Honour killings in Europe Why?

by Parvin Kaboli

27 Sep, 2007

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Name:
Comment:

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Name: vbv
Date: Wednesday September 26, 2007
Time: 23:39:33 -0700

Comment

Honour killing? Whose honour and whose life? Islam is a barbaric religion which treats women as one's private property and women are just objects of sexual gratification of men. They (women) do not have an iota of self respect as a human-being. In islam women are sub-human species to be totally under the tyranical grip of men to do their biddings unquestioningly and in abject slavery! The men can dump them at will by merely pronouncing the triple talaq !No rights are given to women and they cannot but live in absolute fear of men in abject surrender! Can you call this kind of culture civilized or sane? It is the most retarded,worse than primitive , and the most barbaric creed that ever existed in human civilisation! May islam be eradicated from the face of this Earth!!!

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Name: Honor Killing is Not Islamic
Date: Thursday September 27, 2007
Time: 01:34:57 -0700

Comment

From the perspective of Qur’an, prophetic traditions, and law, sex outside of a legally binding tie is considered zina, and is punishable for both women and men. Though there is a double standard in that men are, under certain circumstances, permitted to have several lawful sexual partners while women must always remain monogamous, when it comes to punishment for illicit intercourse men and women are treated exactly alike. In this sense, the traditional framework for dealing with illicit sexual behavior is balanced – unlike in the case of honor killings for actual or suspected sexual misconduct, in which only women are targets. Still, while honor killings find no sanction whatsoever in Qur’an, prophetic traditions, or law, these sources cannot be absolved of all responsibility for placing a greater share of the burden of maintaining societal chastity on women. Though the Qur’an commands both men (24.30) and women (24.31) to “cast down their gazes” and to “protect their chastity,” it specifically regulates only women’s dress (Q. 24.31; 33.59). Yet it is a long stretch from these commands, which have the declared intention of protecting women from harassment (Q. 33.59), to the legal rules that allow men, especially husbands, to impose seclusion on women, forbid them from leaving the home, and limit their access even to other relatives. These rules for seclusion were never strictly observed by more than an elite minority, and are not generally enforced today. But the basic perspective they embody – that the separation of men and women is to be enforced by keeping women apart from men, and that women who violate these boundaries are suspect – remains influential.

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Name: why muslims want to control sexuality of woman ???
Date: Thursday September 27, 2007
Time: 05:52:34 -0700

Comment

islam claim it give equality to woman. why do muslims want to control sexuality of woman ???? man want 4 wife and unlimited number of right hand possessions [ sex slaves ] on earth and 72 hot sex houries with big pointed breasts etc...in jannat. but woman hv only 1 man at a time and if they go to jannat only 1 husband. why muslim men want to control sexualy and vagina of woman it emans only 1 thing : muslim men r sex crazed beasts not worthy of woman to let them touch her body.

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Name: men are not punished
Date: Thursday September 27, 2007
Time: 06:29:12 -0700

Comment

I just read the second comment about men and women being treated euqally when they break the law on sexual conduct in islam. I couldn't finish it because it's so totally wrong. When was the last time anyone heard of a MAN being stoned? Or killed because he raped a woman or had sex outside of marriage? No, the men in this part of the world and religion are pretty much "free" to do what they want and will towards women in their family. And if a woman is raped, SHE is the one that is condemned instead of the man because she didn't die during the attack, there by bringing shame and dishonour to her family. When it's the man's shame and dishonour that he did the deed, but is not punished for it.

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Name: Philip Saenz
Date: Friday September 28, 2007
Time: 08:15:46 -0700

Comment

If honor killing doesn't stem from the religion of Islam, then, why is it that mostly all honor killings are within the religion of Islam??? How many honor killings do you see in the Christian religion? Exactly none!! How many honor killings do you see in the Jewish religion? Exactly none!! We must destroy the evil ideology of Islam before the Islamists destroy others. And the best way to destroy the horrible ideology of Islam is to destroy the evil philosophy of the false prophet Muhammad.

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Name: Marie
Date: Friday September 28, 2007
Time: 08:52:26 -0700

Comment

Honor killing is not Islamic, your commentary needs correction. The seclusion of women goes on in many Muslim countries and only a few countries do not follow these rules. These rules were created by a madman who could not control his hormones and had a very warped ideas about infidelity and morality. So he made mandatory for women to cover themselves, in order not to sexual arouse men who could not maintain decency and respect towards women. These rules are the reason why nonmuslim women are raped by Muslim men, because in the view of Islam if the women are not covered from head to toe, then men could do anything they want to do. Islam also demands that women are to be totally obedient and submit to the authority of their husbands, fathers, brothers, and other male relatives. In the Islamic culture women who do not adhere to the men in their lives are challenging their authority and honor. Muslim men in order to keep their honor resort to the so-called honor killings. Honor killings is about men maintaining their so-called honor, that is to get rid of their disobedient women who will not submit to their authority.

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Name: allat
Date: Friday September 28, 2007
Time: 10:31:53 -0700

Comment

Yes, there is ABSOLUTELY no compability betw the West and the Arab culture/islam. We - in the West - have advanced by stages into respect for human life and the Rights of Mankind. It has taken us CENTURIES to get to this point - It's been a long hard struggle - from the 1st recorded failures of the Helots of Greece and Spartacus (how many other slave revolts went unrecorded) - to the Peasant's Revolt (how many other peasan revolts went unrecorded?) to the Negro Civil Rights Act of 1961? Do we need to retrograde to accommodate the insidious islamics? Allat-Polytheist Pagan

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Name: allat
Date: Friday September 28, 2007
Time: 10:33:12 -0700

Comment

Oops. I meant to say "incompatibility" in my previous msg.

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Name: Feyi
Date: Sunday September 30, 2007
Time: 12:23:47 -0700

Comment

I'm thinking of converting to Islam,but as of right now if this is going to the definition of My life as a Muslim, I don't think so. I value my freedom.

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Name: Nowonmai
Date: Sunday September 30, 2007
Time: 18:53:36 -0700

Comment

The reason for the violence against women, the 'honor' killings and the treating women like subhuman is because weak men want their women weaker, so the men don't appear as weak as they truly are. Fear is a great weapon for weak men. All the women in the above article were strong women, who knew who they were and what they wanted in life. In Islam, strong women not to be tolerated. How dare they forget their places in a weak mans' fantasy world.

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Name: Jen
Date: Thursday October 04, 2007
Time: 17:44:59 -0700

Comment

"Honor killing is not Islamic, your commentary needs correction." -Marie Let's see if Marie's comment holds water: "Pakistan, where "honour" killings are known as karo-kari, is probably the country where such atrocities are most pervasive." "n Jordan, "honour" killings are sanctioned by law. According to Article 340 of the criminal code, "A husband or a close blood relative who kills a woman caught in a situation highly suspicious of adultery will be totally exempt from sentence."" ""Honour" killings are also regularly reported in the Palestinian territories of the West Bank and Gaza Strip." ""Honour" killings of women (and occasionally their male "partners in crime") reflect longstanding patriarchal-tribal traditions." I think "tribal" may be the key word. 'Reputation is Everything': Honor Killing among the Palestinians of a woman brings shame to the family--through allegations of premarital or extramarital sex, by refusing an arranged marriage, or attempting to obtain a divorce--her male relatives are bound by duty and culture to murder her. " "The family plays a role in every aspect of life in the Arab world,"" I think it's pretty clear that 'honor killings' are the mandate of Islam and the Arab world!

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Name: ExMuslim
Date: Thursday October 04, 2007
Time: 20:32:04 -0700

Comment

Jen, Honour killing is not Islamic but tribal. Because it brings shame to the tribe, family. But such shame exist almost solely among Muslims.

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Name: George M Weinert V
Date: Sunday October 07, 2007
Time: 14:49:22 -0700

Comment

The Terror is all over - we even have them here in CHicago at De Paul University: Thursday, June 14, 2007 De Paul University Terror Exposed By George M Weinert V De Paul University School of Music, 1976 http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DEPAULUNIVERSITYJIHAD/ The Denial of Tenure for Professor Norman Finklestein has ignited a firestorm in the Windy City – the Gay Cabal at Chicago Public Radio [1] is in a real tizzy and this life long Blue Demon has been banned by the DE PAUL Community at Orkut [2] simply for telling the truth – wonderful! This is what got me banned by De Paul University's Islamofascists and their pusillanimous sycophants: I'm glad to hear that my alma mater has finally rid itself of at least some of the politically correct insanity that has infested this great bastion of learning in recent years Since De Paul first came to national attention with the Islamofascist persecution of Adjunct Professor Thomas Klocek and the thuggery of homosexual Palestinian punks [3] we've been after De Paul's Muslims and Terrorist ass kissers with a vengeance! I've quietly spoken with many De Paul Students at the Lincoln Park Campus and alerted as many influential alumni as possible so it's great to see De Paul University faculty coming back to their senses by denying Tenure to Self-Loathing Jew Norman Finklestein. Academic Frauds and Terrorists in training have no place at the nation's Number One Catholic University! Fink [4] is one of America's most openly anti-Semitic and anti-American pseudo-academics. I've met him and he's also a liar, coward and loud mouth that needs a good swift kick in the ass and a one way ticket to the Gaza strip! He has been denied tenure and this long needed wisdom is now being attacked by the Left as supposed suppression of academic freedom, although in fact it is merely the introduction at long last of some semblance of academic quality control into a university that has been under attack for lacking such. Fink is a 53-year-old untenured assistant professor of political science at De Paul University, one of the weirdest assistant professors in America. Before coming to De Paul in 2003, he had been fired by several schools in the New York area for being a pseudo-scholar and for his hatemongering activities. Finkelstein is a Holocaust Denier and an Apologist for Islamic Terror - Though this development is promising the final decision iss in the hands of De Paul President Rev. Dennis H. Holtschneider – the following illustrates the politically correct Cowardice that has been displayed in recent years by De Paul's Administration: Office of the President 1 East Jackson Boulevard Chicago, Illinois 60604-2287 312/362-8890 FAX: 312/362-7577 October 26, 2006 Dear Mr. Weinert, The letter you sent, and particularly the attachments, are deeply offensive and disturbing [5] to me. They display a terrible ignorance of the Muslim people. [6] As such, you can never claim that the Catholic Church supports your conclusions. The Catholic faith does not and would never support such anger and contempt for Muslims. [7] As for DePaul, we will welcome Muslim students fully at this institution. We will provide space for them to pray each day. We will treat them as our brothers and sisters. And we will educate them so that they can take their place in American society, as we have for every new immigrant group that has come to our nation's shores. There is no welcome here at DePaul for such wholesale dismissal and contempt for an entire portion of the human race. [8] I beg you to read the stories of Jesus' love for the Samaritans, and remind yourself of his love for people that his own nation considered to be enemies. God bless you, Rev. Dennis H. Holtschneider, C.M. President DePaul University This is the Original Letter: The Rev. Dennis H. Holtschneider, C.M., Ed.D. President De Paul University president@depaul.edu George M Weinert V georgemvw999@hotmail.com http://americanjihad.blogspot.com/ Thursday, October 26, 2006 Most Reverend and Dear Father, The writer is a De Paul graduate, 1976 School of Music. I also attended De Paul Academy in 1966-67 where Father John Hini ( former DPU Chaplain) taught this young Catholic Theology. I am a life long Roman Catholic who became very concerned about events at my old alma mater with the introduction of the Islamic Studies major since the Vincentian Fathers used to teach us LATIN in high school. I thought nothing of it until the unfortunate incident with Professor Klozek and Dean Dumbleton was publicized. At that time I wrote about it, along with other conservative bloggers but the courts shall be the ultimate arbiters. Will we Catholics be asked to leave the LP [9] or Downtown Campus of De Paul Next? Since I'll be covering this for many months would you direct me to FINANCIAL STATEMENTS that involve - a.) The Introduction of the Islamic Studies Program b.) The existence (if any) of grants, annuities, etc from Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Egypt or other Islamic nations [10] c.) The involvement (if any) of groups such as CAIR, [11] MAC, MSA, [12] and similar Islamist organizations in the selection of professors and textbooks d.) The true number of Islamic students (in relation to the entire student body) and especially numbers from "Palestine", Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Egypt and the total amount of tuition paid [13] e.) The number of Professors now teaching at De Paul from Islamic nations [14] I've referred this matter for additional investigation to David Horowits's "Discover the Networks" and as a Blue Demon who visits LPC regularly would like these statements at your earliest convenience. Praise the Lord and God Bless America, George M Weinert V http://americanjihad.blogspot.com/ [15] Hopefully the decision to deny Tenure will stand and Fink and his ilk will be gone in a few years – there is no room in the proud Vincentian Tradition of De Paul for frauds and Israel haters like Norm Finklestein – I'll be putting as much pressure as possible on De Paul's President to uphold this decision and hope that you will join me. We've scared the Muslims operating UMMA and their web site is in disarray now so things are really looking up [16] for the old Blue Demons [17] and definitely for Americans patriots who are exposing their plans for Jihad in Chicago [18] When will DE PAUL UNIVERSITY BAN the Hamas Funded Palestinian Terrorist web page at http://condor.depaul.edu/~umma/ and STOP USING DE PAUL UNIVERSITY MONIES TO FINANCE ISLAMIC TERROR IN THE HEART OF CHICAGO? [19] Great work Father Holtschneider – but all concerned De Paul University students and alumni must stay ever vigilant and report any suspect activity to the proper authorities and stop the Saudi funded Islamic Dawa and Jihad in the USA – but one more question for De Paul's President - When will you kick UMMA [20] off campus and restore academic sanity ? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [1] WBEZ 91.5 FM – National Perverts Radio in Chicago [2] The portion of Google when you can find REAL LIVE AQ Terrorists [3] aided by the Council of American Islamofascist Relations [4] Who used Chicago Gay FM Radio at WBEZ FM (91.5) to accuse De Paul University of intolerance and violations of Academic Freedom (WHAT A JOKE!) and even called for MORE PALESTINIAN REPRESENTATION AT THE NATIONS NUMBER ONE CATHOLIC UNIVERSITY! [5] It's the Hamas Funded Palestinians at De Paul that are OFFENSIVE! [6] Muslims are not a 'people' but members of a tyrannical political organization dedicated to the pursuit of power, money and sex (mostly Sex!) [7] According to the Official Catechism of Mother Church this is correct but I've spoken to many priest, brothers and nuns who will concede that Islam is an Evil Ideology (including a few Franciscans!) [8] This is in error – Muslims are Devil Worshippers [9] Chicago's Lincoln Park – the best neighborhood on earth [10] Never answered [11] This also remains unanswered, though CAIR was hell bent on having Professsor Klocek fired and De Paul University President granted their wish (there is litigation now pending on this issue) [12] De Paul's United Mujahideen (er, Muslims) Moving Ahead at http://condor.depaul.edu/~umma/ has ties to MSA – additional details are available at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DEPAULUNIVERSITYJIHAD/ [13] These details have also never been revealed by De Paul University's Administration [14] Also unanswered despite the continued faculty presence of America Haters like Black Muslim Radical Aminah Beverly McCloud, Ph.D. http://condor.depaul.edu/~amccloud/ (it says nothing about her alliance with Nation of Pislam's Calypso Louie Farrakhan though they are old friends and rabid America haters) [15] The President of De Paul University has never provided information on the funding of the Islamic Studies Major and suspect connections to the Saudi Kingdom and Wahhabi Islam remain a mystery [16] The most effective way to deal with a Terrorist is to Terrorize them! They get the idea quickly [17] And the basketball team is doing very well too! But it seems that De Paul students are afraid of the truth – since 1976 when this scholar graduate from the School of Music I've learned a lot of it but it seems that some folks ar De Paul University can't handle it! Sheesh!!!! What are you so afraid of boys? What a bunch of cowards – it's a good thing that these queers did not attend De Paul back in the late 1960's when we used to hang around after class at Romas's – baseball bats and tire irons settled things with punks like the new De Paulians in those days – ask around LPC - what a pity. [19] This Terrorist Web Site is actually hosted and paid for by De Paul University though the financial impetus comes from the Muslim Student Association which is in turn funded by HAMAS [20] United Mujahideen (re, Muslims) Moving Ahead -- Praise the Lord and God Bless America, George M Weinert V http://americanjihad.blogspot.com/

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Name: Jazon
Date: Monday October 08, 2007
Time: 07:12:30 -0700

Comment

Only satan, loves killings. And who ever is doing such a cruel thing like this is a true son of satan. The true God give life and only true God takes it. But the moon God (Allah) loves innocent blood as vampires do. Mind you islam is an occult sec.

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Name: Mis-understanding
Date: Sunday October 14, 2007
Time: 18:03:11 -0700

Comment

There is alot of misunderstanding among many people of various background into "honour killing", linking it to religion Islam. First, I myself am against honour killing, because no religion portray such killing and due to the lack of knowledge, we end up in wrong assumptions. My friend try to understand the facts; but sometime to know the facts one has to keep in control his own desires and temptations and Islam if truly followed in practice within the daily life, such as: work, business, multi-cultural society and in their homes according to the Quran and Sunnah, believe me that you will notice the crime reduction within the society as a whole. This will benefit society as a whole and try to inquire that how many non-muslim from many countries become Muslim and majority of them are women; why?. If, I wanted their is alot of thing to complain about within the Western countries that are affecting their own people, where alot of women become a target of abuse by men in various aspects of life, this is not to comment against in a rude manner; but just one of the crime takes place. I would not say that this is done because of religion, but of our own wrong doings. We live in a civilised society and talking foolish puts us into the dark ages, try to create an atmosphere to understand each other and bring this understanding towards being humans. Good luck.

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Name: rinjaniLala
Date: Tuesday October 23, 2007
Time: 06:10:23 -0700

Comment

honor killing is NOT Islamic. even though most of the cases occur in countries where the majority of the people is Muslim, it actually has been a tradition in the Middle East area long before Islam came. before Islam came, people bury their baby daughters because of shame and don't respect women as much. Islam appreciates women, there even is a hadith (saying of the prophet) that says "Paradise is under a mother's feet". Another fact that supports honor killing is cultural and not Islamic is that in other Muslim-majority countries, like Indonesia and Malaysia, people don't do honor killings. About Islam being injustice towards women in marriage. A men MAY have 4 wives, IF he can be fair with his wives. Islam also imposes a man to be kind with his wife. If in reality a lot of men don't follow the rules: treat their wives unfair and intimidate them, that is the PERSON, NOT Islam in whole. That happens in every religion: there are always people who don't follow or misunderstand the rules. so then if Muslim men do honor killings and other things that seem barbaric, it's THEM as a human being, NOT Islam. People can't generalize all one point something billion Muslims in the world act the same way as hundreds that do bad stuff. Say the Ku Klux Klan and their racism. Their Christians, but then we don't generalize all Christians to be racist. To judge a religion, don't look at its people, but look at its holy scriptures. People are never perfect and can always make mistakes. The essence of a religion is in its scriptures.

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Name: Dawn Lee
Date: Wednesday October 31, 2007
Time: 02:32:41 -0700

Comment

Don't mean to be rude.....I think it's got a lot to do with a small-willy syndrome. How archaic can these men get? Each life is your own to lead. I can't fathom anyone still thinking that your credibility or honour is in the hands of someone else. That's total irresponsibility on the part of these men to think that the women have to uphold their honour, while they, as men, can do anything. That's total simple-mindedness, but is revered cos it is supported by its associated to the word 'tradition'. It's also like a spoilt child throwing a tantrum - "my sister got herself a boyfriend and is having fun (while I should be the only one int he family to be having fun), so I got to kill her. I get to be honoured as a real man anyway...." How dumb...

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Name:
Date: Thursday November 01, 2007
Time: 07:29:04 -0700

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Name: Me
Date: Monday November 05, 2007
Time: 06:53:47 -0700

Comment

"Honor" killings (of women) - as far as they're not covered-up crimes for personal gain - stem from ancient patriarchal systems. They are not part of any religion, but of cultural traditions that regard family matters as domain of the tribe rather than the state. Poverty, lawlessness and dependance of the individual upon the family for mere survival lie at the heart of the problem, as well as the perception that a man is only a "real man" if he has complete control over "his" females (in Japan, many marriages are still arranged by the parents, and the "pride" of Spanish males is legendary, for instance). In Europe, too, Women's emancipation has taken decades to hundreds of years. Maybe the most important factor was wealth/economic opportunity which allowed women to find jobs outside the family, and a strict rule of law which was accepted by people who saw themselves as part of a nation, not only a tribe. A strong government is required, but one that has support of the majority and benefits the whole. Much "Islamic radicalism" is in fact veiled criticism of the regime seen as selling out the country (to the West) while doing nothing for its subjects, as well als escapism towards a revanchist utopia which will see the "glory" of the Muslim world restored. Ranting about the "evils of Islam" only gives credit to the most wacky radicals of this faith, and shows that "we" are not that open-minded or intelligent either. I don't believe anyone engaged in a genuine "honor killing" really enjoys what he/she is doing, but society is seen as forcing it upon them. It is that "peer pressure" which has to be fought, and important aides for the future are lasting peace and economic development. The Taliban rose to power through the Soviet-Afghan war. Afghanistan and Iraq are in shambles now, and the same could happen to Iran. "We" are surely not going to promote humanistic values by causing destitution and resentment.

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Name: pissed off
Date: Monday December 03, 2007
Time: 11:04:59 -0700

Comment

wheres the honor in not having free choice? continue the way you do and all traces of your screwed up religion will be erased from all of earth's cultures

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Name: Anita
Date: Sunday December 16, 2007
Time: 23:45:27 -0700

Comment

I was so close to marrying a muslim man even though as a christian it's against our religion to do that because it's considered to be unequally yoked... anyways i still love him and don't trust him. It's true islamic men are control sexual freaks they are hypocrites just like us christians can be. Islam is not from God it contradicts it's self in the Quran AND contradicts what Jesus taught.

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