www.islam-watch.org

Supposedly there's no compulsion in Islam, so why is the penalty for apostasy death? Savages.

137. Lo! those who believe, then disbelieve and then (again) believe, then disbelieve, and then increase in disbelief,
Allah will never pardon them, nor will He guide them unto a way.
4:137. Sesungguhnya orang-orang yang beriman kemudian kafir, kemudian beriman (pula), kemudian kafir lagi, kemudian bertambah kekafirannya, maka sekali-kali Allah tidak akan memberi ampunan kepada mereka, dan tidak (pula) menunjuki mereka kepada jalan yang lurus.

"Supposedly there's no compulsion in Islam, so why is the penalty for apostasy death? Savages."

I didn't have you down to be ignorant

Can you prove your claim regarding the penalty for apostates?.

Muslim countries practice this barbaric retribution . The least they do is to imprison the apostate to exact a forced confession under severe threats of torture until they do so. But in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afghanistan ,and other islamic countries like Pakistan apostasy attracts death penalty. Some like M&P, rzq, malem would abfuscate and deny it while the evidence is staring at them starkly. Islam is a trap from which none can escape alive - it is a lifelong imprisonment where the adherent is to live in fear ,measuring every word that he/she utters so that it does not catch the attention of the fanatics/zealots or the mullahs who live off the fear-psychosis infected people.

Islam is a trap from which none can escape alive

Who set this website up?

You are being foolish.

when you offer up one shred of proof to the contrary, then I will converse with you, troll. But you will not, and can not prove anything to redeem Islam. And THAT'S all you have been able to prove.
I'll judge the tree by its fruit, thanks.
Finis

I wrote the above post not M&P.

Islamophobiaphobia - lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...nlqja-uU0=

Thanks that tells me alot about you!
Acts 17 idiots. Nabeel and co!!!!
Comedians!

I enjoy their debates, but if you don't like them, c'est la vie.

It's funny how it's everybody else's fault when an apostate does something stupid!!!
If you want to apostate then stfu and do it. Stop your prayers, stop your zakat, stop the trips to Mecca and declare your apostacy to yourself.
Some of these dumbos want to convert their communities to apostacy. Only then do they realise that they might just get bitch slapped.
Take this Bangladeshi dude, tries to convert his family, lands in england and blames the immigration service. Yarls wood is a detention facility where illegal immigrants are kept until they are put infront of a judge.
Sounds like a trip back to Bangladesh might be the best thing for him!

puts their words right back in their faces lol
good stuff

Let me remind you what you said:

Supposedly there's no compulsion in Islam, so why is the penalty for apostasy death? Savages.

You have asked a question.....

And before you have even received a response, you have determined that muslims are savages....

Very civil indeed.

Before you start asking me to provide you with any evidence, you need to justify what YOU have said. I would have thought that is how people go about debating.

So I ask again, please prove that the penalty for Apostacy is death.

Thanks.

like I did with you. I enjoy a two-sides debate. Something which is impossible with you. Go and find someone else to convince.
Bye bye

that he figured out muslims are savages long ago,like the rest of us huh? Does it bother you that some bright guys have turned the tables on you? Speaking the words of mo from koran and hadith lololol

I'm assuming the last post was from you?

How could I waste my breath when I am not speaking......?

I enjoy a two-sides debate

Really?

I challenged what you said and you are now evading the issue. Is this your method of a two sided debate?

I have asked you to justify what you said and so far, you have failed to do so.

Please justify what you said (if you can), with appropriate references and I will refute you.

Good luck.

the tally of muslim slaughter in Bangladesh runs from 500,000 to 5,000,000 so what eh you panderer of murderers

to prove savagery is to draw a stick figure, say it's mohammed, and watch the legions of rabid Muslims go on a murderous rampage, car burning, stone throwing, knife weilding, allah u akbaring like feral racoons through the streets. While all those NON-savage muslims yawn and go back to their day jobs of accusing every non-muslim who breathes of being islamophobic. Pretty damning even in Lamen's terms, but, again c'est le vie.

This website was set up by an exmuslim, ofcourse; but this person is situated in the free world , that is a nonmuslim nation, probably the west. Can you do the same living in a muslim country or even a muslim majority nation? Obviously not, because the apostate would be caught and tortured or murdered in the most gruesome manner . That is for certain , since islam is anti-civilisation and pro barbaric arabian cult. That is why you have the barbaric "blasphemy" law.Take Pakistan for example , this blasphemy law is used to settle scores by one muslim against another , or even worse , to usurp the properties of a nonmuslim and murder the nonmuslim under the pretext of this socalled blasphemy ,rape and forcibly convert their womenfolks. This abominable and barbaric practice has systematically decimated the hindu population in Pakistan ,which was over 15% in 1947 to less than 2% in 2012. That is islam , and anyone can see this plainly as a barbaric arab supremacist cult.

watch the legions of rabid Muslims go on a murderous rampage, car burning, stone throwing, knife weilding, allah u akbaring like feral racoons through the streets. While all those NON-savage muslims yawn and go back to their day jobs of accusing every non-muslim who breathes of being islamophobic.

So there is such a thing as NON-savage muslims. That will not help Vbv and his cause.

I await the justification of your first post on here.......

Good luck.

you're beginning to appear slightly desperate to engage me into another futile debate with you - so you can weasel out of every question asked.
Anyway, who says I haven't given reference? Look a little harder. But let me preempt you; I was cherry picking/taking it out of context/it's a mistranslation/I need to know Arabic to understand/I'm a quranist, I don't follow the hadiths, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, blah, blah, blah (insert applicable response; as many that fits)
And that's all that I have to say to you, Muslim and Proud. I've seen your motive and know your game. Nil interest.
Comprende?

just ignore the trolls since they have no real defense, they just try and turn our words and demand a response. This is the world of a primative, like from the jungles of Africa and they can't respond, because they know we know their lies !!

when Muslims are in the minority they hear no evil, see no evil, or speak no evil (in front of us anyway) while they accuse us of being intolerant, islamophobic, anti-Muslim bigots, for stating the facts and statistics of what happens in countries where Muslims are the Majority.
All you need to know what any western country would be like under Muslim rule, is to see what happens inside the Muslim only ghettos, where sociopaths like Anjem Choudary are gleefully waiting to start kuffur killing, head chopping, hand slicing, adulterer stoning, gay hanging, child marrying etc.

I gave a certain proud muslim the benefit of the doubt, and asked if he was able to refute the points in the the ex-muslims letter to the world. All I got over 20-odd posts was evasiveness and deflection - with him insisting that I refute the letter and not him - as if I was the bloody Muslim. It's pointless to engage in them. They know what exists in their holy books, and they know that we know, and all their redundant excuses isn't going to change it.

i have a simple task for u : go to saudi arabia and say " apostages of islam shud not be killed " say this loudly atleast 100 times in front of the moral police.

pls come back alive then we shall talk.

there is no dog-pig but allah and muhamed is his dog-pig-piss

And that's all that I have to say to you, Muslim and Proud. I've seen your motive and know your game. Nil interest.
Comprende?

No problem - and I'm not desperate btw.

Good luck with your two-sides debate - with errrrrrm........who exactly?

Oh and here is what you said to me last time (on 21/03/12):

Ciao, I'm not going to waste my time on you again.

So you have indeed proved you are a hypocrite and here is the best bit...............................you cannot defend yourself as you have (quite firmly) closed the door on yourself. Well done and good luck with your debates..........with those who are on the same side as you - lol.

*chuckles*

he doesn't have any response so he just rattles on and on about nothing. He's a kid, that's all,and he wont accept that I am his daddy, M&Perverted, I am your father...with a deep voice lol...yeah so true HARKAT UL JIHAD EI KAFIROON I'd love to be a fly on the wall when that happens, and malman can declare the hadith bogus too, truly I'd love to see that come down!

just ignore the trolls since they have no real defense

So whilst ignoring the "trolls" and advising othere to do so, you found out that:

he doesn't have any response so he just rattles on and on about nothing.

What a muppet.

Have you got the deceny to stick to your word?

Jye failed miserably and so have you. Maybe you should both debate each other and at least that way, Jye gets her "two-sides" debate.

I write typos. My bad
lol.
Hey, if you even wear a crucifix in Saudi Arabia, they start bleeding from their eyes, shaking and crying for their mommies (second cousins), while insisting you take it off post haste. Talk about having a major inferiority complex.

taquyya just like you son...like I said your just a boy trying to fill a mans shoes but your weakness shows lol
Your are defeated time and time again, I'll give it to you, you are not bothered by being a loser :)

*Feels the desperation (and "deceny") level rise*
*laughs*
@Bundy, I haven't a shred of "deceny", how about you? Must be a Muslim thing...
Later chaps, people to do, places to see
;)

Later chaps, people to do, places to see
;)

Indeed,

Whilst holding your head in shame - hypocrite.

Remember - you are not allowed to waste any time with me ;-)

To get the hand lotion and toilet tissue out son? To bad you have to wait to marry a cow selected by your parents to be a man hahaha

Here is what you said earlier:

he doesn't have any response so he just rattles on and on about nothing. He's a kid,

Now YOU are saying:

Isn't it time...To get the hand lotion and toilet tissue out son? To bad you have to wait to marry a cow selected by your parents to be a man hahaha

Keep digging loser......lol

Can I just add, that laughing at someone self proclaiming themselves to be the winner, is never a waste of my time, but bloody hilarious; in a pathetic kind of way, but such is life.
Needy needy...

@Bundy, calling the poor girl a cow is unkind. The results of chronic inbreeding can also make one look like a camel or a donkey. I've seen the videos. Yikes!
I guess they never got the memo that reproducing with your relatives is "indecency".

first cousins make wonderful lovers though lol

i should say rotflmao hahahahahahhahaha

I can't help myself lolololol

perverted muzzie hahahhahahhahahahahahha

Later chaps, people to do, places to see

Lying - as well as a hypocrite.

It's all coming out now.

serious note...he's caught you out Jye, whooops he'll put jinns on your tail and curse you...he's a big man somewhere, in sometime, maybe when he grows whiskers

Yeah, but it means your offspring will be a little slow, a little paranoid, a little desperate, and with a HUGE inferiority complex. They're also known to do this whacked out chanting, that sounds something like this - "ALLLOOOOOOOO OINK BAR".
Scary.

Bundypig. I already have a black dog. He's full of Jinn I TELL YA!

PS: Can you tell me something? Are Muslims aware of Iphones? You know, those little contraptions that allow you to post in forums while out and about...?

have to feed the chickens and pigs, do a man's work, but to avoid confusion on the morons thought process, I'll be back soon :)

now he'll freak out... probably not, they are a western invention you know, and they hate westerners. cya inna bit

The following are the ways which will help u out of any FEAR, ANXIETY..and leads to happy life in what ever may be the circumstances...
1. The most of the problems due to EXISTENCE OF OTHERS in your mind. If u try to get rid of OTHERS...there would not be any problem.(This is very vast subject to realize but just try).
2. Just breadth normally. Take full breadth on stomach. When u breadth your belly should expand and when u exhale your belly should contract.
Initially there would be pain on your muscles. It will take three to four days. But after that u will be relaxed.
3. Try to watch your breadth ...and keep attention at the middle of the forehead. It will ease your tension.
4. Close your eyes and try to breadth as normal as possible.
5. Do not try to fight with your thought. Just try to flow with your thought. After some time u will start feeling witness of those thoughts.
Just try these steps if you can.

Of course, it'd be easier to insult the country that feeds me, then go and collect my welfare cheque, but my cousins don't really do it for me. So it means holding down an actual paying job.

This is what she said on 20/03:

So I read a lot of infantile posts on here, but not one counter argument to refute the subject

Hypocrite indeed.

Keep going.

Darn it, was my sister trolling on my pc again? That b!tch! lol

Well done.

You should continue to respond and 'waste your time'

Keep going

Attempting a serious debate with you = waste of my time.
Laughing at your desperation = never a waste of my time.

Got 15 minutes, please reply, quickly. I haven't laughed like this in awhile.

Times up. Thanks for the laughs, Muslima (in case your sister trolls your pc as well)

Islamic Law:
There is also a consensus by all four schools of Sunni Islamic jurisprudence (i.e., Maliki, Hanbali, Hanafi, and Shafii), as well as classical Shiite jurists, that apostates from Islam must be put to death.

The process of declaring a person to be an apostate is known as takfir and the apostate is called a murtadd.

Averroes (d. 1198), the renowned philosopher and scholar of the natural sciences, who was also an important Maliki jurist, provided this typical Muslim legal opinion on the punishment for apostasy:

"An apostate...is to be executed by agreement in the case of a man, because of the words of the Prophet, 'Slay those who change their din [religion]'...Asking the apostate to repent was stipulated as a condition...prior to his execution."

The contemporary (i.e., 1991) Al-Azhar (Cairo) Islamic Research Academy endorsed manual of Islamic Law, Umdat al-Salik (pp. 595-96) states:

"Leaving Islam is the ugliest form of unbelief (kufr) and the worst.... When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostasizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed. In such a case, it is obligatory...to ask him to repent and return to Islam. If he does it is accepted from him, but if he refuses, he is immediately killed."

I actually had tears running down my cheeks, but on a more serious note, inbreeding in Pakistan, the numbers approach 70%. Even in England, more than half of Pakistani immigrants are married to their first cousins, and in Denmark the number of inbred Pakistani immigrants is around 40%. To make matters worse, over 50% of muslims worldwide are inbred.So is your mother your aunt M$Perverted? How do you tell if your sister is your 2nd cousin?

Qur'an (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them"

Qur'an (9:11-12) - "But if they repent and establish worship and pay the poor-due, then are they your brethren in religion. We detail Our revelations for a people who have knowledge. And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief - Lo! they have no binding oaths - in order that they may desist."

that would be soooooo confusing, not to mention what the children have to go through, I should post pictures of these kids, monkey children I think they're called, dont see them even in W.Virginia

The consensus you incorrectly stated about in the end has no bearing on the Quran which is the authority. A man cannot come along and make up rules that go against the Quran. Should one want to leave Islam, so be it, they leave. If you have ever read the Quran, which most who post on here have not, you woudl clearly see that there is no such behavior advocated as you stated above. In fact there is no Sunni, Shia etc....sects, these are false titles given to Muslims by men and NOT Allah.

they are called rat children...to see the way they live it is no wonder they (the Pakistani's) want to escape...but when they arrive they continue their primative ways and nothing changes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jnx2HviImAg

Koran (4:89) - "They but wish that ye should reject Faith, as they do, and thus be on the same footing (as they): But take not friends from their ranks until they flee in the way of Allah (From what is forbidden). But if they turn renegades, seize them and slay them wherever ye find them"

why you guys even stay around, you're defeated at every turn, but you continue to lie and twist words, demand shite ...it's a mystery to me

The reason why executing apostates has always been well-ensconced in Islamic law is that there is an indisputable record of Muhammad and his companions doing exactly that according to the reliable Hadith. According to verse 4:80 of the Quran: "Whoso obeyeth the Messenger obeyeth Allah."

Bukhari (52:260) - "...The Prophet said, 'If somebody (a Muslim) discards his religion, kill him.' " Note that there is no distinction as to how that Muslim came to be a Muslim.

Bukhari (83:37) - "Allah's Apostle never killed anyone except in one of the following three situations: (1) A person who killed somebody unjustly, was killed (in Qisas,) (2) a married person who committed illegal sexual intercourse and (3) a man who fought against Allah and His Apostle and deserted Islam and became an apostate."

Bukhari (84:57) - [In the words of] "Allah's Apostle, 'Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him.'"

Bukhari (89:271) - A man who embraces Islam, then reverts to Judaism is to be killed according to "the verdict of Allah and his apostle."



Reliance of the Traveller (Islamic Law) o8.1 - "When a person who has reached puberty and is sane voluntarily apostatizes from Islam, he deserves to be killed." (o8.4 affirms that there is no penalty for killing an apostate).

Where have you gone hypocrite?

I was just starting to enjoy your time wasting......

Return at once.

are a laughing stock even to Muslims. They know while the Hadiths exist, they cannot defend Mohammed and his kiddy/raping/head chopping fetish, so they deny it altogether. Since the Sunnis are the the largest sect of Muslims and who are not apposed to head chopping of other Muslim sects, I wonder how long the Quranists will last?
Though, how do you emulate the perfect man, (snort) Mo, when you deny his biographies?

Re Part 1

There is also a consensus by all four schools of Sunni Islamic jurisprudence (i.e., Maliki, Hanbali, Hanafi, and Shafii), as well as classical Shiite jurists, that apostates from Islam must be put to death.

So what needs to happen for an apostate to be convicted?

Ps. Only an apostate would ever know that he is an apostate right?

you know, dude, it's really "indeceny" to continuously mock someone's typo.

I'll give you a minute to calm yourself, and see if you get the irony.

*is not holding my breath*

Folks, name-calling, personal attacks, mud-slinging is going beyond toleration. So, two commenters have come under ban already.

I want drastic improvement in the health of debate/discussion on the forum. All comments must focus on the topic of discussion.

If not, comment options may be shut down completely as it's not adding any value to articles.

I'll get back to the discussion.

25000 Ahmedis
2,869,000 muslims
getting crowded and it is a infidel country

has anyone seen this? It's freaking hilarious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0HBTYwoS2g

I'll get back to the discussion.

Don't bet on it.

Well, not with you, we've seen how you like to weasel out of it. Even the editor called you out.

Oh and Salaam for the family shout out, I'll let them know ;)

Folks, name-calling, personal attacks, mud-slinging is going beyond toleration. So, two commenters have come under ban already.

Does that mean there will be no more mud-slinging against Islam?

Great

'Ps. Only an apostate would ever know that he is an apostate right?'

sounds like a perfect moron.

only if they hid it well, but they tend to get found out. Some people don't like living a lie - who da thunk?

Here is the question again:

So what needs to happen for an apostate to be convicted?

"Does that mean there will be no more mud-slinging against Islam?"
We will stick to Quran and hadiths and Islam in general including Allah and Mo.

We will stick to Quran and hadiths and Islam in general including Allah and Mo.

Just like good muslims do.

Ps. Your pride has just been dented - ever so 'slightly'.

Well done.

I promise the same ….

I will mud sling every thing I have around me at Muhammad/ his followers and all there creations, Allah/Quran/Islam /hadeeth/Sirah … nothing else

A man and his followers who lived by the sword cant be choosy when it is time to pay for crimes they committed.

the party is over

…… and whoever of you turns back from his religion, then he dies while an unbeliever-- these it is whose works shall go for nothing in this world and the hereafter, and they are the inmates of the fire; therein they shall abide. [Al-Baqarah: 2: 217]

I will set no base or wicked thing before my eyes. I hate the work of them who turn aside [from the right path]; it shall not grasp hold of me. (Psalm 101:3)
…… But you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hands of all the people (Deuteronomy 13: 6/ 6-9)

And then, please read: The Difference Between the Bible and the Qur'an
http://ishamerdeka.blogspot.com/2012/01/difference-between-bible-and-quran.html

Ps. Your pride has just been dented - ever so 'slightly'.
Not really. I just decided not to stoop ever so low to level myself with ....
Hope you understood what I meant.

I am all with all who are doing this noble task.
And your insight brings another insight for you have seen and lived it firsthand for more time then many on this site.

You said to fineliving:

And your insight brings another insight for you have seen and lived it firsthand for more time then many on this site.

Indeed she has - she had many child PRIDES in her family.

Lol

Thank you everyone for understanding the danger of an ex-muslim. Some of us who tends to be sceptic, I have never been an illegal entrant or overstayer in the UK. We were brought in at Yarl's wood when we claimed asylum in London. I feel it is unjust, as a case of an asylum of an apostate can not be taken in to consideration in fast track as it is not a straight forward case. However, if the procedure of determination is just a sham, then it is a different story altogether. Depriving someone of his liberty of free movement is such a mental trauma, only those who suffer would understand. I hope no one ever has to suffer this. If I was a criminal and was sentenced for my crime, I should have had no excuse for my freedom to be curtailed. But when I am not a criminal but a destitute person looking for a safe shelter, instead of offering help, get punished with imprisonment, is that humanity?

Islam is a real threat. It is now spreading all over Europe like pleague. For the sake of human civilization to move forward this evil political ideology must be stopped. We do not ever need any divine intervention to lead a good moral life. We must recognize that adam and eves are all fairy tales and origin of species are facts. It is evidenced that Quran most certainly did not fall from the sky and Muhammad was a dirtiest man in history. And no one should be tortured or killed for telling these truths.

Thank you very much all.

Tanjir.

"Indeed she has - she had many child PRIDES in her family."

"And her family is (Muslim not including her now)."

Arent you eating your own medicine.
You have shot yourself in foot as this is a perfect example of how Islam functions for fine comes from muslim family and background.
Even more LoL. However many you do more than them.

Look at the fine example of Muslim's evasion to refute any charge we throw at them against their prophet or their fake Islam ……

to avoid refuting … they just laugh at English mistake, which they are guilty of many times and that is their first language!!??

they think they are doing something useful … :-)

Of course …. the reason they do that is so clear …. they really have no refute to anything.

Look at the fine example of Muslim's evasion to refute any charge we throw at them against their prophet or their fake Islam ……

Every charge you throw at us is based on the Holy Qur'an and Hadith, which you do not regard to be factual. Remember, I refuted your son who has still not returned to answer...........he also said that he has told you many times not to make a fool of yourself on here - but you insist on doing it - lol

What more refutation could you ask for - lol

Your situation will nver change fineliving666.

You act as police, judge and solicitor in one.
You also think and say others are making fool of themselves by not beleiving in quran and hadiths.
So when you have irrefutable proofs that what your books say is right in totality and is 100 % true and nothing but truth with evidence dont feel worried about others making fool of themselves.
The LoL and fool has becoming too common we need new insight and evidence from you in support otherwise your role on this site become that of a flamer and troll.
You point english errors in fines posts however there have been errors from you as well for example "topical". You understand the meaning very well but just to make mockery of her posts you divert attention to english rather then the meaning,summary or jest.
Hope you understand what I said. feel free to clarify any thing from above and I will explain again without prejudice.

"Your situation will nver change fineliving666." I salute fine for courage against all what she has been through and with barrier of language past relgion, lifestyle etc still demonstrates a deep insigh and shows no fear.
She has trampled on many a (male) ego on this site.
You are 100% perfect in english; how come never become nver?
Shall we stick to point in that case? We to Qurans hadith Sharia, Sunnah, practices etc. and you to refute?

What were the comments that caused them to be banned? From my vantage point both sides have contributed equally to the party, and not one side is "more" guilty than the other.

he doesn't answer to you ;)

Too bad you dont understand how to discern that between a question and a demand, you might have not made such a disconnected comment. Then again you were part of the question

I am a solution to the problem ol boy," What were the comments that caused them to be banned? "
you sir, are a moron

maybe you should go set these guys straight?
I'm sure they'd love your input

http://1000mistakes.com/

Apparently you missed the "dont call people names" comment by the admin. Then again against a person such yourself I would imagine it would be valid to use the ol sticks and stones defense and then just ignore you like the others. Good luck chum

go away, you can't defend your koran's total crap anyway, we all see through you and the rest ;)

but it seems to fit

http://www.jihadwatch.org/2012/03/nearly-1000-pakistani-women-victims-of-honor-killings-in-2011.html

Bundy is one of Duh's disciples. He has no interest in any debate/discussion.......

What he han do very well, is talk complete nonesense, just like his teacher..........Duh (disrespect be upon him).

Take care Bro.

Bundy is one of Duh's disciples. He has no interest in any debate/discussion.......

That's rich coming from the Muslima who, to date, has wormed and weaseled his way out of answering a thing!

Does that mean there will be no more mud-slinging against Islam?

Mud-slinging at each other is not allowed. We will expose Islam as it is. Muslims may want to prove otherwise without name-calling, mud-slinging and other unhealthy means.

"He who changeth his Islamic deen, kill him!"

'And then, please read: The Difference Between the Bible and the Qur'an.'

Do you mean to say that if somebody eats shit, you will do likewise?, don't lie.

'So what needs to happen for an apostate to be convicted? '- You asked.

Apostasy is not a crime under the British law. So, question of conviction does not arise. On the contrary, the couple should be repatriated in a civilized democratic country where apostasy is no crime. Because, there is grave danger to their lives in their barbaric home country. Learn the norms of the civilized society. Mo was the worst criminal to live on earth and you people follow his criminal doctrine. So, you are unable to differentiate between good and evil.

Man of many talents! I didn't know comedy was one of them.
"We will expose Islam as it is"

written by Rzq, March 24, 2012
Man of many talents! I didn't know comedy was one of them.
"We will expose Islam as it is"

There is no comedy, it is deadly serious, rzq !

I don't know if you realise this, but muslims using taqiya DO NOT present a true picture of Islam as it really is !

For a muslim, all of Muhammad's acts are saintly ! Yet everyone knows most of them are henious and absolutely disgusting !

Examples are

1) torturing and killing the husband, her father, brothers and tribesmen of a Jewess and then screwing her the same night ! ... this action cannot be condoned by any stretch of imagination !

2) beheading 600 to 900 Jews AFTER they had surrendered ! .... 'despicable' is the word to describe this one !

3) raiding, pillaging and creating mayhem for commercial trading caravans .... looting is the word here !

4) Mercilessly slaughtering anyone who has satired or has been critical of Muhammad .... 'cruel demon' comes to mind here !

5) Forcibly changing pre-Islamic Arabia from a multicultural peaceful place to a dastardly one inhabited ONLY by Muhammad's co-religionists .... only 'brutal' can describe this act !

I can go on citing happenings from Muhammad's time onwards, but I'm sure the point has been made.

NOW, ISLAMISTS WILL SUGARCOAT EVERY ONE OF THE ABOVE HENIOUS ACTS AND MANY, MANY OTHERS SINCE THEN AS BEING "SAINTLY" !

Now, no sane person, inc. many muslims will agree with the above acts as being "saintly and divine".

This website's job is to bring out all the unfairness, cruelty and inanities of Islam into the open.

This is no comedy, my friend ! Millions have being losing their lives over the last 1400 years because of Islam and Muhammad !!!

Jesus, by comparison with Muhammad, was light years ahead of him ! He never held a sword in his hand yet influenced billions !

Jesus actually 'saved' a woman from being stoned to death by the Jews ! Muhammad, on the other hand, caused many to be killed by stoning, murder, pillaging etc. !

Even Alexander the Great, despite his cruelities elsewhere, treated a vanquished Indian king with dignity, returning his kingdom !

Similar kindness, justice and tolerance was shown by Buddha, Mahavira, Cyrus the Great (his first Charter of Human Rights ) etc.

When it comes to 'divine saintliness', many have shown it and all of them predate Muhammad by hundreds of years !

Muslims must bear this in mind !!!

This has been confirmed by the Quran, Hadiths, by the acts of Muhammad and the first four 'rightly guided' Caliphs and more importantly by acts of muslims from Muhammad through to Osama bin Laden and beyond him !

One fact puzzles everyone ... when it is okay for someone to leave a non-Islamic religion and convert to Islam (and NOT be killed by either side for this action), why do muslims get so angry when someone leaves Islam for another religion, angry enough for that apostate to be killed ?[/b

Surely, it has to be a 'level playing field' !

One would have thought at least the modern educated muslim would understand this much !!!

why do muslims get so angry when someone leaves Islam for another religion, angry enough for that apostate to be killed

It has nothing to do with anger. It is the law. You will find that high treason has never been taken lightly in any society or culture. Islam has a to deal with high treason - it's as simple as that.

The fact is this Scrutator: A muslim walking away from Islam and living peacefully is not the same as a muslim walking away from Islam and declaring (verbal) war.......hence high treason. For the muslim who walks away peacefully, nobody need know that he is an apostate. Unfortunately, in recent times especially, apostates consider it their duty to wage (verbal) war against Islam, hence the punishment for this is severe.

Please remember that the death penalty for treason in England was only abolished in 1998..............

Islam will not change it's law........this is impossible.

Ps. All of the English Treason Acts remain in force, to this day.

Do you mean to say that Muslim society has been squarely defeated in the verbal war being waged by ex-Muslims and hence it is right to invoke the law of treason to protect Islam? Verbal/intellectual war should be countered with verbal/intellectual war that you are trying. But, you feel helpless and nervous in the face of superior arguments and reasoning put forth by ex-Muslims/non-Muslims here. As a decent human being you needed to give up and become an ex-Muslim. Instead, you are indulging in uncivilized behavior, throwing tantrums.

Treason Act is meant to protect unity and territorial integrity of a country. Islam is not a country, how would you invoke that act to protect Islam? Have you ever seen that Treason Act has been invoked to protect Christianity or Judaism? Your posts only goes to prove that ex-Muslims have successfully carried their battle to the camp of Islam. Another 'ridda' war is imminent.

England has not murdered anyone for blasphemy since 1697 - Thomas Aikenhead. In fact, the last man to be convicted of Blasphemy was John William Gott, who was sentenced to 9 months in prison in 1924, and which the pubic reacted in outrage. So, are you comparing Modern Day Islam with England 300 + years ago, Muslim and Proud?

Can you find proof that Blasphemy and treason were synonymous , after the period of enlightenment, M&P?

The basis of Muslim and Proud's argument: Islam considers treason, what civilized countries today define as basic human rights.

GREAT argument, M&P- actually, no, it was pathetic. and shows you support an archaic, backward religion, reminiscent of medieval England. Bravo

Islam came before Medieval England - being hung drawn and quartered was carried many many years after Islam arrived on the scene.......

You have had to change your laws, which have now resulted in you being sha*ted left right and centre. As a british muslim, I probably have more rights than you do - PMSL ROFL LMAO

At work, my employer MUST cater for my Islamic needs
If I stop at the services on the Motorway, chances are, they will have facilities for muslims

Your own (change of) laws are making sure you run yourself into the ground to accomodate muslims.

Islam will not change it's law........this is impossible.

So, are you comparing Modern Day Islam with England 300 + years ago, Muslim and Proud?

LOL
PMSL
LMAO

Islam was complete 1400 years ago Mr Addam.

And yet, only 300 years ago, your England was still MEDIEVAL..........PMSL LMAO

You are hilarious.........."God save the Queen"

LOL
PMSL
LMAO

You're that stupid, huh? You didn't get the irony, so. I. Will. Say. It. Slowly. For. You.

300 years ago was the LAST time a person was murdered in England for blasphemy. But Muslims are still murdered to this VERY day. Therefore, (lread SLOWLY M&P, I will not repeat myself) Islam is a minimum 300 years BEHIND England in advancement.

You find that hilarious do you?

lol okay then.

I'm not British, Muslima.

But there will come a time when Europeans will get jack of you backward apes.

Islam is a minimum 300 years BEHIND England in advancement.

LOL
PMSL
ROFL
LMAO

You changed your laws..........

You are now being sha*ted.........

There is absolutely nothing you can do about it........

Read this bit very very very very very slowly Mr Addam:

Islam has made more progress and advancement in ENGLAND in the last 300 years than it has in the last 1400 years.

Comprende?

You HAD to change your laws to accomodate Islam - how else could Islam thrive in the west?

LOL
PMSL
LMAO
ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL

I mean, lts face it, you're even persecuting apostates for crying out loud........read the article. ROFL ROFL ROFL

Well, I was referring to socio-economic advancement, Muslima. Unlike Islam, which was "complete" 1400 years ago, and hasn't advanced a single day beyond.

Again, I am not British, but Britain is run by sniveling dhimmy appeasers. But that won't last for ever.

Britain is run by sniveling dhimmy appeasers. But that won't last for ever.

You're right - the way things are going, the "dhimmy appeasers" will be a minority in 30, 40 maybe 50 years time.

@ M&P

What you've written is not quite right !

Consider these:

Stating facts IS NOT VERBAL WAR !

What you describe as "verbal war" IS NOT HIGH TREASON !

Why should an ex-muslim keep his/her apostasy secret ?

In a muslim country, a peaceful ex-muslim annoucing his/her apostasy CANNOT LIVE PEACEFULLY IN SAFETY !

Islamic countries will be considered to be one of the international comity of nations only when they treat EX-MUSLIMS BELONGING TO ANOTHER RELIGION OR TO NONE THE SAME AS MUSLIMS, in terms of rights, respect and dignity !

You're right - the way things are going, the "dhimmy appeasers" will be a minority in 30, 40 maybe 50 years time.

If that happens, then England will be just another Muslim majority sewer, where minority sects of islam (that means all you Quranists) are persecuted along with non-muslims. Worse I think, since you'll be seen as traitors.

lol good luck with that, M&P. Careful what you wish for.

Stating facts IS NOT VERBAL WAR !

Errrrm, ex-muslims declare that the Holy Qur'an and Hadith are lies/fairy tales etc etc

They then use the Holy Qur'an and Hadith to scrutinise Islam and make ACCUSATIONS.

Accusations that are based on lies and fairy tales (according to them) are FACTS are they?

LOL

I'm not a Quranist btw......

If you in some way try and keep up, you will realise that I have challenged Malem on many occasions.

Ps. How would you keep up when all you can do is act like an "idiotic 8 year old" - ROFL ROFL ROFL

M&P, you deny the hadiths and that alone would get you a good head chopping in any country where Islam calls the shots. Talk about deluded.



You seem to be getting a lot of amusement out of the 8 year old quote. Hit close to home, maybe? The age you like to your wives to be? So use it as long as you want. I actually prefer Addams family more, it's more fitting for you guys, since you're prone to being inbred.

LOL

As you were.

Apropos your comments on the U.K., note these:-

1) The U.K. is a liberal open democracy, something muslim countries are NOT !

2) The U.K. accords every legal resident, of any religion or of none, the same rights, duties, respect and dignity, which muslim countries DO NOT !

3) Following from 2) above, the U.K. has granted limited arrangements to Jews and muslims in areas of kosher/halal food, place of worship(this right is for all religions) and for some (but not all) community family issues (these fall under arbitration arrangements, available to all in other areas as well). LEST MUSLIMS FORGET, PARLIAMENT HAS SANCTIONED THAT THESE PRIVILEGES CAN BE WITHDRAWN ANYTIME BY AN EXECUTIVE ORDER OF THE HOME SECRETARY !

4) The U.K. DOES NOT recognize muslim polygamous marriages contracted within the country and BRITISH LAWS APPLY TO MUSLIMS AND TO EVERYONE ELSE IN CRIMINAL MATTERS & ON MAJOR FAMILY ISSUES !

Hence, the limited discretionary arrangements granted to Jews and muslims are NOT something for which muslims have struggled and won, rather it reflects the generosity of the open democratic society that is the U.K. !

Anti-British activity on part of the muslim community will result in withdrawal of these facilities as speedily as they have been granted !

5) To take one example, in divorce cases the Islamic "triple talaq facility" is not recognized and alimony is payable to the ex-wives, in direct contravention of Quranic and Sharia laws.

M&P, you deny the hadiths and that alone would get you a good head chopping in any country where Islam calls the shots. Talk about deluded.

For the record, I regard all of the Authentic Hadiths to be FACTS......each and everyone of them.

There is one answer for you - I remember you crying about not getting answers - like an 8 year old child would lol.

Now here is a question for you:

Do you regard ANY of the Hadiths to be factual?

Yes or No

Ps. Chances are you will run off like an 8 year old lol.

Ps. Chances are you will run off like an 8 year old lol.

M&P has a fetish with 8 year olds. How fitting lol

For your answer, no I don't believe the hadiths to be factual. If I did, I'd be a muslim, now wouldn't I?

Ok … Let me try to make it as simple as I can for him ….

When we say >>> Quran is full a fairy tales …./ translate to / …. Quran was made up by Muhammad as he went alone to help his agenda ….BUT never came from any God .

When we say >>>>>> Quran says this, and says that, as proves that it is a Lie .. / translate to /... … Quran, is a Lie it ever came from a God … but it is true that Muhammad presented as it came from God.

When we say >>>>> hadeeth and sirah are full of stupid things and non sense .... / translate to / … although they are stupid things … but Muhammad did them and all Muslims bragged about them because at that time they did not know better … they thought all these stupid things they did as the most normal thing anyone can do . …

It is true that Muslims did stupid things and wrote about them and we bring them as they are written …

When we say >>>>>> Quran is factual and hadeeth and Sirah are factual .../ trancalte to / …

Factual that it did happen 1400 hundred years ago ………but ……NOT …. I repeat [ may be it will sinks in] …… NOT ….. it came from any God

Does Muslims …. see and understand the difference …..or it going to go over their heads like always.

It is so clear to everyone … why it is not to the Muslim mind?

It is clear, fineliving56. I suspect M&P is just using his usual ploy of weaseling out of explaining.

For your answer, no I don't believe the hadiths to be factual. If I did, I'd be a muslim, now wouldn't I?

Ok - that's the right answer.

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. Which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Thanks for clarifying your position.

Voila,

Here is a classic example Jye et al:

Fineliving666 said:

When we say >>>>> hadeeth and sirah are full of stupid things and non sense .... / translate to / … although they are stupid things … but Muhammad did them

Lol

See what I mean?

Even as an ex-muslim (which she claims to be), she is saying MUHAMMED DID THEM (i.e. the things mentioned in Hadith.

The clarity you provided Jye (et al), has proved my point - to a T.

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. Which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Nope, you're wrong. I do not regard Mohammed to be a "FACTUAL" Prophet from God, but a murderous warlord, and I take exception at the violent, intolerant texts in the Quran as well. If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

So your motive was to twist my words, was it? Nice try.

Here is what you said earlier:

For your answer, no I don't believe the hadiths to be factual. If I did, I'd be a muslim, now wouldn't I?

Here is what you are saying now:

If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

The narrative is indeed very clear FOR MULSIMS WHO BELIEVE IT.

You have made it crystal clear that you do not believe the Hadiths to be factual.

ROFL
PMSL
&
LMAO

Time to see you squirm.

I'm waiting......

A biography is considered non-fiction. Whether it happened or not, I can't say; I'm not a historian. But millions of Muslims emulate Mohammed, so they obviously believe every word. Therein lies the problem.

Feel free to twist my words more.

You have made it crystal clear that you do not believe the Hadiths to be factual.

see post above, dumb dumb.

You are squirming - as predicted.

But millions of Muslims emulate Mohammed, so they obviously believe every word.

Indeed, THEY DO. You don't, otherwise, you would also be a muslim, as you said earlier.

Let me remind you of your (sorry and pathetic) position:

For your answer, no I don't believe the hadiths to be factual. If I did, I'd be a muslim, now wouldn't I?

This are your words - hence the "quote".

you then said (again, I quote):

If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

Well done - you have helped me to prove a critical point and you have answered a question that was being evaded for weeks - even Mr Khan dodged it - it was that critical.

Fee free to continue squirming.......LMAO

So, your saying because I don't believe something to be factual, I cannot debate the effects it has on the world from the actions of those who do believe it?

That's the stupidest logic, I've ever read.

The point isn't whether I believe it, the point is how those act that DO.

Do you want me to dumb it down in lamens terms for you to understand?

PS: if you're waiting for me to squirm, you'll be waiting a long time. Cocky much?

So, your saying because I don't believe something to be factual, I cannot debate the effects it has on the world from the actions of those who do believe it?

Try and keep up squirmer.....

Here is what I said earlier on:

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. Which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Where did I say anything about DEBATING?

Lol

If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

This is an accusation squirmer. You are calling someone a paedophile, using the Hadith as evidence.............WHICH YOU DO NOT BELIEVE TO BE A FACT....

Read it again:

If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

You actually BELIEVE Prophet Muhammd (peace be upon him) married Ayesha (ra)

ROFL

Keep squirming.....

Ps. You can re-clarify your position by answering this question:

Do you BELIEVE that Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Ayesha (ra) - Yes or No

ROFL

Do you BELIEVE that Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Ayesha (ra) - Yes or No

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real. What I do believe is that it exists and within it Aisha married Mohammed when he was 54 and she was 6. You zealots believe it absolutely, and that's why his evil legacy exists today.

I don't need to believe it to debate it. Is that hard to understand?

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real. What I do believe is that it exists and within it Aisha married Mohammed when he was 54 and she was 6.

Ok, so you have changed your mind - ROFL

Did Cinderella go to the ball or not? Do you believe it to be a fact that she did?

ROFL

According to YOU, it's not true and not factual, yet you are saying:

and within it Aisha married Mohammed when he was 54 and she was 6

ROFL

Keep squirming.....

So on the basis that it is written somewhere and you do not regard it to be true, you make an accusation of paedophilia........

You're a laughing stock - thanks again for helping me prove my point.

ROFL

The next time non/ex-muslims make any accusations using the Hadith, be sure to say to them:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real.

The next time Mr Khan quotes a Hadith, be sure to say to him:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real.

The next time anyone makes an attack on Islam and quotes the Hadith, be sure to say:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real.

Job Done

Here is the last laugh:

ROFL

Did Cinderella go to the ball or not? Do you believe it to be a fact that she did?

Nope, I don't believe Cinderella is factual either. And yet the story of Cinderalla exists. If millions of people believed it to be fact and started emulating the Evil step sisters, I would point out that they were evil b!tches - whether they ever existed or not, and regardless if I believed the story to be true.

Do you see the comparison?

I am telling you that your made up religion that YOU BELIEVE (not me) is bulls!it.

Think I'm squirming? Keep waiting.

Remember,

the next time there is any accusation against Islam and the Hadith is quoted, be sure to say:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real.

Well done.

The next time anyone makes an attack on Islam and quotes the Hadith, be sure to say:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real

The above post, is Muslim and proud, using the over used and redundant ploy of telling non-mulsims that they cannot debate Islam because they don't believe in it.

Remember, the next time there is any accusation against Islam and the Hadith is quoted, be sure to say:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real.

Nice try squirmer.

Try and understand what a "quote" is.

You have refuted a lot of the articles this evening - every article which uses the Hadith as justification of any accusations.

Well done.

Muslims and Proud's ploy that non-believers cannot debate Islam. See above

I have not said a word about debating - my whole argument has been about accusations - those who can read will see it.

Keep squirming and remember what you need to do the next time Mr Khan and his crew use the Hadith to make acusations - i'm sure he'll thank you for it.

The next time anyone makes an attack on Islam and quotes the Hadith, be sure to say:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real

Muslims and proud using the overused excuse, that non-believers cannot debate the contents in the Hadiths.

Quran ….is ……FACTUAL

but

Quran ….. is ….. not ….. FACTUAL …… when it claims it came from any God …

Did it sink in … ? …. yet


Jye …

I know he is obfuscating …. but I thought if we give him some benefit of a doubt, and say he is ONLY ….*not so bright* he will get a hint and smart up and post real answers, instead ducking the questions and come back with word games …

he thinks he is refuting with non - answers answers … he is only deepening the Islamic hole he dug him self in .

Muslim and Proud believes that pointing out evils in Islamic Hadiths is void if you don't believe in them.

Another one of his PLOYS to avoid discussing what is actually in the Hadiths.

You can explain it so an ape would understand, but M&P is only interested in games to force the topic AWAY from his filthy little religion.

Muslim and Proud believes that pointing out evils in Islamic Hadiths is void if you don't believe in them.

Another one of his PLOYS to avoid discussing what is actually in the Hadiths.

Not at all - have a (slow) read of what we have said - it will all make sense to you..............maybe not.

The fact is remains: you people make accusations, knowing full well that the evidence (Hadith), according to you, is not even factual.........that's a sad state of affairs.

I mean let's face it, you were ready to start accusing the evil step sisters......ROFL

Nice try squirmer.

Try and understand what a "quote" is.

You have refuted a lot of the articles this evening - every article which uses the Hadith as justification of any accusations.

Well done.

AGAIN, we see that Mulsim and Proud's ploy is to use the weak excuse that non-believers cannot make accusations against the contents of the Hadiths.

thought I was squirming? I was letting you dig your own hole. lol

The fact is remains: you people make accusations, knowing full well that the evidence (Hadith), according to you, is not even factual.........that's a sad state of affairs.

Again, Muslim and Proud stating that those who don't believe in his religion cannot debate the contents of its books.

Point in case; one doesn't need to believe in fairy tales to debate them....

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. Which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Muslima, M&P, using one of the oldest tricks in the book muslims use to avoid the contents of the Hadiths.

That's right. If you don't believe it, you can't debate it. lol

Point in case; one doesn't need to believe in fairy tales to debate them....

Compare that to:

If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

ROFL - keep your spade handy.

Ps. I need to tend to the kebabs on the barby now - you feel free to continue your debate about "fairy tales".......LMAO

I believe the story of Aisha exists, and yet I believe it to be a disgusting pedophilia fairy tale.

ATTENTION:

MUSLIM AND PROUD WILL NOW WORM AND WEASEL OUT OF THE DEBATE, BY USING MY NON-BELIEVE AS AN EXCUSE TO AVOID THE CONTENTS OF THE HADITHS.

point in case, see quote below

you feel free to continue your debate about "fairy tales".......LMAO

I believe the story of Aisha exists, and yet I believe it to be a disgusting pedophilia fairy tale.

Ok, that's fine - it's taken you a while and along the way, you have had to change your "belief" a few times, but hey, we got there.

So you believe that the story exists and you believe it to be a "disgusting pedophilia fairy tale". Do such things exist? i.e. A paedophilia fairy tale? I mean let's face it, if you went to an average tom on the street and told him you believe a story to be a paedophilia fairy tale, you may well get a strange look........

Moving swiftly on.....

When was 'paedophilia' invented? Was it more than 1400 years ago? Please confirm.

point in case, see quote below

you feel free to continue your debate about "fairy tales".......LMAO

More LMAO and PMSL

TREASON is the REASON! Leaving a military organization in wartime is TREASON...and Islam is a POLITICAL INSTITUTION - a country without borders - so leaving Islam is DESERTION.

Throughout the Madinah surrahs, Muhammad made it very clear that he was building an army of warriors to conquer the world. After his defeat at the Battle of Uhud - where his forces broke ranks, turned tail and fled - Muhammad realised that his ragtag army of marauders needed training and discipline, so he led them on raids against local Jewish tribes, knowing that the Arabs wouldn't so much as butt their heads together over a bunch of Jews. First he attacked the al-Nadir (626CE) and expelled them, then he raided the Qurayzah (627CE), and then, following the treaty of Hudaybiyya in 628CE, he slaughtered the men and boys of Khaybar and enslaved the women and children (May, 628CE) in a preemptive surprise attack (Gazzowa) - a sudden and unprovoked assault.

In 629CE, Muhammad declared war on Persia, Yemen, Ethiopia, and the Byzantine Empire for refusing to recognise him as a prophet and accept Islam.

The Treaty of Hudaybiyya - which was supposed to be a 10 year truce - with the Quraysh of Makkah ended after just two years in 630. Islamic sources blame the Makkans for breading the treaty, so Muhammad had no choice but to attack Makkah. but the truth is, Muhammad had become powerful enough to attack Makkah and win. So that's what he did. His little god conveniently told him that he didn't have to keep treaties with pagans.

Muhammad either led or authorized over 80 raids on local tribes and temples during this time period. He even led an attack on the Byzantine Empire.

Islam means Submit! This is a war cry, a demand for surrender. Islam is not a religion, it is a political ideology and demands the death penalty for those who try to leave the battlefield. They are traitors to the cause of Islam - that is, world domination. Treason to the State of Islam is the reason.

"When was 'paedophilia' invented? Was it more than 1400 years ago?"

The answer is simple..
Pearly boy you must know who invented it for you have the information on when it was invented therfore you tell who invented it and I will tell you when it was invented? Simple isint it.

Another question for you and very simple at that.
Who invented martial rape? This has one world answer as you like to keep your sylables short so even one syllable will do.

Ok, that's fine - it's taken you a while and along the way, you have had to change your "belief" a few times, but hey, we got there.

I haven't changed my views at all, you're just too dumb not to understand them (not surprising)

Please feel free to twist my words some more and continue to use your laughable excuse that only Muslims can debate the contents of the hadiths.

I will point them out to highlight your methods of weaseling and avoidance.

More LMAO and PMSL

When Muslim and Proud has got nothing, this is his dumb as$ reply.

and we certainly see this *reply* a lot ;)

Check out the kiddy lovers, emulating their "prophet". Note the word "another" pedo sex gang. There has been a lot more. Charming...
Can see why M&P is so fond of bringing up 8 year olds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...r_embedded

written by Muslim and proud, March 25, 2012
Stating facts IS NOT VERBAL WAR !

Errrrm, ex-muslims declare that the Holy Qur'an and Hadith are lies/fairy tales etc etc

They then use the Holy Qur'an and Hadith to scrutinise Islam and make ACCUSATIONS.

Accusations that are based on lies and fairy tales (according to them) are FACTS are they?


THAT'S RUBBISH !!

Ex-muslims and non-muslims at first read, understand and digest the facts as statede in the Quran, Sira and the Sahih Hadiths; they then base their analysis upon close scrutiny of those facts !

What they refuse to accept is any "noble" trait in Muhammad's many atrocities, misogyny and other reprehensible deeds; from their observations, they can readily see "Allah" as being a figment of Muhammad's imagination, brought about solely to aid and assist in Muhammad's nefarious activities.

'High treason' does not come into these at all !

Muslim and proud likes to twist your words, and then make excuses up to prevent us from debating his religion. My favorite so far is that if you don't believe it you can't discuss its contents. LOL

Treason is his other excuse to justify the murder of "blasphemers". Something the west hasn't done for centuries.

Muslim and proud likes to twist your words, and then make excuses up to prevent us from debating his religion.

I haven't changed my views at all, you're just too dumb not to understand them (not surprising)

Ok, let me remind you (once again) and please note, I am quoting "your words" - without adding, twisting, amending, removing ANYTHING:

You went from:

For your answer, no I don't believe the hadiths to be factual. If I did, I'd be a muslim, now wouldn't I?

To this:

If I didn't believe Mohammed ever married a child (for example) I wouldn't call him a pedophile, would I? Aisha's narrative is very clear in the Bukhari Hadiths.

To this:

Whether it happened or not, I can't say; I'm not a historian. But millions of Muslims emulate Mohammed, so they obviously believe every word. Therein lies the problem.

To this:

I do not believe a single word of the filth is real. What I do believe is that it exists and within it Aisha married Mohammed when he was 54 and she was 6.

And finished with this:

I believe the story of Aisha exists, and yet I believe it to be a disgusting pedophilia fairy tale.

Everything quoted above is what "you" have said, word for word and it is HILARIOUS.

Perfect example of how M&P twists words to try and move the topic away from his precious, sociopathic "prophet" *snorts*

One more time for the dummy. A person DOES NOT HAVE to believe Islime and the Qur'ap, to discuss it's tenets/contents etc etc.

Perfect example of how M&P twists words to try and move the topic away from his precious, sociopathic "prophet" *snorts

Remember - they were all your quotes......

One more time for the dummy. A person DOES NOT HAVE to believe Islime and the Qur'ap, to discuss it's tenets/contents etc etc.

Ok, so you regard it to be a 'paedophilia failry tale' - is that correct? Or have you changed your mind? Please confirm......

Ex-muslims and non-muslims at first read, understand and digest the facts as statede in the Quran, Sira and the Sahih Hadiths; they then base their analysis upon close scrutiny of those facts !

What they refuse to accept is any "noble" trait in Muhammad's many atrocities, misogyny and other reprehensible deeds; from their observations, they can readily see "Allah" as being a figment of Muhammad's imagination, brought about solely to aid and assist in Muhammad's nefarious activities.

Facts?

You are now disagreeing with others who regard them to be 'fairy tales'

You ladies can't make your minds up...........

Ok, so you regard it to be a 'paedophilia failry tale' - is that correct? Or have you changed your mind? Please confirm......

Further example of Muslim and Puke's attempts to twist words and deflect topic back to others.

*yawns*

So you can't confirm.....

I thought as much.

Did you manage to find out when paedophilia was invented by any chance?

Facts?

You are now disagreeing with others who regard them to be 'fairy tales'

You ladies can't make your minds up...........

See Muslim and Puke attempt to confuse and twist some more.

Note: his only argument throughout these posts is that a non believer cannot debate the contents of the Hadiths. The rest of his posts have been his desperate attempst to deflect the topic onto others.

Note: his only argument throughout these posts is that a non believer cannot debate the contents of the Hadiths.

Feel free to provide the reference to any posts where I have those words - good luck.

So you can't confirm.....

I thought as much.

Did you manage to find out when paedophilia was invented by any chance?

Point in case. Pitiful attempts to divert topic onto others, and away from his religion that he cannot defend.

Point in case. Pitiful attempts to divert topic onto others, and away from his religion that he cannot defend.

Lol

Point in case - Your inability to answer questions, following multiple changes in belief.....

Would you like me to enlighten and refute you?

Feel free to provide the reference to any posts where I have those words - good luck.

and... more diversions.

only has to read through these posts to note how muslim and puke twists every single thing. He can't debate straight up so he has to resort to games and tactics.

(which he will demand proof of in 5...4... 3...)

Let me know when you want to be refuted - i'm waiting.

Feel free to bring up any topic you want about Islam - I have no problems with that at all.

Let me know when you want to be refuted - i'm waiting.

Feel free to bring up any topic you want about Islam - I have no problems with that at all.

Muslim and Puke is all talk. The moment you engage him he immediately turns the topic onto you. Read any of the articles here for evidence.

Would you like me to enlighten and refute you?

Something muslim and Puke has NEVER done.

Muslim and Puke is all talk. The moment you engage him he immediately turns the topic onto you. Read any of the articles here for evidence.

*yawns**yawns* and more *yawns*

Come on - bring it on.....

Let's talk about Islam - name the topic........

*yawns**yawns* and more *yawns*

Come on - bring it on.....

Let's talk about Islam - name the topic........

All talk, again, but one only need read all his posts at Islam Watch to know he's full of sh!t.

All talk, again, but one only need read all his posts at Islam Watch to know he's full of sh!t.

*yawn*

When Muslim and puke has got nothing, expect dumb as$ posts like the one below.

*yawn*

Perfect example of how M&P twists words to try and move the topic away from his precious, sociopathic "prophet"

Let's stay on the topic then. Let's talk about my beloved Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him).

Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Aisha (ra) and the kuffar regard it to be paedophilia. It is a false allegation by the kuffar.

There you go. Let's see if you can refute it. Good luck.

Let's stay on the topic then. Let's talk about my beloved Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him).

Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Aisha (ra) and the kuffar regard it to be paedophilia. It is a false allegation by the kuffar.

There you go. Let's see if you can refute it. Good luck.

Been there, done that. You did exactly what I just described ^^ in the above multiple posts. I'd be pretty stupid to think you'd respond otherwise, huh?

Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Aisha (ra) and the kuffar regard it to be paedophilia. It is a false allegation by the kuffar.

There you go. Let's see if you can refute it. Good luck.

Kuffar (nice divisive term, btw muslim and puke) have accused Mo Mo of being a pedo, so instead of refuting it himself, M&P expects me to.
My point exactly.

Lol

When you quoted me, it includes the following words:

IT IS A FALSE ALLEGATION.

Now refute it......if you can.

When you quoted me, it includes the following words:

IT IS A FALSE ALLEGATION.

Now refute it......if you can.

And again, folks, Muslim and Puke is neither willing or able to refute this "false allegation" so his tactic is to deflect onto others.

Lol

My neighbour accuses me of spitting on their car
I say "it's a false allegation"
My neighbour says I am deflecting this onto others.....

PMSL

Back to the topic. Kuffar accuse Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him_ and I am saying IT IS A FALSE ALLEGATION.

Refute it.

Lol

My neighbour accuses me of spitting on their car
I say "it's a false allegation"
My neighbour says I am deflecting this onto others.....

PMSL

Back to the topic. Kuffar accuse Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him_ and I am saying IT IS A FALSE ALLEGATION.

Refute it.

Further proof of muslim and Puke's games. A quick read of any of his posts at Islam Watch will prove he DOES NOT refute anything, but puts up continuous demands for others to. The editor has threatened to ban him for this, and yet...

Please stay on the topic.

The kuffar make accusations of paedophiliia and I am sating these allegations ARE FALSE.

Refute it.

Remember to stay on the topic.

The kuffar make accusations of paedophiliia and I am saYing these allegations ARE FALSE.

The kuffar make accusations of paedophiliia and I am saYing these allegations ARE FALSE.

^^ without any evidence to proof it.

SEE FOLKS? Muslim and Puke WONT refute anything, but will continue to demand and demand that you do.

Folks?

Lol

My neighbour accuses me of spitting on their car
I say "it is a false allegation"
My neighbour says to me "you refuse to refte anything"

PMSL

Back to the topic......

The accusation remains dfalse for now......until the neighbour.....PMSL.....decides to prove it.

My neighbour accuses me of spitting on their car
I say "it is a false allegation"
My neighbour says to me "you refuse to refte anything"
PMSL
Back to the topic......
The accusation remains dfalse for now......until the neighbour.....PMSL.....decides to prove it.

See above. Muslim and Puke uses metaphors that twist the real topic in an effort to entice others to play his games with him.

SEE FOLKS? Muslim and Puke WONT refute anything

"Folks" - check further up (25/03) to see where I have already refuted:

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Jye's - back to the topic please.

The kuffar make false allegations about paedophillia against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and I refuted the allegations yesterday - over to you.

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

As stated above, I pointed out that Muslim and Puke's ONLY argument was that if you didn't believe the hadiths you couldn't debate them. Which is a deflected argument in itself.

Thanks for proving my point, puke boy

The kuffar make false allegations about paedophillia against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and I refuted the allegations yesterday - over to you.

All Muslim and Puke has refuted is you can't debate the hadiths if you don't believe in them. See, how he twists his argument?

As stated above, I pointed out that Muslim and Puke's ONLY argument was that if you didn't believe the hadiths you couldn't debate them. Which is a deflected argument in itself.

I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with you NOT BELIEVING the Hadiths and I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with you debating them.

Back to the topic please:

The kuffar make false allegations about paedophillia against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and I refuted the allegations yesterday - over to you. Feel free to use the Hadith - feel free to debate them.

I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with you NOT BELIEVING the Hadiths and I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with you debating them.

says one thing...
But his posts clearly contradict his lies. See below.

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Back to the topic please:

I refuted the allegations yesterday. As per my quote above (and thanks for quoting), the accusations remain baseless.

Over to you.

Back to the topic please:
I refuted the allegations yesterday. As per my quote above (and thanks for quoting), the accusations remain baseless.
Over to you.

Muslim and Puke's quote speaks for itself and yet he expects you and I to believe it means something else.

"oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive..."

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Muslim and Puke refuted NOTHING. All he established is HIS OPINION that a non-beliver cannot debate the Hadtihs.

Muslim and Puke's quote speaks for itself and yet he expects you and I to believe it means something else.

Lol

Here is what you quoted:

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Once again, thanks for quoting me.

Back to the topic.

The accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) remain false AND baseless, as per my refutation yesterday.

Over to you.

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

his first reflective argument is added to by his attempts to con posters into playing his games.

I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with you NOT BELIEVING the Hadiths and I have ABSOLUTELY no problem with you debating them.

As you can see he has refuted nothing about his religion, only that a non-believer cannot debate the hadiths.

I will repeat myself:

Non-muslims can debate the Hadiths all day long for all I care.

What I have refuted is the use of Hadith to justify accusations - which you very kindly quoted for me on - thanks again.

Over to you.

Non-muslims can debate the Hadiths all day long for all I care.
What I have refuted is the use of Hadith to justify accusations - which you very kindly quoted for me on - thanks again.

^^^Muslim and puke contradicting himself. Do NOT hold your breath expecting him to realize.

Nope

No contradiction at all.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Nope
No contradiction at all.

Remember what I said about not holding your breath? He is either playing dumb or really is that dumb. Another reason nto to bother playing his games with him.

I know it's a difficult one for you.

Back to the topic please......

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

I know it's a difficult one for you.

Back to the topic please......

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Muslim and puke has stated that a non-beliver's opinions on the hadiths are baseless, and yet he continuoisly demands further debate regarding the hadiths.

Muslim and puke has stated that a non-beliver's opinions on the hadiths are baseless and yet he continuoisly demands further debate regarding the hadiths.

What I have stated is this (as per the quote you made earlier:

So, when non/ex-muslims make accusations against Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), their only justification is the detail in the Hadiths. which, as you have clarified, cannot be regarded as facts BY THEM, so the accusations, in actual fact, are baseless.

Read it slowly - it mentions justication of accusations and does not mention ANYTHING about OPINIONS.

Back to the topic:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Read it slowly - it mentions justication of accusations and does not mention ANYTHING about OPINIONS.

Back to the topic:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Muslim and puke, now demanding "OPINIONS ONLY" in a debate.

Muslim and puke, now demanding "OPINIONS ONLY" in a debate.

When did I say that?

Back to the topic:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Of the lengths of twisting and deflecting puke boy will go to?
[quoteMuslim and puke, now demanding "OPINIONS ONLY" in a debate.
When did I say that?
Back to the topic:
The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.
Over to you. ]

I know it's hard for you, but please remain on the topic. The "folks" (lol) are counting on you......

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

I know it's hard for you, but please remain on the topic. The "folks" (lol) are counting on you......

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Muslim and proud, still desperate and demanding answers, while insisting that a non-muslims accusations are baseless.

Muslim and proud, still desperate and demanding answers, while insisting that a non-muslims accusations are baseless.

Only until you (try and) prove me wrong - by sticking to the topic.

Back to the topic:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Muslim and puke's other tactic when he's got nothing, is to mock the posts of others.

Muslim and puke's other tactic when he's got nothing, is to mock the posts of others.

*yawns*

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Only until you (try and) prove me wrong - by sticking to the topic.

Muslim and puke cannot prove anything and yet CONTINUOUSLY demands answers from others, while insisting their accusations are already baseless.

Muslim and puke cannot prove anything and yet CONTINUOUSLY demands answers from others, while insisting their accusations are already baseless.

*yawns*

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

more mocking, more demands... which is puke's tactic to never answer himself.

more mocking, more demands... which is puke's tactic to never answer himself.

Answers were provided yesterday, hence my demand for you to prove otherwise / refute what I said.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Answers were provided yesterday, hence my demand for you to prove otherwise / refute what I said.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

TWIST and shout...
Puke hasn't given ANY answers. Prove he twists, and manipulates.

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Note this line identically repeated. Puke copies and pastes continuously, to demand.
Puke is getting desperate.

Puke hasn't given ANY answers. Prove he twists, and manipulates.

LOL PMSL

How many questions have you asked exactly during your refutation?????

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.
Puke's tactic to copy and paste repeatedly to harrass. LOL

Puke's tactic to copy and paste repeatedly to harrass. LOL

Jye's inabilty to stick to the topic and have the courage to actually stand by what he and the kuffars say. LOL

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Jye's inabilty to stick to the topic and have the courage to actually stand by what he and the kuffars say. LOL

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Puke changing tactic (while copying and pasting)and now imitating my posts. Imitation is a compliment, puke boy, but be original, yes?

Puke changing tactic (while copying and pasting)and now imitating my posts. Imitation is a compliment, puke boy, but be original, yes?

Still not able to stick to the topic - still does not have the courage to stand by what he and the kuffars say......LOL

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

As you can see, fellow kuffar, Puke will continue to copy and paste in an attempt to demand answers.
Note: Puke has NEVER REFUTED A SINGLE FACT. Reading his posts at this web site will prove it. He lies, twists. deflects and manipulates.

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Puke's answers are to continue his desperate copy and pasting

Note: Puke has NEVER REFUTED A SINGLE FACT. Reading his posts at this web site will prove it. He lies, twists. deflects and manipulates.

Note: Which "facts"? LOL LOL LOL. I thought you "believed in paedophillia fairy tales" LOL LOL

Jye's is still totally incapable of staying on the topic........LOL

Back to the topic please:

As you can see Kuffars, the accusations remain false until Jye's can prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to Jye's

Still not able to stick to the topic - still does not have the courage to stand by what he and the kuffars say......LOL

Puke, thinking he can entice people with insults, into playing his Muslim games

Puke, thinking he can entice people with insults, into playing his Muslim games

As you can see kuffars, Jye's has yet to come back with anything relevant.......

Back to the topic please:

As you can see Kuffars, the accusations remain false until Jye's can prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to Jye's

Note: Which "facts"? LOL LOL LOL. I thought you "believed in paedophillia fairy tales" LOL LOL

Jye's is still totally incapable of staying on the topic........LOL

Back to the topic please:

As you can see Kuffars, the accusations remain false until Jye's can prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to Jye's

TWIST and shout...

As you can see Kuffars, the accusations remain false until Jye's can prove otherwise........good luck.

Puke's new copy and paste

TWIST and shout...

Kuffars - your fellow kafir Jye's does not have what it takes to either prove me wrong, or indeed to prove himself right!!!

Back to the topic please:

As you can see Kuffars, the accusations remain false until Jye's can prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to Jye's

Kuffars - your fellow kafir Jye's does not have what it takes to either prove me wrong, or indeed to prove himself right!!!

Back to the topic please:

As you can see Kuffars, the accusations remain false until Jye's can prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to Jye's

Puke, pretending he wants a debate when his posts at Islam Watch prove that all he does is weasel and deflect. Twist and shout... Twist and shout.

Puke, pretending he wants a debate when his posts at Islam Watch prove that all he does is weasel and deflect. Twist and shout... Twist and shout.

*yawns*

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

*yawns*

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

When puke has nothing, he copy and pastes. Note the amount of times he's done this.

When puke has nothing, he copy and pastes. Note the amount of times he's done this.

Thank you for confirming - LMAO & PMSL. You have provided NOTHING - DIDDLY SQUAT - that is relevant in terms of a response.......hence.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

Thank you for confirming - LMAO & PMSL. You have provided NOTHING - DIDDLY SQUAT - that is relevant in terms of a response.......hence.
Back to the topic please:
The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.
Over to you.

Puke continues to believe that he's somehow going to force me into his little games. LOL.
Puke has NEVER refuted any of the articles posted on Islam watch, instead he spends his time demanding answers from others.

Puke has NEVER refuted any of the articles posted on Islam watch

Puke hasn't...............but PROUD has. Please refer to this article:

http://www.islam-watch.org/ind...&Itemid=58

My post on the 18th of Feb.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Over to you.

http://www.islam-watch.org/ind...&Itemid=58

Muslim and puke copies and pastes (something he does when he's got nothing) and then continues to play his little muslim games of deflection, until the editor calls him on it. See below.

You may think playing word games makes your case stronger and prove you intelligent. It may prove the opposite of what you think. Islam is known to make some people zombies to the extent of turning them suicidal, and you are no different, but in a different sense.

MUSLIM AND PUKE HAS JUST PROVEN MY POINT ON WHY NOT TO HAVE A DEBATE WITH HIM. LOL!

puke, you're a game player. I don't want to play your games, I have however had lots of fun f*cking with you, and laughing at your persitence to control me. But I'm bored.
Nighty night, puke. Be sure to insult me with your copy and pasting when I'm gone.
haha

Puke has NEVER refuted any of the articles posted on Islam watch, instead he spends his time demanding answers from others.

Evidence has been provided. The editor calling me on something has absolutely diddly squat to do with your incapability to stick to the topic and stand by the accusations.

Back to the topic please:

The accusations remain false and the "folks" (lol) are waiting for you to prove otherwise........good luck.

Prove what? Pew Research poll reveals that more than 3/4 of Musim respondants in Pakistan, Egypt, and Jordan support the death penalty for people who leave Islam. So they understood this piece of shit religion called Islam wrong? HAHA your allah is so miserable.

I am s... (Its better not to say my name) from Turkey an ex-muslim.

Statements given in the Quran, Sahih Hadiths and the Sira are facts, certainly for muslims.

That the actualities of these facts are misguided, erroneous and inhumane is another matter. What ex-muslims and non-muslims do is to dissect and examine these facts from the 3 principal sources of Islamic history and arrive at conclusions which would make sense to any normal human being. Unfortunately, muslims would not and cannot do this, as their cardinal rules are: (1) What Muhammad and his alter ego "Allah" say and do MUST be right, and (2) they HAVE to emulate Muhammad's actions, no matter how patently inhumane, unjust and cruel they are.

It is time now for muslims to examine and re-examine each and every sentence in the Quran, the Sahih Hadiths and the Sira -- we know they (muslims) have not used their brains in this respect for the last 1450 years, but NOW IS THE TIME TO DO IT, MAKE A START WITH THIS INTUITIVE PROCESS !

If anyone (muslim or not) reads the Quran, the Sahih Hadiths and the Sira with an open mind and uses their in-built thinking faculty, THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT PERSON, IF S/HE IS A MUSLIM, WOULD COME OUT OF ISLAM ! IN CASE OF A NON-MUSLIM, S/HE WOULD COME TO KNOW THE REAL IMPORT OF ISLAM !

Of course, additionally reading Dr Ali Sina's book "Muhammad & Muslims -- A Psychobiography, 5th edition" would buttress and reinforce that process !

Been there done that and it did nothing for me!
One thing you phobes and ex Muslims will never understand!
Islam by itself is nothing and that's where the potential apostates live. They flip back and forth. No reason no spirituality.
With Islam you need iman. Once you have that then things make sense.
Once you have that and achieve ihsan then you are bulletproof baby!!!

Does Islam have any reason or spirituality? Either a deluded schizophrenic or a criminal in the garb of prophet can hear message from Allah. Islamic spirituality is fiendish one where cutting the throats of infidels and Murtad forms an integral part. I respect Allah, but that is pre-Islamic one. Koran can not be message from a beneficent, merciful God.

I have 'iman' on the above facts. So, Islam is fit to be shit upon. If you are a criminal, iman on Islam and ihsan can really help you in your goal, I admit.

in Islam. So-called spirituality consists of:

Muwalat, which is maintaining continuity during "prayers", by reciting various ritual mantras (such as Ruku, two Sajdah and tashahhud) in continuous succession, and reciting the Zikr, etc. also in usual succession. For example, if an undue interval occurs between different acts until it becomes difficult to visualise that one is chanting, than the ritual mantra will be void. And the pious little Muslim gets no browny points due to BAD performance.

There is nothing spiritual in Islamic prayers. Muhammad designed Islamic prayers and their timings not for spiritual purposes but for ensuring his personal protection and security from likely attacks by his victims:

Narrated Abu Uthman: I was a guest of Abu Huraira for seven days. Abu Huraira, his wife and his slave used to get up and remain awake for one-third of the night by turn. Each would offer the night prayer and then awaken the other. (Bukhari 7:352).

The purpose, definitely, was to keep his followers, mostly the slaves, awake throughout the night in case of a night-attack. The night prayer, the Tahajut prayer or nightshift of security gaurds, was nothing but a defense strategy to ensure Muhammad’s own protection and security. This hadith alone is sufficient to understand the vacuousness of spirituality of Islamic prayers.

There isn't even a tiny bit of spirituality in Muhammad's cult. Every action of his was designed for his own benefit, to attain his goals and satisfy his lusts and desires. He even incorporated 99 different names for his God (among them: Ar-Rahman/Ar-Raheem, the name of a Yemeni idol-Go; Al-Malik, the fire god of the Babylonians; and Al-Quddus, the Canaanite fertily goddess) in order to keep his new recruits happy but including their gods in his pantheon. He got vast portions of his ideas from previous sources which he then embedded it his Quran. He even plagiarized the doctrine of paradise (Jannat Al-Firdous) and the concept of angels from the Zorastrians.

rzq, I'm still waiting to hear from you on the meanings of the following:
Muawasat??? and Mudarat??? And Ruku, Sajdah, tashahhud, and the Zikr???
And if Mu`amalaat does not involve more din/rules that deal with man's interaction with creation in general in order to profit oneself - mainly with halal financial transactions and paying the zakat tax - then what is it?

My post keeps getting eaten up by the gaffer!
Here is the link. Enjoy your read.

http://www.muftisays.com/blog/Seifeddine-M/2195_09-11-2011/surah-aal-'imran,-28.30.html

With each post I see clearly you have never studied the Quran, if you did you would see the nonsense in what you state as rules for prayer. According the Quran:

2:43: "Pray! Do what is best and bow or kneel along with others who do the same."

We have an example of prayer with Mary 3:43: " Mary! Obey the Lord. Worship Him and bow, or kneel down, before Him with those who do the same."



5:55: "Your real supporters are God, His messenger(s) and His loyalists. His loyalists keep to prayer, doing what best, as they bow, or kneel down."



22:77: "God's loyalists! Kneel (Arka' oo), bow down in worship (Usjudoo), devote yourselves (U' budoo) to your Lord, and do good so you can have success".



48:29: "Muhammad is God's messenger and God's message is commendable. Those who are on the side of the messenger and his message will have strength when it comes to those who show no loyalty to the messenger and his message. They show mercy to one another, and Muhammad, you will see them kneeling and bowing down in worship, asking for God's grace and approval. The signs of their worship show on their faces, and that is how they are referred to in Moses' teachings and in the teachings of Jesus . . ."

Not excepting Hadeeth and Sirah as guide to Muslims as well as Quran as it actually is…… is not an excuse to say Yibel talking non sense..

That is YOU who does not believe in Hadeeth among only few in the big scale of things … the other 99 % of Muslim in fact believe AND FALLOW Hadeeth and Sirah side by side to Quran.

I have come from a city of 8 million of people ….the majority are Muslims and ALL believe in three teachings of Q/H/S as equal in every aspect of their lives … I have talked with many on that very same subject … and not believe in Hadeeth is Haram and rejected to a conduct of any Muslim.

So … you Malam please do not come to a Christian who is only dissecting Q/H/S as it is written provided by Muslims, …. providing in concrete proves out od Q/H/S

Why don't you Go and talk to the Muslim themselves for fallowness the wrong Islam.

You have done a small mischief in the translation of the above verses of quran. Quran's pay zaqat is your do what is best. Is both the same?

According to Q 22:77, God's loyalists only will have success. God's loyalists i.e. muslims have been praying five times a day for the last 1400 years, instead of the mandatory three according to quran as pointed out by you. Could you please list out the success of muslims achieved during the last 1400 years, particularly in the past 200 years? Even today, only one fifth of the world population have become loyalists. Is it a success? In the last 200 years muslims have not won even a single war. Is it a success? Of course, some turmoil ridden, strife torn, chaotic, under developed Islamic countries are there. Is it the success? If any of these are not success, which success Allah is alluding to? Why Allah is not ensuring the success of muslims in whatever they do? Nowadays Allah seems to help and support the infidels only. Why? Is it proper for Allah to swallow his own promises and do just the opposite?

In Quran 48:29, Allah again promises strength for muslims (that means only weakness and defeats for non- muslims) and declares that the people who follow Muhammed will show mercy to one another. Is it the mercy that we see in Islamic countries today - sunni slitting shia's throat and shia killing sunni wantonly and both together lynching the other sects? What other mercy can we see at work in these hell- hole of barbarian countries?

Please explain.

I meant to say …* not accepting *… ..not … * not excepting*

sorry

written by Rzq, March 26, 2012
Been there done that and it did nothing for me!
One thing you phobes and ex Muslims will never understand!
Islam by itself is nothing and that's where the potential apostates live. They flip back and forth. No reason no spirituality.
With Islam you need iman. Once you have that then things make sense.
Once you have that and achieve ihsan then you are bulletproof baby!!!

One thing you Islamists will never understand is that without rational and logical justification, there cannot be any "imaan" !

For example, no rational person will ever accept Muhammad's behaviour on the following counts:

(1) Marrying a kid of 6 when he was 53 and sleeping with her at 9 !

(2) To slaughter the husband, father, brothers and tribesmen of an 18 year old Jewess and screwing her the the same night !

(3) To attack and kill an entire Jewish tribe when they are unprepared for war, resting and watering their animals.

(4) To behead between 600 and 900 Jewish men, after they had surrendered !
[ Boy, the infidel Indian Army treated 93,000 defeated & surrendered muslim Pakis much
better !]

(5) To change Arabia by mayhem and slaughter from a relatively peaceful multicultural society to one inhabited by his own followers.

(6) To order the murder of anyone who had been critical of his mission.

(7) To continuously enhance his own harem with wives and sex-slaves, when no more than 4 wives are allowed for all other muslim men.

(8) To view anyone who disagreed with his views in the Quran as an enemy, entitled to be killed.

Some "insaan-e-kaamil" was this man !

Do you detect any "spirituality" in any of the above ?

.......... I could go on and on, but hope you realize the point has been made.

Let's just look at one of your points to highlight your bias.

Number 4.

You have only provided part of the detail - please provide full detail.

quote:

written by Rzq , March 26, 2012

Been there done that and it did nothing for me!
One thing you phobes and ex Muslims will never understand!
Islam by itself is nothing and that's where the potential apostates live. They flip back and forth. No reason no spirituality.
With Islam you need iman. Once you have that then things make sense.
Once you have that and achieve ihsan then you are bulletproof baby!!!

quote End]

Well,
Where does the quooraan say that after the death of MuuHAMmel the faithful needs any Imam i.e. another HUMAN who will “explain” the “clear book” to the faithful? How can we know that the Imam is not lying and twisting the quooraan? Case in point Osama bin Laden, here in the West (f.e. Germany Switzerland and Austria) most Muslims claim that OBL ABUSES the teachings of the quooraan. And yet in some Islamic countries they mourned the death of OBL as a great loss to the islamc world. Again why trust a human who can NOT claim that a Angel comes to him to “clarify” the meaning in the book anybody else can read, even if it is translated correctly. You see if OBL was not twisting the quooran, (his being the CORRECT meaning/guidance) we Unbelievers could be in deep trouble and ALL Muslims who WANTED to do so could follow his example and wage war against us, including killing us at their leisure.

I have read the qur'an, many times in fact, and some of it is really good for a laugh! That is, if one can get past the horrible hellfire and damnation stuff and all the "boy am I mister wonderful, obey me or else my little tin god is going to get you if Me and My boys don't get you first- Chop, Chop, Chop!! My little tin god is blood thirsty - Umm, Umm!!!"

How anyone can stomach this god awful nonsense is beyond me!

But, since you say you know so much about Islam, then perhaps YOU can explain the following:
Muawasat??? Mudarat??? Ruku, Sajdah, tashahhud, and the Zikr???
And if Mu`amalaat does not involve more din/rules that deal with man's interaction with creation in general in order to profit oneself - mainly with halal financial transactions and paying the zakat tax - then what is it?

BTW - I found the definitions of Mu'amalaat and Muwalat on an Islamic website - islamic-laws.com - but the other words were not listed there.

I've asked rzq several times (since he's the one who brought up these words) but he apparently doesn't know since all he does is give me iffy web sites to go to.

So, how about it? Strut your stuff and enlighten me. Inquiring minds want to know.

written by Muslim and proud, March 27, 2012
Let's just look at one of your points to highlight your bias.
Number 4.
You have only provided part of the detail - please provide full detail.

M&P, why do become semantic and ask for details, references, etc. of happenings about which the whole world knows ? Looks like you are missing the wood for the trees !

Full details are given in http://answering-islam.org/Aut...a_jews.htm

The moot point here is the "insaan-e-kaamil" did not show any mercy, when he could have done so ! If he had done so, he would have come out at least higher than the infidel Indian Army of 1972 ! He thus ranks much, much below other lumanairies such as Jesus, Buddha, Cyrus the Great, etc.

Remember, Jesus had saved a woman from certain death by stoning by the Jews uttering a single sentence !

Muhammad's creation "Allah" seems to celebrate this slaughter and enslavement in Sura 33:25-27:

25 Allah turned back the unbelievers [Meccans and their allies] in a state of rage, having not won any good, and Allah spared the believers battle [q-t-l]. Allah is, indeed, Strong and Mighty. 26 And He brought those of the People of the Book [Qurayza] who supported them from their fortresses and cast terror into their hearts, some of them you slew [q-t-l] and some you took captive.
27 And he bequeathed to you their lands, their homes and their possessions, together with land you have never trodden. Allah has power over everything. (Majid Fakhry, An Interpretation of the Qur’an, NYUP, 2004; insertions are mine)
....... contd.

Reviewing the above, M&P, tell me

IS THERE ANY "SPIRITUALITY", ANY "SAINTLINESS" IN HERE ?

THIS IS JUST ONE EXAMPLE OF MO'S INHUMANITY, THERE ARE MANY OTHERS !

CAN ANY SANE PERSON IMITATE SUCH A CHARACTER ?

WILL ANYONE HAVE ANY "IMAAN" IN A BELIEF ESPOUSED BY THIS MAN ?

M&P, why do become semantic and ask for details, references, etc. of happenings about which the whole world knows ? Looks like you are missing the wood for the trees !

I think it's more about what people CHOOSE to believe.

The link you posted includes references to Ibn Ishaqs biography. Well it's interesting to see that the following details are not included in the link you posted:

Ibn Ishaq - Sirat Rasul Allah - Page 82:
"A Jew approached and began to walk round the fort. Now, the Banu Qurayza Jews had broken their treaty with the apostle of Allah, and their fort was to the rear of ours. There was no one to protect our side of the city, and the apostle of Allah was occupied with the invaders and unable to come to our aid. Accordingly, I said, "0 Hassan! A Jew is walking round the fort, and by Allah! I am not convinced that he will not report our weak position to the Jews in our rear. The apostle is fully engaged; go thou therefore to the man and kill him.� He replied, "May Allah pardon thee! Thou knowest full well that this is not a task for me." When I saw that he would do nothing, I girded.

So the Jews broke the peace treaty.

Ibn Ishaq - Sirat Rasul Allah - Page 84:
"In the morning the Qurayza came down from their fort to surrender to the apostle of Allah, and the Aus begged that - as the apostle had dealt leniently with allies of the Khazraj - he would do the same for the allies of the Aus. The apostle said, 'Would you like one of your own people to decide their fate' and they welcomed it.

So despite breaking the peace treaty, the Jews "begged" for leniency. Please note here that the allies of Khazraj had been dealt with leniently - a jew is confirmiong this. The jews welcomed the decision for one of their own people to decide their fate. The fate was decided using the Old Testament - quite rightly as the Jews believe this to be the unaltered word of God.

20:12 And if it will make no peace with thee, but will make war against thee, then thou shalt besiege it: 20:13 And when the LORD thy God hath delivered it into thine hands, thou shalt smite every male thereof with the edge of the sword: 20:14 But the women, and the little ones, and the cattle, and all that is in the city, even all the spoil thereof, shalt thou take unto thyself; and thou shalt eat the spoil of thine enemies, which the LORD thy God hath given thee.

What we believe to be Justice, you call massacre..........total ignorance on your part.

Jewish professor " Israel Wilfinson", in his book:" The Jews' History In the Arab World", page 123 says:

"The thing that causes pain to any believer either he is a Jew or a Muslim is that conversation held between some Jews and the polytheists of Quraish, where those Jews preferred Quraish's religion on that of the leader of the ISLAMIC MESSAGE."

Then he says: "Normally wars allow nations to use all means of ruses, lies, tricks and misinforming to defeat the enemies, but those Jews had no right to get involved in such a raffish mistake, and never announce in front of Quraish's leaders that their religion "in worshipping status" is better than the ISLAMIC UNIFICATION. Because the Jews were holding the banner of MONOTHEISM in the world for centuries against polytheism in the name of their old fathers.

By checking each and every young male, to make sure Puberty had not started, was absolute JUSTICE to make sure.

Once again, check the Jewish law regarding when a child is no longer a child - I think you will find it's with the onset of puberty.

Justice was delivered - it'a an absolute fact.

In reply to your accounts above M&P, I can only repeat what I have written above:

The moot point here is the "insaan-e-kaamil" did not show any mercy, when he could have done so !

If he had done so, he would have come out at least higher than the infidel Indian Army of 1972 !
He thus ranks much, much below such luminaries as Jesus, Buddha, Cyrus the Great, etc.

Remember, Jesus had saved a woman from certain death by stoning by the Jews uttering a single sentence !


IS THERE ANY "SPIRITUALITY", ANY "SAINTLINESS" DISPLAYED HERE BY MO ?

THIS IS JUST ONE EXAMPLE OF MO'S INHUMANITY, THERE ARE MANY OTHERS !

CAN ANY SANE PERSON IMITATE SUCH A CHARACTER ?

WILL ANYONE HAVE ANY "IMAAN" IN A BELIEF ESPOUSED BY THIS MAN ?

In reply to your accounts above M&P, I can only repeat what I have written above:

You can't refute what I said so you are therefore repeating what you said previously:

The moot point here is the "insaan-e-kaamil" did not show any mercy, when he could have done so !

The Jews begged for leniency. They were offered the opportunity for one of their own to determine the punishment. They accepted..........

The moot point is that is was NOT A MASSACRE as the ignorant people claim.

If he had done so, he would have come out at least higher than the infidel Indian Army of 1972 !
He thus ranks much, much below such luminaries as Jesus, Buddha, Cyrus the Great, etc.

Your opinion.......nothing more, nothing less.

CAN ANY SANE PERSON IMITATE SUCH A CHARACTER ?

Absolutely. In this day and age, if the same incident took place and the non-muslims were given the same opportunity, chances are they would get off with a slap on the wrist based on THEIR LAW. It's the principle that would be emulated Srutator - your ignorance seems to think that the outcome MUST be the same.....

WILL ANYONE HAVE ANY "IMAAN" IN A BELIEF ESPOUSED BY THIS MAN ?

c1.6 billion and counting......

written by Muslim and proud , March 28, 2012

By checking each and every young male, to make sure Puberty had not started, was absolute JUSTICE to make sure.

Quote End ]

Should the Test not have been IF THESE 7 to 900 people were individually guilty of “breaking the treaty”? Your “trusted” hadith does not speak about the Jews “preparing to attack” or ACTUALLY attacking the fort, ONLY THE fear of Muslims being open IN case they would attack. So the killing of the Jews was just TO PREVENT them, if they would do so!

Why kill people who do not pose a danger? There is a German word for this: “SIPPENHAFT" look it up! Hundreds of people were deemed guilty for the decision of maybe a few “leaders”. So you have no PROBLEM in the killing of people whom you do not know they were IN FACT GUILTY OF breaking a treaty! They belonged to the a tribe whose leader are being accused of it, since the Jews can NOT tell anymore their story, I doubt this whole scenario seriously. Can you bring forward any evidence that EACH AND EVERY of them young boys and man who were killed were guilty of breaking a treaty? All you have is a Hadith claiming that Muslims “feared” anything will happen. Must be one of these Hadiths you deem “trustworthy” and reliable.

If one kills YOU “Proud Muslim” because one could FEAR you as a “PROUD" Muslim could repeat something like the Murder of Toulouse will you see this a “justice”? NO of course not! But killing people of whom the profeet had no real KNOWLEDGE only a unspecified FEAR what they would do, is JUSTICE? And then we UNBELIEVERS are accused of phobias......

Should the Test not have been IF THESE 7 to 900 people were individually guilty of “breaking the treaty”? Your “trusted” hadith does not speak about the Jews “preparing to attack” or ACTUALLY attacking the fort, ONLY THE fear of Muslims being open IN case they would attack. So the killing of the Jews was just TO PREVENT them, if they would do so!

The Jews broke the treaty. They were punished according to their own law. Period.

If one kills YOU “Proud Muslim” because one could FEAR you as a “PROUD" Muslim could repeat something like the Murder of Toulouse will you see this a “justice”? NO of course not! But killing people of whom the profeet had no real KNOWLEDGE only a unspecified FEAR what they would do, is JUSTICE? And then we UNBELIEVERS are accused of phobias......

If I break the law in such a way then I would be punished accordingly.

@ proud Muslim (proud of what? of stoned-gawd allah)

Where does it say if one breaks a treaty people who have nothing to do with this automatically are also guilty? “Sippenhaft” describes the mode of operation here very precise. Because you are a “proud Muslim” I shall from now on hold you PERSONALLY responsible for ANY crime another Muslim commits. Even if you are not involved in it, you are also guilty, because this seems to be the approach YOU are using here. You have no problem applying this to the “Jews”. Some unspecified number of leaders of the Tribe decided to break the treaty if INDEED THERE WAS ONE, again the Jews are unable to TELL US their side of the story, since they were butchered. Besides if a potential foe could be weakened, then the profeet would have a easer task later on...

You have no proof that 7 to 900 people are guilty of any crime. It does NOT matter what "rites or customs" the Jewish religion used to determine the age of child or young adult. THIS is NOT THE point. The point is out of FEAR that the Jews could wage a war or side with his enemies your stoned-gawd allah's messenger deemed it justified to kill these people.
Your profeet was commanding the murder of innocent people out of fear they would turn against him. Case closed for me.

OK I'd like to see the reaction of Muslims the world over if one would start killing them out of FEAR (with no proof that they PREPARED A CRIME) that any of them could kill some-one. But you have no problem in defending a sick man, ordering the killing of people who he declared to be his enemies.

Tashahhud is just one of the parts of prayer at the point when you are kneeling and facing the focal point or qibla. Ruku is also a position in Prayer.it can also mean the sections to which Surahs are divided.etc.. so being you dont believe in Islam, you probably have no use for those terms, than why ask?

@ proud Muslim

this is how your Quote
Tabari VIII:22
Ishaq:458



goes on:

I girded myself, took a club, and, having gone down from the fortress to the man, I struck him with the club until I killed him. When I had finished with him, I returned to the fortress and said, 'Hassan, go down to him and strip him - only his being a man kept me from taking his clothes.' Hassan replied, 'I have no need for his spoils.'"

Quote End]

So this Jewish spy (if he was one) could not “reveal the weakness of the Muslims” because he was killed, before he could even get back to his tribe.

Ishaq:464"The Jews were made to come down, and Allah's Messenger imprisoned them. Then the Prophet went out into the marketplace of Medina, and he had trenches dug in it. He sent for the Jewish men and had them beheaded in those trenches. They were brought out to him in batches. They numbered 800 to 900 boys and men."

Quote End]

Then you leave out another important point: These “Jews” were “killed” after Mohammad “besieged” them for over 3 weeks (25 days) AFTER they surrendered.

Again if this quote is correct than the Jews were FIRST IMPRISONED and posed no longer a threat to MuuHAMmel, so there was not justification to kill them. Of course there was no Geneva “prisoners of war convention” in place so the profeet could order the killing the IMPRISONED Jews...

As to your quote from Deuteronomy:

20:12 And if it will make no peace with thee, but will make war against thee, then thou shalt besiege it:

this is not meant to use AGAINST the Jews, but at their foe. Funny thing is (here comes the issue of Sippenhaft I use against you from now on) Muslims often claim that the OLD Testament was “corrupted”. Looks to me that this portion was not one of them....