Islam Under Scrutiny by Ex-Muslims

Islam's Sacred Stone of Mecca...

"A religion is a unified system of beliefs and practices relative to sacred things, that is to say, things set apart and forbidden—beliefs and practices, which unite into one single moral community called a Church, all those who adhere to them". -- Emile Durkheim


The Black Stone is a Muslim object of reverence, which according to Islamic traditions dates back to the time of Adam and Eve. Many consider it to be a Tektite. It is the eastern cornerstone of the Kaaba, the ancient Sacred Stone towards which Muslims pray in the center of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, Saudi Arabia. It is covered with an elaborately gold-threaded embroidered Quranic verses on a black-draped cloth. As any non-Muslim in the temple would be slain on sight, and photography is generally prohibited, this stone is shrouded in mystery? However, if you do succeed in tracking down the three accounts of the pilgrimage of Hajj to Mecca you might be considered a lucky one!

What these views reveal, is a polished black stone of which less than two feet is visible… This stone is set in large solid silver mountings. The whole resembles, quite deliberately, for reasons which will emerge, ‘the vulva of the goddess’! There is severe damage to the stone, as it was taken away by the sacrilegious Qarmatians in 930 CE and broken into a number of pieces before returning the pieces for a great price. The Stone pieces are held together by a silver frame, which is fastened by silver nails to the Stone. The Stone is roughly 30 cm (12 in.) in diameter, and 1.5 meters (5 ft.) above the ground. When pilgrims circle the Kaaba as part of the Tawaf ritual of the Hajj, many of them try, if possible, to stop and kiss the Black Stone, ‘emulating the kiss that it received from Prophet Muhammad.’ If they cannot reach it, then they are to point to it on each of their seven circuits around the Kaaba.

The Black Stone of Kaaba in Mecca is called Al-hajar Al-aswad in Arabic. The word Kaaba (also Ka'ba, or Ka'bah) means ‘The Cube’. That Muslims now refer to it as the ‘Hand of Allah’, which does not diminish the urge for all those, who complete the pilgrimage to Mecca to touch or kiss this sacred Islamic object! :-)

The Black Stone's Origin

'A principal sacred object in Pagan Arabian religion was the stone... Such stones were thought to be the residence of a god; hence the term applied to them by the Byzantine Christian writers of the fifth and sixth centuries: 'baetyl', from bet'el, 'the house of god'.' [1]

'In north Arabian temples the image of the deity sometimes stood in the open air or it could be sheltered in a qubbah, a vaulted niche... Not to be confused with the qubbah is the word for ka'bah, for a cube-shaped walled structure which... served as a shelter for the sacred stones.' [2]

Camphausen, in his article [3], reveals that the misogynic Muslim religion has its origins in the worship of goddess. Allah is a revamped version of the ancient goddess Al'Lat, and it was her shrine, which has since continued with little change, as the Kaaba. The known history of Mohammed reveals that he was born around 570 CE into a tribe of the Koreishe (Quraysh), who not only worshipped the goddess Q're, but were the sworn guardians of her shrine. By 622, Mohammed was preaching the ways of his god, Allah, and was driven out by his own tribe as a result. There are also various opinions as to what the Black Stone actually is… The Muslims say that the Stone was found by Abraham (Ibrahim) and his son Ishmael (Ismail) when they were searching for stones with which to build the Kaaba (House of God). They recognized its worth and made it one of the building's cornerstones.

The Kaaba at Mecca describes the shape of the black stone structure on a marble base, which stands in the centre court of the Great Mosque, Masjidul Haram, at the centre of Mecca. It stands about 50 feet high by about 35 feet wide. Set into the eastern corner is the sacred stone. This Kaaba is a cubed shaped temple (according to Islam) rebuilt by Abraham and his son Ishmael. Reverently draped in black cloth throughout the year, it beckons to every Muslim of the world to come to its sacred ground and perform the ritual of Hajj.

The Kaaba is the canonical center of the Islamic world; every pious act, particularly prayer, is directed towards it. Once a year it plays host to the greatest convention of Muslim believers, and stands ready to sanctify the Umrah travelers through rest of the year.

The official starting point of the walk around the Kaaba, that forms the core of the holy pilgrimage (hajj). During the Tawaf, the pilgrims kiss or touch the black stone as they circumambulate the Kaaba.

Some Muslims are more willing to believe that the Stone itself has some supernatural powers. They believe that this ‘stone fell from the sky during the time of Adam and Eve, and that it has the power to cleanse worshippers of their sins by absorbing them into itself’. They say that the Black Stone was once a pure and dazzling white, and it has turned black because of the sins it has absorbed over the ages.

It is remarkable, however, that even though the temple contained 360 idols worshipped before Muhammad's prophethood, the Black Stone was never kissed or made an idol of worship by the pagan Arabs. In fact, the Kaaba was never worshipped by the idolaters prior to Muhammad's Prophethood. The building contained idols of worship but the building itself was never an object of worship.

The fact that the Kaaba was rebuilt by Abraham is not an historical fact! Since the stone has been there ever since, the pagans found it lying in the sands of Arabia; it stands to reason that Abraham placed the stone in the Kaaba? The Black Stone is in fact not the cornerstone of the Kaaba, and there never was an emblem of the progeny of Abraham that was rejected by the Israelites. It was Muhammad, who made it the corner stone of the Kingdom of Allah.

The Black Stone, therefore, passes for the mithaq (primordial covenant between the Creator and His created). And in the whole world there is only this unhewn stone, cut out of the mountains without hands, and that is the corner-stone of a building, which in point of importance, stands unique in the world...???

Touching or kissing the stone has a profound impact on the faithful, as it is supposed to count in their favor on the Islamic Judgment Day. [Judgment Day is a metaphor for the return to balance with the duality of the reality of man.]

Ibn Jubayr (1145-1217), the great Muslim traveler from Valencia, describes the emotion he felt on touching the stone, “The stone, when one kisses it, has a softness and freshness, which delights the mouth; so much so that he who places his lips upon it wishes never to remove them”. It suffices, moreover, that the Prophet said that it is the ‘Right Hand of God on Earth’ so Allah has a ‘Stoned Hand’ also?

The single most important reason for kissing the stone is that Prophet Muhammad did so! No devotional significance, whatsoever, is attached to the stone by the pre-Islamic pagans, who worshipped it. Kissing or touching the Black Stone is a reverential act of acknowledgment that Allah's hand directed its placement and in its construction. That Abraham and Muhammad, Allah's blessing upon them, had touched and kissed the stone, and an acknowledgment that Allah had entrusted the 'corner stone' of His religious central focus for man upon that hallowed, sacred place.

Researchers have noted that the Kaaba is accurately aligned on two heavenly phenomena: the cycles of the moon and the rising of Canopus, the brightest star after Sirius. There are various other opinions as to what the Black Stone actually symbolizes. Many Muslims regard the Stone as 'just a stone'. When Umar ibn al-Khattab (second Caliph) came to kiss the stone, he said, in front of all assembled:

"No doubt, I know that you are a stone and can neither harm anyone nor benefit anyone. Had I not seen Allah's Messenger kissing you, I would not have kissed you".

Muslims, therefore, pay their respect to the Black Stone in a spirit of trust in Muhammad, not with any belief in the Black Stone itself.

The Triple Goddesses

Pre-Islamic worship of the goddess seems to be primarily associated with Al'Lat, which simply means 'goddess'. She is a triple goddess, similar to the Greek lunar deity Kore/Demeter/Hecate. Each aspect of this trinity corresponds to a phase of the moon. In the same way Al'Lat has three names known to the initiate: Q're, the crescent moon or the maiden; Al'Uzza, literally 'the strong one', who is the full moon and the mother aspect; then Al'Manat, the waning but wise goddess of fate, prophecy and divination. Islamic traditions continue to recognize these three, but labels them 'daughters of Allah'.

According to Edward Rice [4] “Al'Uzza was especially worshipped at the Kaaba where she was served by seven priestesses. Her worshippers circled the holy stone seven times - once for each of the ancient seven planets, and did so in total nudity.

Near the Kaaba is the ever-flowing well, Zamzam, which cools the throats of the countless millions of pilgrims. In an oasis of always-flowing water, the Black Stone in its mount became an unmatched image of the goddess as giver of life. Only in the Indian continent do such physical symbols for the male and female generative powers, the lingam and yoni, continue to be worshipped with their original fervour.

It is easy to imagine that in pre-Muslim times, the goddess's temple at Mecca was preeminent, whether to celebrate life, ask protection, pray for offspring. Legend tells how Abraham, unable to produce children by his wife Sarah, came here to make love to his slave Hagar. Later on, when Hagar came back to give birth, she could find no water and Abraham created the holy well of Zamzam to save the life of his first son.

When Mohammed wanted to supplant Al’Lat with Allah, this was the one Temple he must conquer. Although Mohammed did conquer the Kaaba, little else changed. The faithful still circle the Holy Kaaba seven times, (nowadays the pilgrims only wear a white linen cloth to cover their genitals and not fully clothed)? The priests of the sacred shrine are still known as Beni Shaybah or 'Sons of the Old Woman', Shaybah being, of course, the famous Queen Sheba of Solomon's time. Sheba appears under the guise of Lilith in the Near East, and as Hagar ('the Egyptian') in the Hebrew mythology of the Old Testament. So, rewriting the legend given above, Abraham begot his son, Ishmaelthe ancestor of the Arabsby the goddess on the Black Stone of the Kaaba.

While we are tracing names, Q're (or Qure), the maiden aspect of Al'Lat, seems certain to be the origin of the Greek Kore. Camphausen suggests that the holy Koran is the 'Word of Qure'. Even Muslims admit that the work existed before the time of Mohammed. Legend has it that it was copied from a divine prototype that appeared in heaven at the beginning of time, or the Mother of the Book [5]. Al'Uzza, the mother aspect of Al'Lat, may give us the pre-dynastic Egyptian snake goddess Ua Zit [Uadjet], who develops into Isis.

Secular historians point to the history of stone worship, and especially meteorite worship, in pre-Islamic Arabia, and say that ‘it is likely that the Stone is a meteorite’. There is no way to test this hypothesis without removing and examining the Stone, which would not be permitted by its guardians. There is no indication as to where this stone originated, but since it predates the revelation of the Holy Quran and Muhammad's prophethood, and even being kissed, it must stem from the time of Abraham since the Hajj traditions are traceable to the patriarch of monotheism by the pre-islamic pagans.

Other Cultures and Deities

The earliest reference we have to a goddess worshipped as a cube-shaped stone is from Neolithic Anatolia. Alternatively, 'Kubaba' may mean a hollow vessel or cave, which would still be a supreme image of the goddess. The ideograms for Kubaba in the Hittite alphabet are a lozenge or cube, a double-headed axe, a dove, a vase and a door or gateall images of the goddess in Neolithic Europe.

Deities of other cultures known to have been associated with black stones include Aphrodite at Paphos, Cybele at Pessinus and later Rome, Astarte at Byblos and the famous Artemis/Diana of Ephesus. The latter's most ancient sculpture was, it is said, carved from a black meteorite.

The earliest form of Cybele's name may have been Kubaba or Kumbaba, which suggests Humbaba, who was the guardian of the forest in the Epic of Gilgamesh, the world's oldest recorded myth from Assyria of circa 2500 BCE of the ‘Sumerites Literature’ and as scholars reveal more of the text as the source of most of the major mythological themes of later civilizations [6].

The origin of Kubaba may have been kube or kuba meaning 'cube'. The earliest reference we have to a goddess worshipped as a cube-shaped stone is from Neolithic Anatolia [7].

The stone associated with Cybele's worship was, originally, probably at Pessinus but perhaps at Pergamum or on Mount Ida. What is certain is that in 204 BCE, it was taken to Rome, where Cybele became 'Mother' to the Romans. The ecstatic rites of her worship were alien to the Roman temperament, but nevertheless animated the streets of their city during the annual procession of the goddess's statue. Alongside Isis (god of the Egyptians), Cybele retained prominence in the heart of the Empire until the fifth century BCE, when the stone was then lost. Her cult prospered throughout the Empire and it is said that every town or village remained true to the worship of Cybele [8]. Various Classical writers describe the rituals, which went on her in her honor, in which a tapering black stone, the object of veneration at her temple, was used.

At Mecca, the Goddess was ‘Shaybah’ or’ Sheba’, the Old Woman, which was worshipped as a black aniconic stone like the Goddess of the Scythian Amazons. The sacred Black Stone that now enshrines in the Kaaba was her feminine symbol, marked by the sign of the yoni (vagina), and covered like the ancient Mother by a veil. No one seems to know exactly what it is supposed to represent today?

The Black Stone rests in the Haram, "Sanctuary", cognate of "harem," which used to mean a Temple of Women, in Babylon, a shrine of the Goddess Har, mother of harlots! Hereditary guardians of the Haram were the Koreshites, "children of Kore", Mohammed’s own tribe. The holy office was originally held by women, before it was taken over by male priests calling themselves ‘Beni Shayban’ ("Sons of the Old Woman").

More Black Stones

The home of Aphrodite was at Paphos on Cyprus. Various Classical writers describe the rituals which went on her in her honour - these seem to include the practice which is now known by the disdainful term of 'sacred prostitution'. In any event, the tapering black stone which was the object of veneration at this Temple still survives, even if it now placed inside the site museum [9].

Also in Cyprus is another highly venerated Islamic site, the third most important after Mecca and Medina, the Hala Sultan Tekke. This, too, has a black rock, said to have fallen as a meteorite as part of the tritholon over the shrine. The shrine is dedicated to a woman, the aunt and foster mother of Prophet Mohammed [10]. Could this, like Mecca, have been originally a goddess shrine? Unfortunately no other clues are forthcoming.

Another site stated to have a Black Stone was at Petra, but I have been unable to discover where this was or who was worshipped there (any clue from readers?)!

To add a little local flavour, numerous standing stones in the British Isles are reputed to have fallen from the stars. The now-lost Star Stone marked the meeting of Leicestershire, Nottinghamshire and Lincolnshire; an also-vanished stone at Grimston, Leicestershire, was also said to have such an origin. Whether or not such stones were ever associated with goddess worship, we will never know.

It would take far too long to discuss to what extent the cult of the goddess's Black Stone may have been perpetrated as Solomon's bride in the Song of Songs, who is 'black but beautiful' or to come to terms with the black images of Demeter, Artemis and Isis, who have their direct continuation in the Black Virgins of Europepatrons of the troubadours, the Gnostics and the alchemists, as well as the present Pope. Those, who wish to follow such ideas, would do well to read ‘The myth of the goddess’ [11], which, in a sober but inspirational manner, reevaluates how the feminine deity has remained with us throughout history.

Further information on these topics appears in a follow-up article by Alby Stone, Goddess of the Black Stone.


 

References:

[1] Encyclopedia Britannica.
[2] ibid.
[3] Rufus C. Camphausen, 'The Ka'bah at Mecca', Bres (Holland) No.139, 1989. My thanks to Rufus for bringing this article to my attention; this article of mine is in large part a synopsis of his longer work. See also 'From behind a veil', Flora Green, in The cauldron No.61 (reprinted from The Merrymount messenger Winter 1991).
[4] E. Rice, Easter definitions, Doubleday, 1978 (cited in Camphausen).
[5] Barbara G. Walker, The crone, Harper & Row, 1985 (cited in Camphausen).
[6] See Robert Temple's recent translation He who saw everything, Rider, 1991.
[7] Anne Baring and Jules Cashford, The myth of the goddess, Penguin, 1991.
[8] Maarten J. Vermaseren, Cybele and Attis, trans. A.M.H. Lemmers, Thames and Hudson, 1977 (cited in Baring and Cashford, op. cit.).
[9] ibid.
[10] 'Aphrodite's island', Penny Drayton, Wood & water, Vol.2, No.41, Jan 1993.
[11] [12] Baring and Cashford, op. cit.

Originally published in Mercian Mysteries No.14 February 1993.


Lennard James is a Pakistani-born writer.


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Name: Jay
Subject:
Date: Tuesday May 26, 2009
Time: 14:05:55 -0400

Comment

There is reference in the vedas where the Hindu Goddess is referred to "Ila" or "parvati" who is supposedly the wife of Shiva- the god of destruction and upholding the truth. Ila was pagan goddess which in turn got modified to Allah. Shiva is worshipped in Hinduism in the form of a Linga which is essentially a "phallus" shaped stone, the significance being the originator of human life in this world. It is believed that Vikramdityas Hindu empire existed all the way upto the middle east and part of europe. Some historians have concluded that ancient Kaaba was actually a shiva linga before it was broken. Also, I believe Mecca has or had idols signifying the 365 days of the yr which is very similar to Hindu style of worship. There seems to be belief that the ancient pagan lifestyle of the arabs was actually influenced or was part of the modern Hindu history. It is worth noting that Hinduism unlike other semitic faiths dont have strict definitions of what constitutes the religion. It is more of a recently coined term to group the various religious faiths in the region beyond the Indus river by the Persians and Europeans. However, the practices commonly observed in present day Hindu faiths seems to be very similar to the pagan practices of pre-islamic arab and European lands.


Name: Charles Martel
Subject:
Date: Tuesday May 26, 2009
Time: 14:43:43 -0400

Comment

I like all your articals so far, but your bracketed statement below is wrong as to Moslem understanding or common sense (I am not Moslem): "Touching or kissing the stone has a profound impact on the faithful, as it is supposed to count in their favor on the Islamic Judgment Day. [Judgment Day is a metaphor for the return to balance with the duality of the reality of man.]" That's not what Moslems believe (if that's what you're saying) and it isn't objectively true -- IF there is a Judgment Day, it will be a lot more than a metaphorical "return to balance with the duality of the reality of man."


Name: Anti Clot
Subject:
Date: Tuesday May 26, 2009
Time: 15:46:20 -0400

Comment

The whole story is stupid because Abraham and Moses and many other protagonists of the bíble and the quran did never exist. These are legends with no historical meaning. The jews were polytheistic or monolatristic before the babylonian exile, and Monotheism did not appear before 600 b.c. Therefore, the whole stories of Abraham and Moses are nothing but fake and the Quran drew it from the bible, with only minor changes. This is the way to understand that the whole quran is fake, a second edition for the arabs, some kind of a paperback, but all fiction. Why did the Saudi government never provide any detailed evidence? Because there is no evidence. The whole Quran is fiction!


Name:
Subject:
Date: Tuesday May 26, 2009
Time: 16:04:16 -0400

Comment

"Allah has a ‘Stoned Hand’ also" Perhaps he stoned out of his mind also...


Name: krishna
Subject:
Date: Tuesday May 26, 2009
Time: 16:13:19 -0400

Comment

kaba was a hindu temple. You just type the following on your web site. You will get the site to read aboyt kaba; based upon historical fact. Was the Kaaba Originally a Hindu Temple? By P.N. Oak (Historian)


Name: duh_swami
Subject:
Date: Tuesday May 26, 2009
Time: 23:50:43 -0400

Comment

interesting article...Thank you...


Name: vbv
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 05:43:10 -0400

Comment

Islam is averse to idol worship,say the muslims.Then ,what is the black stone doing and why is it so venerated? One cannot escape from idol-worship,be it any "religion". Muslims are hypocrites when they deride hinduism for making idols and using it to worship some deity,while they not only worship the black stone but also graves of their 'pirs' or some so-called muslim'saints'like Moinudin Chisty or Nizamuddin Aulia,idolise the "hair of the 'prophet'" as in Kashmir or "the dirty 'robe' of the 'prophet'" as in Afghanistan. Not to speak of the innumerable relics that you find littered everywhere in the 'islamic' countries. It is plain hypocrisy and double-speak: our 'idols' are okay but yours are not so!


Name: balam
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 06:18:35 -0400

Comment

Mohammad did not believe in the Living God because he was demon possessed and an agent of devil.He had nothing godly about him. He suffered from mental illnesses because the devil controlled his mind and life and he controlled his followers lives on behalf of demonic spirit,which posessed him..Muslms have no right to point their finger at the Hindus for worshipping idols,whereas their prophet was a stone worshipper as well.The geneology of Mohammad connects him to paganism.He was a pervert pagan prophet,who introduced the pagan ideology for the pafan people other-wise called Muslims.


Name: MUHAMED DID NOT BELIEVE IN TRU LIVING GOD MOTHER NATURE
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 08:02:27 -0400

Comment

MUHAMED DID NOT BELIEVE IN TRU LIVING GOD MOTHER NATURE. no jehova/allah created man from mud/dirt, but man is evolved by nature and proof is in human dna. nature is worshipped as a vagina-yoni in all pagan cultures and the jews also have goddess worship in kabballah and also christians have mary.so islam has vagina shaped stone. king vikramaditya had sent kafir pagan infidel priests to arabia and they established kaba and did proper worship to kafir pagan hindu god hiva lingam. PLS GOOGLE TO FIND OUT MORE.


Name: kri
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 09:39:57 -0400

Comment

This is the paragraphs from historian A.N.Oak's finding about kabaah temple. It was Islam that extinguished the light of knowledge in Vedic Arabia. It is ironic that the man who brought about such darkness himself belonged to the Qurayshi Tribe of Mecca. The Qurayshi were particularly devoted to Allah (Durga) and the famous Shivling of the Kaaba Temple. The fact that the Shivling remains to this day in the Kaaba is solely due to the fact that it happened to be the Qurayshi tribe's faceless Family Deity. Muhammad's name itself came from Mahadeva, which is another cognate for Lord Shiva. Muhammad's own uncle, Umar-Bin-E-Hassham was a staunch Hindu and fervent devotee of Lord Shiva. He was a renowned poet and wrote many verses in praise of Shiva. One of these has survived on page 235 of Sair-Ul-Okul and reads as follows: Kafavomal fikra min ulumin Tab asayru Kaluwan amataul Hawa was Tajakhru We Tajakhayroba udan Kalalwade-E Liboawa Walukayanay jatally, hay Yauma Tab asayru Wa Abalolha ajabu armeeman MAHADEVA Manojail ilamuddin minhum wa sayattaru Wa Sahabi Kay-yam feema-Kamil MINDAY Yauman Wa Yakulum no latabahan foeennak Tawjjaru Massayaray akhalakan hasanan Kullahum Najumum aja- at Summa gabul HINDU which translates as: The man who may spend his life in sin and irreligion or waste it in lechery and wrath If at least he relent and return to righteousness can he be saved? If but once he worship Mahadeva with a pure heart, he will attain the ultimate in spirituality. Oh Lord Shiva exchange my entire life for but a day's sojourn in India where one attains salvation. But one pilgrimage there secures for one all merit and company of the truly great.


Name:
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 11:32:57 -0400

Comment

Again few paragraph from A.N.Oak's (historian)fiending about kaba temple. "'king Vikramaditya inscription found in the Kaaba in Mecca proving beyond doubt that the Arabian Peninsula formed a part of his Indian Empire.The text of the crucial Vikramaditya inscription, found inscribed on a gold dish hung inside the Kaaba shrine in Mecca, is found recorded on page 315 of a volume known as ‘Sayar-ul-Okul’ treasured in the Makhtab-e-Sultania library in Istanbul, Turkey. Rendered in free English the inscription says: "Fortunate are those who were born (and lived) during king Vikram’s reign. He was a noble, generous dutiful ruler, devoted to the welfare of his subjects. But at that time we Arabs, oblivious of God, were lost in sensual pleasures. Plotting and torture were rampant. The darkness of ignorance had enveloped our country. Like the lamb struggling for her life in the cruel paws of a wolf we Arabs were caught up in ignorance. The entire country was enveloped in a darkness so intense as on a new moon night. But the present dawn and pleasant sunshine of education is the result of the favour of the noble king Vikramaditya whose benevolent supervision did not lose sight of us- foreigners as we were. He spread his sacred religion amongst us and sent scholars whose brilliance shone like that of the sun from his country to ours. These scholars and preceptors through whose benevolence we were once again made cognisant of the presence of God, introduced to His sacred existence and put on the road of Truth, had come to our country to preach their religion and impart education at king Vikramaditya’s behest." For those who would like to read the Arabic wording I reproduce it hereunder in Roman script: "Itrashaphai Santu Ibikramatul Phahalameen Karimun Yartapheeha Wayosassaru Bihillahaya Samaini Ela Motakabberen Sihillaha Yuhee Quid min howa Yapakhara phajjal asari nahone osirom bayjayhalem. Yundan blabin Kajan blnaya khtoryaha sadunya kanateph netephi bejehalin Atadari bilamasa- rateen phakef tasabuhu kaunnieja majekaralhada walador. As hmiman burukankad toluho watastaru hihila Yakajibaymana balay kulk amarena phaneya jaunabilamary Bikramatum". (Page 315 Sayar-ul-okul). [Note: The title ‘Saya-ul-okul’ signifies memorable words.] "


Name: LingaYa
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 12:02:59 -0400

Comment

Scientist has already proved that human has reached there current form through evolution and thus claim of Adam that he is father of everyone is false. However, there is no smoke without fire; there must be something behind the story of Adam. Some people may find it illogical and irrational to assume that thing from Adam to Christianity to Islam, to invasion of Muslims by India to coming of British to India could be connected, and part of a bigger power struggle. If we cannot find evidence, still we cannot guarantee that things are just random. Let us take a situation, we are in a jungle making a documentary film, a mouse came out of its hiding place, found some seeds to eat and keep moving ahead finding more seeds until a snake saw him and run after him. The rat ran towards his hiding place and while chasing the rat, snake found a bird nest in a tree nearby, now he stop chasing the rat and start climbing the tree to eat the bird eggs, then suddenly a mongoose came from somewhere and kill and eat the snake. To an ordinary eye of the documentary maker and viewer of the film, the event may look very random, nothing special but can be guarantee!


Name: LingYa
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 12:03:44 -0400

Comment

We always say lion is the king of jungle, or tiger is the king of jungle or always assume that only strong and powerful animals can play the game of dominance in the jungle. What about the birds, they are not flying in the sky, just for good time. If God gave animals on ground sharp nails and teeth or strong body to get an upper hand in power struggle, birds in the sky have height and thus ability to see big picture and ability to observe all animals on the ground and their wider relationships with each other. It is natural for birds to take advantage of their ability to see bigger picture when they want to play game of dominance with each other. A bird can plan the above story of rat, snake and mongoose as well; if a bird is jealous of some higher-flying bird then it can drop some seeds from rat hiding place to snake hiding place. It knows that if snake is very hungry it will try to chase the rat and if the nest of its rival bird is in the way, then snake will think to eat stationary eggs rather than chasing a running rat. Now if the rival bird can fly higher and see a more detailed and wider picture of the jungle than its opponent, this bird can also drop its seeds strategically, such that when snake reaches its nest, the mongoose reaches to kill the snake. Birds may be playing chess in the jungle, just by dropping seeds in strategic locations. Only difference is attitude, bad bird is drooping seeds to hurt its rival where as good bird is dropping seeds just in self-defence.


Name: LingaYa -3
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 12:16:39 -0400

Comment

I am not claiming anything about above point of view, it up to people to judge whether there could be some merits in the above thoughts. Next time if I have time I will tell a story, which people in the west may feel that it got some parallels with stories of Adam. I am not claming anything about Adam; it is not good to accuse people without evidence, I do not know this person name, I just know that he has four sons and he sent them in four directions to spread his teachings and he got in some problem in his native place, so he was sent away to reform himself.


Name: Vijay
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 13:11:51 -0400

Comment

Ayesha Ahmed wrote an article on this topic: http://islam-watch.org/AyeshaAhmed/Paganism-Hinduism-in-Islam.htm


Name: LingaYa
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 13:36:42 -0400

Comment

Although no secret is secret, once you reveal it, but anyhow this might help people to choose between a good person and fraud for sometime. If a Guru claims he knows a bit better than ordinary people and people listening to him can judge him by his thoughts and actions, I do not have a problem. However, if some Guru or his disciples claim that he is all knower, he is the lord of Universe, he is always right or whatever then I got a small tool to check him. If he is all knower, than he should know the significance of Chowki (A small wooden chair, height just few inches, which Hindu priest uses to sit down in some holy ceremonies). When a teacher or priest is involved in an activity relating to God and if the disciples are sitting on the ground than a teacher cannot sit more higher than there feets, unless it is impossible like in a very large gathering. The significance is that if some day God came to know about the Guru and get interested to hear him, obviously, he will not come as a chief guest to judge him; he might be sitting disguising as a beggar in last row. So to counter that Guru or priest only sit few inches above the disciples, as a teacher its his right to have a higher place then disciples and as he is talking about God than who knows God may be present among the disciples, so even by sitting higher, he is still sitting in the feets of the Lord. If he is sitting higher, than God cannot bless him because he has already made his position higher than God and thus only God can seek his blessing not him because blessing always goes from higher to lower.


Name:
Subject:
Date: Wednesday May 27, 2009
Time: 13:57:32 -0400

Comment

The arab tradition to go to makha, clade in white seamless cloth and saved the head before entering the holy shrine, is not muhammad creation. it is a vaidic tradition, exactly dress up in same fashion and save head before entering in the temple. In fact muhammad's follower are doing it with devotion since than.


Name: Ib-Ra-Hima
Subject:
Date: Thursday May 28, 2009
Time: 14:27:29 -0400

Comment

This is a good article b/c it generally makes clear the idea that everything has a history. Even religions and or cultural practices can be traced back to some older source if followed with tenacity and honest seeking after truth. As indicated here and elsewhere by this writer and others, it appears that Islam is a hodgepodge of different near eastern and Mediterranean practices. They have all been combined very ingeniously and insidiously to invoke the deepest fear based neurosis predicated upon an even older and deeper misconception related to the notion of ZERO.(will explain later) So to add to the list of religious pilfering and plagiarisms by Mohammad we must direct our attention to what is today called "Africa" where the land today called "Egypt" happens to be. Somewhere in our modern retelling of history this land went from being Kmt "Black nation/land" (double meanings similar to Sheba meaning seven or oath in Hebrew) to "Afrika" land of the "burnt souls" and Egypt is now in the "Middle East/Mediterranean". Nonetheless the history of practices adopted from this land by all people is unprecedented. (read Anacalypsis by Godfrey Higgins) This is especially true when investigating the deeper historical roots of spiritual and religious traditions. Upon research we will find the unmistakable ubiquity of BLACK GODS and GODDESSES. Everywhere we can trace the origins of Deities they are distinctly black. So the idea of black stones, black madonnas, black boxes, black Buddhas, etc are not very novel unless we have forgotten that everything has a history. If we are to be true to it, history, we must go to where all known history began and that would be in the black lands. So how does this relate to Mohammad? As many here have noticed there are many things that are practiced in Islam that have no explanation or reason that any of the Ulamaa seeming able or willing to address. Where did Mohammad get the prayer positions? How did he come up with Wudhu/Ablutions? Why was the number three an often used numeral in relation to number of times things were done for emphasis. (BTW "arabic" numerals used in western world are really Hindi Numerals. Just another little clue as to the influence of Hindi culture on Arabs) Why are at least two of the daily prayers named after "African" Deities (ASR/Osiris and ISHAA/Isis) with Allah stressing the importance of safeguarding the middle prayer? Guess which one that is... ASR/Ausar properly WSR/(OSIRIS is greek name)! Why are at least two surahs named after "African" Deities (Al-ASR/Ausar and Al-Faatihah/PTAH)? Look up the meaning if you don't know it but Faatihah and Ptah have virtually one and the same meaning, the opening and the opener respectively. Al-Faatihah is even known as Umm-ul-Quran, the most significant SEVEN verses in Quran a muslims prayer isn't complete without it, named after an "African" Deity Ptah (the opener). Just coincidence right? Lets do the research and see how much of a coincidence it all is. Dhul-Nun Al-Misri is one of the unsung founders of Sufism and he was from "Egypt" where Sufism truly began. He was black as the night but did you know that his name Dhul-Nun (King or lord of the Fish) relates closely to the NWN which is the "Egyptian" primordial waters hence the code pun of FISH for Nun? http://people.tribe.net/astrid_seftali/blog/feb3da4a-3d59-4b31-a473-874b3ec0e28e The further we study the more we will notice how things start slowly drifting back to their beginnings. As I've said everything has a history. There is even a history to numbers and the philosophies they carry. The masters of Mathematics and related subjects "Africans"' knew no such thing as ZERO as a conceptual or philosophical notion. This non-number however became the basis of a deep civilizational rift because of its implications when extended to the realm of reality, which is exactly what the younger civilizations ie greek, roman, semitic civilizations have and are doing. Its ultimate consequence is that the cosmogony which incorporates the notion of NOTHING/0 will inevitably reduce reality to this end point. This explains the destructiveness we witness from those cultures and those impacted by them. Where as in older indigenous cultures everything is full and so the cosmogony that incorporates the notion of fullness will work perpetually toward balancing between cause and effect etc. Things don't just disappear into nothing they simply change form and impact things on other levels that still impact everything. Thus they build and attempt to live in harmony with the universe. We can observe the causes for the adoption of these paradigms based on environmental circumstances. Areas that were bereft of vegetation and food sources tended to lean toward the notion of nothing and emptiness. While areas that were lush and had abundant resources were inclined to maintain the sense of plenty and perpetual growth. Now pull out a map and look at which areas different groups inhabit keep very ancient history in mind. With that will notice that many regions of "Africa" that are now desert were lush lands and that all of Arabia was part of that land. But as environments changed and cultures shifted new invading peoples adopted cultural paradigms relative to environmental changes. Mohammad was a culmination of these adaptations and influences remnant in the neighboring areas and in the "Arabian" land itself. Ib-Ra-Hima


Name:
Subject:
Date: Friday May 29, 2009
Time: 09:55:30 -0400

Comment

"Areas that were bereft of vegetation and food sources tended to lean toward the notion of nothing and emptiness. While areas that were lush and had abundant resources were inclined to maintain the sense of plenty and perpetual growth." The area that invented zero India is STILL lush and has abundant resources, knocking your theory into pieces. Besides zero probably created everything http://www.shankaranarayanan.com/freedom-for-blasphemy-and-apostasy/other-thoughts.html#zero Without zero you can't even have computers and internet to rubbish zero. Can you imagine a computer based on I and II rather than 0 and 1? duh? By the way, are you a black racist like mugabe? Agreed we all had black ancestors but that doesn't mean not being black is bad!


Name: Ib-Ra-Hima
Subject:
Date: Friday May 29, 2009
Time: 12:53:21 -0400

Comment

Peace to you! I'm not sure you read my rather lengthy post or if in reading it you missed the fact that I was adding to the number of cultures Islam has pillaged its practices from. In that attempt, which I deem as such since you apparently came away with a totally different impression, I stated that the numbering system that we now use in the western world that are called arabic numerals is a misnomer and that they are really Hindi/Indian numerals easily found in wiki. Zero, if you have a chance to check out what is offered on wiki or other resources for example: "The Indian writer Pingala (c. 200 BC) developed advanced mathematical concepts for describing prosody, and in doing so presented the first known description of a binary numeral system. Similar sets of binary combinations have also been used in traditional African divination systems such as Ifá as well as in medieval Western geomancy. The base-2 system utilized in geomancy had long been widely applied in sub-Saharan Africa." This is a quote from wiki but the general theme asserted in the info presented Zero as a place holder for the sake of calculation and notation. I refer to it however in the sense of a philosophical and conceptual context as applied to our existential reality. I hope you get that now that I have made the distinction. There is no such thing as nothing. "In 498 CE, Indian mathematician and astronomer Aryabhata stated that "Sthanam sthanam dasa gunam" or place to place in ten times in value, which may be the origin of the modern decimal-based place value notation. The oldest known text to use a decimal place-value system, including a zero, is the Jain text from India entitled the Lokavibhâga, dated 458 CE. This text uses Sanskrit numeral words for the digits, with words such as the Sanskrit word for void for zero.[18] The first known use of special glyphs for the decimal digits that includes the indubitable appearance of a symbol for the digit zero, a small circle, appears on a stone inscription found at the Chaturbhuja Temple at Gwalior in India, dated 876 CE.[19][20] There are many documents on copper plates, with the same small o in them, dated back as far as the sixth century CE, but their authenticity may be doubted." So when that non-numerical and notational place holder was adapted to the cultural cosmogony of some people and their resultant paradigm, they introduced the notion of an empty void somewhere in existence. Which is really an imagined empty void for the sake of computational expedience. We know that there is no such thing... RIGHT? As far as computers, and the process of digitization the ZERO is again an imaginary place filler. Everything in the manifested universe is subject to the laws of correspondence and opposites etc. We can only use the imagined notion of nothing relative to a very specific set of conditions. Music for example can only be appreciated because of the sequence of sounds and the absence of sounds relative to the piece being orchestrated. The heart beat, resperatory systems, day and night etc all variations on the same idea of 1/0 but is that resting phase or absence of activity mean NOTHING? Anyway on to "RACE". Here is some history from the indigenous world you may not know about. When Plato and others came to "Egypt" along with many others from around the world to study the "mysteries" were "Blacks" racist? I don't think so. But we must still call a cat a cat and say that the oldest group of people on the planet were the first to see the sun, the stars, and the environment into which we would later spread and adapt. That being said we can not ignore the knowledge based on sheer experience that such a group still preserves within their original culture. Other groups respected this reality and acknowledged the authenticity and wisdom of such an ancient people, not because of age but because of the knowledge they were able to gather, by way of experience, and preserve for all humanity. So in admiration and respect as well as to acknowledge the source of all human existence they recognized their original Deities as Black and even came to their lands to study and be initiated. This is just historical fact not me saying this, in the "modern" age of "RACISM" and all the other hateful and discriminatory practices. Do your research for yourself and you will see. It seems we have been reduced to projecting our warped modern schisms onto the past in which all people knew where the source culture was and acknowledged it readily with no sense of inferiority or visa verse. That's like a person's eldest sibling saying they are older than their younger or youngest sibling because he/she came first and the younger/youngest sibling feeling slighted because the eldest sibling just stated a fact in saying he/she came first. Its a ridiculous notion, but if we are approaching it with the cultural baggage of the modern "race" climate, that fact of stating 'I'm just the eldest brother', can be perceived to be pejorative. I don't believe I made such a statement or inferred this in anyway. I was simply stating the fact which can be found anywhere one researches ancient Deities and their origins. Only an inferiority complex would make the stated fact a perceived insult and be taken offensively, that's if we are to be honest. One love! Ib-Ra-Hima P.S. Did anyone have any thoughts on ALL the other stuff I mentioned?


Name: Proud_Kafir7908
Subject:
Date: Sunday May 31, 2009
Time: 06:50:20 -0400

Comment

“The stone, when one kisses it, has a softness and freshness, which delights the mouth; so much so that he who places his lips upon it wishes never to remove them”. Freshness??? In the 110-plus degree Fahrenheit temperatures that blast the Arabian Peninsula? Mahoundians sure have a way of getting everything twisted and wrong.


 
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