, in 1997. In the following year, 1998, according to the United Christian Forum for Human Rights, 5 nuns were raped, 9 killed, and 25 subjected to physical abuse (see Ravi Arvind Palat, "Violence against Christians in India", New Zealand Herald [26 January 1999]; also V. Venkatesan, "A pattern of persecution", Frontline 15, no. 26 [19 December 1998]). In mid-June 2000, four churches in different parts of India were bombed, while in the southern state of Andhra Pradesh, church graves were desecrated. In the same month, a church in Maharashtra was ransacked, and an evangelist working for the India Campus Crusade for Christ was found stabbed to death at his home (see Robert Marquand, "In India, a Pattern of Attacks on Christians", Christian Science Monitor ([29 June 2000]).
The entire country was shocked in January 1999 when an Australian Baptist missionary, Graham Staines, was murdered along with his two sons by being burnt alive inside a locked car. Staines had lived in India for the greater part of his life, and was working among lepers in Orissa, one of India’s most deprived regions (see the Human Rights Report and State Department Report, as cited below). His assailant, a Hindu militant by the name of Dara Singh, went around boasting about his deed, and even gave television interviews, while the police claimed that he could not be found. On 7 June 2000, the Catholic priest, George Kuzhikandam, was murdered in his sleep in a church in Mathura in Uttar Pradesh. The church cook, Vijay Ekka, who slept near the murdered clergyman and first reported the murder, was taken away by the police for interrogation, and himself died in police custody. Though the police claimed he had committed suicide, the autopsy indicated that he had been strangled. It is widely believed that the cook was silenced.
The evidence for violence against Christians in India is consequently incontrovertible. There are numerous compilations of atrocities perpetrated upon Christians, and they suggest an alarming pattern of violence: the intimidation of priests; threats placed against Christian schools; false allegations against Christian priests; the destruction of Christian institutions, such as the Damian Leprosy Hospital complex run by Catholic nuns for 31 years; attacks upon churches; assault upon Christian nuns and pastors, such as in the city of Jhansi on 2 May 2000; the distribution of scurrilous literature; and murder of Christians.
Though incidents of violence against Christians have occurred in nearly all parts of India, the violence has been largely confined to north, central, and western India, to the states of Gujarat, Maharashtra, Uttar Pradesh, Madhya Pradesh, and the capital area of New Delhi -- not coincidentally, most of these areas have been under BJP rule in recent years. Some of the more gruesome incidents took place in eastern India, in the state of Orissa. Intimidation of Christians has extended to such acts as arson (the fire-bombing of Churches), the distribution of threatening literature, the forcible reconversion of recent converts back to Hinduism, the burning of Bibles; there have also been incidents, though much fewer in number, involving the rape of nuns and the murder of both Christian priests and missionaries. Cases of physical assault have also been recorded from various parts of the country: on 5 November 1999, 26 students -- not all Christians -- of St. Joseph’s Evening College, Bangalore, were attacked by 40 VHP activists for allegedly converting lower-caste Hindus (the Dalits) to Christianity (Walter Fernandes, "Caste as vested interest", The Hindu [4 January 2000]). In Gujarat alone, where the BJP grip over power is very strong, 22 churches were burnt or destroyed, and another 16 damaged, in 1997. In the following year, 1998, according to the United Christian Forum for Human Rights, 5 nuns were raped, 9 killed, and 25 subjected to physical abuse (see Ravi Arvind Palat, "Violence against Christians in India", New Zealand Herald [26 January 1999]; also V. Venkatesan, "A pattern of persecution", Frontline 15, no. 26 [19 December 1998]). In mid-June 2000, four churches in different parts of India were bombed, while in the southern state of Andhra Pradesh, church graves were desecrated. In the same month, a church in Maharashtra was ransacked, and an evangelist working for the India Campus Crusade for Christ was found stabbed to death at his home (see Robert Marquand, "In India, a Pattern of Attacks on Christians", Christian Science Monitor ([29 June 2000]).
The entire country was shocked in January 1999 when an Australian Baptist missionary, Graham Staines, was murdered along with his two sons by being burnt alive inside a locked car. Staines had lived in India for the greater part of his life, and was working among lepers in Orissa, one of India’s most deprived regions (see the Human Rights Report and State Department Report, as cited below). His assailant, a Hindu militant by the name of Dara Singh, went around boasting about his deed, and even gave television interviews, while the police claimed that he could not be found. On 7 June 2000, the Catholic priest, George Kuzhikandam, was murdered in his sleep in a church in Mathura in Uttar Pradesh. The church cook, Vijay Ekka, who slept near the murdered clergyman and first reported the murder, was taken away by the police for interrogation, and himself died in police custody. Though the police claimed he had committed suicide, the autopsy indicated that he had been strangled. It is widely believed that the cook was silenced.
The evidence for violence against Christians in India is consequently incontrovertible. There are numerous compilations of atrocities perpetrated upon Christians, and they suggest an alarming pattern of violence: the intimidation of priests; threats placed against Christian schools; false allegations against Christian priests; the destruction of Christian institutions, such as the Damian Leprosy Hospital complex run by Catholic nuns for 31 years; attacks upon churches; assault upon Christian nuns and pastors, such as in the city of Jhansi on 2 May 2000; the distribution of scurrilous literature; and murder of Christians.
written by continuum , August 25, 2009
There are reasons for Hindus in India to react this way. All one has to remember is the 2000 year history of Hindus who gave shelter to all religious people who were persecuted, including Christians for over 1600 years in India.
Now the question is why Hindus are reacting this way. VHP, Bajrang dal and other political pro-Hindu orgs are a reaction to prolonged attacks on Hindus for over 200 years by christian missionaries and organizations. They also attack violently muslims. This is because the Indian government has not protected Hindus from these xian and islamic missionaries preying on Hindus.
The case in point is the pathetic condition of Hindus in kashmir, Nagaland, Tripura, kerala, West Bengal etc.
In addition christian missionaries have tried to disturb the peace in BJP ruled states by disseminating provocative literature against Hindus and Hinduism calling them devil worshipers and brainwashing converts with utter hatred.
Note that Hindus never attack Buddhists when they convert Hindus or Jains or Sikhs or Jews or atheists. Why is it they attack only christians and Muslims? There is a valid reason, because Hindus were attacked by these groups first and they are merely reacting with violence when things go too far.
1. Talking about Gujarat, christian churches teach their followers that Hindus are untouchables and that christians should not even share the same village with them. The following videos will prove my point. One of the christian converts who reverted to Hinduism explains what these christian missionaries teach them. These missionaries ofcourse teach the converts that Hindus are less than human and that they are devil worshipers. With such teachings going on no wonder you will find violent reaction from Hindus some time or other.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3Zxjndf0mw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkvdtzk1pbo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52Jok2Jzt3s&feature=related
2. The story of Orissa runs for last 200 years. British monarchy with their missionaries have engaged in demonizing Hindus and Hinduism for 200 years of their rule. After independence, missionaries from New Zealand and Australia, and UK started pouring in to convert certain Hindu tribes.
The recent clashes are between scheduled tribes, certain tribes that ar3e Hindus and another tribe that is Christian. The following BBC link gives a balanced view.
The decade old conflict included physically violent attacks on Hindu leaders by christian tribesmen, including acid attacks and burning Hindus alive under the direction of missionaries. This violence reached peak when Swami Laxmananda, an 80 year old Hindu holy man, being killed by hired mercenaries of christian missionaries. These were maoist terrorists who were always anti-Hindu and both christian missionaries and they joined for monetary and other benefits.
3. Violence in Karnataka
This is also preceded by illegal activities like taking over legally owned lands of Jains and Hindus to build churches, planting crosses all over the city and threats from christians, throwing stones on Hindus near christian neigborhoods, including dissemination of hate filled literature by missionaries. The following videos prove all allegations.
Christian aggression in Cauvery Layout, India
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8woHykQgB8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICWHHOcYPVw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5v0IGoa10k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmeE_2SDhSw
The above videos show legal documents of land being owned by a Jain businessman and whose land was illegally usurped by church and where a christian church was illegally built. Dure to the political clout these christians have and support from christian leader (Sonia Maino Gandhi, an Italian) of congress, the ruling party, they even issue physical threats on Hindus who do not convert. The then ruling party congress in the state did not even take legal actions against christians.
Every violent act of hindus is preceded by a series of prolonged violent and abusive attacks against Hindus by christians and muslims. When Hindus react it becomes headlines in news, but when thousands of Hindus suffer violent attacks on them no news media even reports then nor the government protects them. Hindus have no other choice but to react violently when all other means were tried and failed to protect them.
Now the question is why Hindus are reacting this way. VHP, Bajrang dal and other political pro-Hindu orgs are a reaction to prolonged attacks on Hindus for over 200 years by christian missionaries and organizations. They also attack violently muslims. This is because the Indian government has not protected Hindus from these xian and islamic missionaries preying on Hindus.
The case in point is the pathetic condition of Hindus in kashmir, Nagaland, Tripura, kerala, West Bengal etc.
In addition christian missionaries have tried to disturb the peace in BJP ruled states by disseminating provocative literature against Hindus and Hinduism calling them devil worshipers and brainwashing converts with utter hatred.
Note that Hindus never attack Buddhists when they convert Hindus or Jains or Sikhs or Jews or atheists. Why is it they attack only christians and Muslims? There is a valid reason, because Hindus were attacked by these groups first and they are merely reacting with violence when things go too far.
1. Talking about Gujarat, christian churches teach their followers that Hindus are untouchables and that christians should not even share the same village with them. The following videos will prove my point. One of the christian converts who reverted to Hinduism explains what these christian missionaries teach them. These missionaries ofcourse teach the converts that Hindus are less than human and that they are devil worshipers. With such teachings going on no wonder you will find violent reaction from Hindus some time or other.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3Zxjndf0mw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkvdtzk1pbo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52Jok2Jzt3s&feature=related
2. The story of Orissa runs for last 200 years. British monarchy with their missionaries have engaged in demonizing Hindus and Hinduism for 200 years of their rule. After independence, missionaries from New Zealand and Australia, and UK started pouring in to convert certain Hindu tribes.
The recent clashes are between scheduled tribes, certain tribes that ar3e Hindus and another tribe that is Christian. The following BBC link gives a balanced view.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/south_asia/7637087.stm
The popular narrative is that the conflict is all about tribes people, egged on by radical Hindu groups, targeting the Christian community to put an end to the church and its growing influence in the region.
But that is only a small part of Kandhamal's tangled conflict. To describe it as a war over religion is to simplify it, say analysts and officials.
A house attack in the anti-Christian riots in Kandhamal
They say it is essentially a decades-old conflict over identity, rights and entitlements.
The decade old conflict included physically violent attacks on Hindu leaders by christian tribesmen, including acid attacks and burning Hindus alive under the direction of missionaries. This violence reached peak when Swami Laxmananda, an 80 year old Hindu holy man, being killed by hired mercenaries of christian missionaries. These were maoist terrorists who were always anti-Hindu and both christian missionaries and they joined for monetary and other benefits.
3. Violence in Karnataka
This is also preceded by illegal activities like taking over legally owned lands of Jains and Hindus to build churches, planting crosses all over the city and threats from christians, throwing stones on Hindus near christian neigborhoods, including dissemination of hate filled literature by missionaries. The following videos prove all allegations.
Christian aggression in Cauvery Layout, India
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8woHykQgB8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICWHHOcYPVw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5v0IGoa10k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmeE_2SDhSw
The above videos show legal documents of land being owned by a Jain businessman and whose land was illegally usurped by church and where a christian church was illegally built. Dure to the political clout these christians have and support from christian leader (Sonia Maino Gandhi, an Italian) of congress, the ruling party, they even issue physical threats on Hindus who do not convert. The then ruling party congress in the state did not even take legal actions against christians.
Every violent act of hindus is preceded by a series of prolonged violent and abusive attacks against Hindus by christians and muslims. When Hindus react it becomes headlines in news, but when thousands of Hindus suffer violent attacks on them no news media even reports then nor the government protects them. Hindus have no other choice but to react violently when all other means were tried and failed to protect them.
written by continuum , August 25, 2009
Hindus have always shown their true colors for last 1600 years by giving refuge to all persecuted communities in this country, including Syrian Christians.
Christians have also shown their true colors by persecuting and abusing non-Christians for last 1600 years.
Christians have also shown their true colors by persecuting and abusing non-Christians for last 1600 years.
written by continuum , August 25, 2009
In short there are some points to note.
1. I have shown organized christian terrorist attacks on Hindus like that of NLFT, hired mercenaries attacking Hindu leaders and other forms of attacks on Hindus, Buddhists by Christian churches as part of their religious belief. This includes desecrating Hindu and Buddhist worship places without provocation of any kind from Hindus or Buddhists.
2. On the other hand, any violent acts of Hindus against christians or Muslims is always preceded by a provocative act of christians or Muslims, including physically violent acts of terrorism, assassination of Hindu leaders with Maoist elements etc.
3. No traditional or authentic Hindu schools ever preach its population to act violently even if violently attacked. The political Hindu orgs like VHP, Bajrang Dal etc. that involve also do not approve the violent acts from its top leadership completely. Often local Hindus, after reaching their limit of patience often act violently making their own decisions to do so.
The violence in Orissa and Karnataka was fueled by the insensitive and violent acts of Christians against Hindus under the instigation of missionaries. No single organization can whip all the Hindus into such frenzy, as Hindus are not that united or single minded. This can happen only if you keep annoying and attacking Hindus over prolonged periods of time.
1. I have shown organized christian terrorist attacks on Hindus like that of NLFT, hired mercenaries attacking Hindu leaders and other forms of attacks on Hindus, Buddhists by Christian churches as part of their religious belief. This includes desecrating Hindu and Buddhist worship places without provocation of any kind from Hindus or Buddhists.
2. On the other hand, any violent acts of Hindus against christians or Muslims is always preceded by a provocative act of christians or Muslims, including physically violent acts of terrorism, assassination of Hindu leaders with Maoist elements etc.
3. No traditional or authentic Hindu schools ever preach its population to act violently even if violently attacked. The political Hindu orgs like VHP, Bajrang Dal etc. that involve also do not approve the violent acts from its top leadership completely. Often local Hindus, after reaching their limit of patience often act violently making their own decisions to do so.
The violence in Orissa and Karnataka was fueled by the insensitive and violent acts of Christians against Hindus under the instigation of missionaries. No single organization can whip all the Hindus into such frenzy, as Hindus are not that united or single minded. This can happen only if you keep annoying and attacking Hindus over prolonged periods of time.
written by continuum , August 25, 2009
Hindus showed their true colors by giving refuge to all persecuted people for over 1600 years, including Syrian christians.
Christians show(ed) their true colors by persecuting all non-christians for last 1600 years, including rival sects.
Christians show(ed) their true colors by persecuting all non-christians for last 1600 years, including rival sects.
written by kmgy , August 26, 2009
You're still living the Dark Ages. Wake up now and free yourself from its nightmares. Hindu hostility and violence to Christians is happening in India despite the miniscule proportion (2.4%) of Christian population. The backward and regressive native practices cannot stand up to the light of truth brought by Christianity.
written by continuum , August 26, 2009
You're still living the Dark Ages. Wake up now and free yourself from its nightmares.
I really hope so and this will happen once the christians and muslims who were responsible for dark ages in medieval times and in modern times disappear.
Hindu hostility and violence to Christians is happening in India despite the miniscule proportion (2.4%) of Christian population.
I have prove with well known facts that if anybody is showing hostility, it is xians and mooslims.
2.4 % or 24 % does not matter. It is what your religion teaches regarding other faiths and non-believers. Unlike Hinduism (which does NOT mention anything about unbelievers), both xianity and Islam contain verses that demonize non-believers.
You cannot blame Hindus for reacting with violence for they were violently attacked first.
The backward and regressive native practices cannot stand up to the light of truth brought by Christianity.
I wonder what truth and what light is this that drives these christians towards hatred, bigotry and terrorism? I have not received an answer until now and do not expect a logical answer.
written by kmgy , August 26, 2009
--"I wonder what truth and what light is this that drives these christians towards hatred, bigotry and terrorism?"--
Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as you love yourself", "Pray for those who persecute you", "Love your enemies". Mr. continuum if you consider these teachings leaning towards hate, bigotry and terrorism, then something is wrong and that explains Hindus HATRED and VIOLENCE against Christians in India. No wonder your nation is in such a sad and miserable state in league with the likes of Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia, and other hellholes.
Jesus said, "Love your neighbor as you love yourself", "Pray for those who persecute you", "Love your enemies". Mr. continuum if you consider these teachings leaning towards hate, bigotry and terrorism, then something is wrong and that explains Hindus HATRED and VIOLENCE against Christians in India. No wonder your nation is in such a sad and miserable state in league with the likes of Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia, and other hellholes.
written by lw1 , August 28, 2009
Although rogue Hindus and Christians have to be condemned, these are not the policies of Indian,British or United States governments.The greatest threat to the world is Islam.
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This is what is taught in Islam by those idiot Maulanas. May God save mother Earth from these fanatics.